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  #61 (permalink)  
Old 05-25-2008, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by submarinepainter View Post
That makes what OBL did right?
Of course not.

But how does it make what we did right?
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  #62 (permalink)  
Old 05-25-2008, 09:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Sunni Man View Post
Osama Bin Laden has shown the oppressed people of the world that the West can be brought to account by even one man for it's aggressive policies and support of brutal dictators.
Based on your comments it is obvious we missed at least one in our bombing to start the war. Bringing us to account, how?
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  #63 (permalink)  
Old 05-25-2008, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by submarinepainter View Post
That makes what OBL did right?
I am a Vietnam Era Vet.

So I learned the lesson the hard way. You cannot support brutal dictators and expect the people just to sit there forever and take it. Eventually, they will strike back with whatever they have at the source of their misery.
The U.S. supplies weapons and money to all kinds of evil dictators. While at the same time, talking about spreading Democracy. No wonder they Hate America.

Also, we are trying to nation build in Iraq just like we did in Vietnam. The people Hate the puppet government we have illegally installed.

All people want to control their own destiny.

Wouldn't we Americans fight with everything we had if we were invaded and a puppet government was installed?
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Old 05-25-2008, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Sunni Man View Post
I am a Vietnam Era Vet.

So I learned the lesson the hard way. You cannot support brutal dictators and expect the people just to sit there forever and take it. Eventually, they will strike back with whatever they have at the source of their misery.
The U.S. supplies weapons and money to all kinds of evil dictators. While at the same time, talking about spreading Democracy. No wonder they Hate America.

Also, we are trying to nation build in Iraq just like we did in Vietnam. The people Hate the puppet government we have illegally installed.

All people want to control their own destiny.

Wouldn't we Americans fight with everything we had if we were invaded and a puppet government was installed?
Iraq is not a puppet government like the South Vietnamese one was. They are a democratic government run by their own people, in their own interests. Ngo Dihm Diem or whoever it was was a brutal oppressive dictator, just like you said, and he was killed by his own people. The Iraqis control their destiny, they just want us to help.
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  #65 (permalink)  
Old 05-25-2008, 09:57 AM
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I have never said the US hasn't made mistakes , I believe we are basically good .Look at the good things we do , if the world wants us out of everyone's business I think it would have to be all the way out then , let the 3rd world ingrates suffer after every big disaster, I get sick and tired of the world saying how bad we are and I really can't stand AMERICANS who hate their own.
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  #66 (permalink)  
Old 05-25-2008, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by White Fox View Post
Iraq is not a puppet government like the South Vietnamese one was. They are a democratic government run by their own people, in their own interests. Ngo Dihm Diem or whoever it was was a brutal oppressive dictator, just like you said, and he was killed by his own people. The Iraqis control their destiny, they just want us to help.
I disagree

A puppet government, is a puppet government.

For the last 5 years, I have heard the exact same rhetoric from our leaders and the news as during Vietnam. (we also had the Vietnam puppet government tell us that they wanted America there)

When we got out of Vietnam. The people decided their own fate. Now they are politically stable and the economy is good.

What does that tell you?
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Old 05-25-2008, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by MasTequila View Post
Based on your comments it is obvious we missed at least one in our bombing to start the war. Bringing us to account, how?
Maybe because I live in Texas???
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Old 05-25-2008, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunni Man View Post
I am a Vietnam Era Vet.

So I learned the lesson the hard way. You cannot support brutal dictators and expect the people just to sit there forever and take it. Eventually, they will strike back with whatever they have at the source of their misery.
The U.S. supplies weapons and money to all kinds of evil dictators. While at the same time, talking about spreading Democracy. No wonder they Hate America.

Also, we are trying to nation build in Iraq just like we did in Vietnam. The people Hate the puppet government we have illegally installed.

All people want to control their own destiny.

Wouldn't we Americans fight with everything we had if we were invaded and a puppet government was installed?

I agree. I remember Vietnam all too well.
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Old 05-25-2008, 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by White Fox View Post
Iraq is not a puppet government like the South Vietnamese one was. They are a democratic government run by their own people, in their own interests. Ngo Dihm Diem or whoever it was was a brutal oppressive dictator, just like you said, and he was killed by his own people. The Iraqis control their destiny, they just want us to help.
Iraq is a failed state, an occupied country on the verge of a civil war. How quickly you forget that we supported Saddam before we went to war with him.

Even though we knew he was a brutal dictator we considered "use of chemical weapons aside, the goals of Saddam Hussein and Iraq are roughly the same as those of the United States".

(the source of the quote is a state department memo when Iraq was our ally and Iran our enemy)
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  #70 (permalink)  
Old 05-25-2008, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Sunni Man View Post
I disagree

A puppet government, is a puppet government.
A puppet government implies that another power is "pulling the strings" behind another government. The Iraqi government is free to oppose us in both their rhetoric and in their actions, and some do. Most however, support our involvement in keeping their country stable and relatively peaceful.

Quote:
For the last 5 years, I have heard the exact same rhetoric from our leaders and the news as during Vietnam. (we also had the Vietnam puppet government tell us that they wanted America there)
There is a very fundamental difference between what happened in Vietnam and what is happening in Iraq. Vietnam was truly an unending war. There could be no peace, there could be no victory, there could be no settlement. The reason of course, was the influence of the Soviet Union. Had we pushed for victory, nuclear war would have broken out, and everyone would be a loser. We could not have a peace because the North Vietnamese, supported by the USSR, would not agree to have two Vietnams, and they would have continued to fight. Nothing could satisfy them except for us to give up our mission of protecting the South.

The Vietnamese was a puppet government, and did not have the support of its people. The Iraqi government is different.

Quote:
When we got out of Vietnam. The people decided their own fate. Now they are politically stable and the economy is good. What does that tell you?
They also suffered Communist oppression and thousands of deaths. Not everyone there wanted this. What right does a majority have to kill a minority.
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