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Old 04-01-2007, 01:59 PM
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Default Bible Party of the USA

www.biblepartyusa.org

Check it out and take your shots.
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Old 04-01-2007, 02:11 PM
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i like statement 4.1
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Old 04-02-2007, 06:23 AM
apotropoxy apotropoxy is offline
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Default Inerrancy?

Will your Bible Party use:
  • the standard Protestant collection of books

    the current Roman Catholic collection

    stick with the established Jewish scriptures?
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Old 04-02-2007, 08:06 AM
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I suppose this party isn't for me since I am not a Christian or a Jew...
And interestingly enough, this party does not list the principles, even basic, of the documents which it takes its values from. How exclusive and elitist.
There is no way a party can gain support with that kind of attitude. If I have to be familiar with the principles or they won't even spell them out for me...
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Old 04-02-2007, 08:29 AM
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Default Pope Sherlock

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by JavaBlack";p=&quot View Post
I suppose this party isn't for me since I am not a Christian or a Jew...
And interestingly enough, this party does not list the principles, even basic, of the documents which it takes its values from. How exclusive and elitist.
There is no way a party can gain support with that kind of attitude. If I have to be familiar with the principles or they won't even spell them out for me...
There is an historical consistency at play.
Christianity started out as a Roman mystery cult and many of its central teachings today are proudly called mysteries.
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Old 04-02-2007, 10:42 AM
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Don't expect me to vote for you. Avowedly religious parties just leave me cold. They're so convinced of their inerrancy that they have a hard time admitting adverse consequences or adjusting course in the face of changing circumstances.

I note that the Bible used is the CSB, which is a conservative evangelical version and thus indicative of the minds behind the party. In particular, they believe in biblical inerrancy.

The first page quotes Washington's 1789 Thanksgiving proclamation, which is interesting because it is one of the few times Washington invoked God in any official matter, and he never invoked Jesus. There is much to suggest that Washington was a deist, which would presumably drive your party's founders bonkers.

I just flat disagree with much of the rest. The Bible is not the foundation of this country; the antireligious Enlightenment is. I disagree with 4.3; the Bible is not a necessity for a functioning democracy. Witness India, for example, or the largely agnostic Scandinavian states.

It attempts to equate "creator" with "God" in our founding documents, a distinction that doesn't quite agree with the use of those terms in the context of the time. References to a "creator" or "providence" tended to be explicitly NOT references to a Christian God.

5.1.2 appears to be a license to ignore the law in favor of "higher principles." Notably, given the detailed litmus test in 5.3.1, it appears to be explicitly advocating using the levers of government to preach Christianity/Judaism (see points 10 and 53), using censorship if necessary (points 11,12,26,53,54,55,56,57,5. It also seems to assert knowledge of the mind of God (17, 1, support religious and national propoganda in schools (27, 2, outlaw premarital sex (30,34), declare homsexuality a choice (33) and outlaw "transgender" actions (34).

On the plus side, they support fair and sufficient wages for everyone (39), if only so that one parent can stay home with the kids. At the same time they would ban welfare for the poor (40) while apparently supporting various welfare programs for the middle class (41).

They believe all "ideologies" are religions (51), a category that includes agnosticism, "cosmopolitanism", Darwinism, Deism, "environmentalism", "hedonism", "materialism", "narcissism", "transgenderism" and a whole other long list of isms. Anyone who adheres to any of these beliefs would be banned from the party.

Other favorites:

8.2.1.2. All party officers or candidates must be married.

8.2.1.4.4. Obsessive interest in, and coerced authority over, members' private lives.

8.4.1. Party charter cannot be changed until the membership exceeds 35 million. Changing the "Beliefs" section requires unanimous approval; changing any other section requires 95% approval. All such votes cannot last longer than 16 hours.

There are plenty of noncontroversial sections, like the ones basically requiring you to be a good and humble person. But much is, to me, nonsense.
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Old 04-03-2007, 03:07 PM
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Default www.biblepartyusa.org

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Originally Posted by GovernmentCheese";p=&quot View Post
i like statement 4.1
Thanks
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Old 04-03-2007, 03:08 PM
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Default Which Scriptures?

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Originally Posted by apotropoxy";p=&quot View Post
Will your Bible Party use:
  • the standard Protestant collection of books

    the current Roman Catholic collection

    stick with the established Jewish scriptures?
Read Appendix A
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Old 04-03-2007, 03:14 PM
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Default Source?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JavaBlack";p=&quot View Post
I suppose this party isn't for me since I am not a Christian or a Jew...
And interestingly enough, this party does not list the principles, even basic, of the documents which it takes its values from. How exclusive and elitist.
There is no way a party can gain support with that kind of attitude. If I have to be familiar with the principles or they won't even spell them out for me...
Sorry, you are correct. If you are not a Christian or Jew, then this party would not be for you.

It doesn't seem that you read the Charter. It specifies the exact source of the values.

It isn't exclusive or elitist. Anyone can be a Christian if they choose to acknowledge their sins, accept Christ Jesus as their redeemer, and repent. That is the purpose of Christianity.

Again, sorry. This party is not for lazy people. It will require members to work at maintaining their knowledge and integrity.
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Old 04-03-2007, 03:22 PM
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Default You don't like it. Golly Gee!

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Originally Posted by raytri";p=&quot View Post
Don't expect me to vote for you. Avowedly religious parties just leave me cold. They're so convinced of their inerrancy that they have a hard time admitting adverse consequences or adjusting course in the face of changing circumstances.

I note that the Bible used is the CSB, which is a conservative evangelical version and thus indicative of the minds behind the party. In particular, they believe in biblical inerrancy.

The first page quotes Washington's 1789 Thanksgiving proclamation, which is interesting because it is one of the few times Washington invoked God in any official matter, and he never invoked Jesus. There is much to suggest that Washington was a deist, which would presumably drive your party's founders bonkers.

I just flat disagree with much of the rest. The Bible is not the foundation of this country; the antireligious Enlightenment is. I disagree with 4.3; the Bible is not a necessity for a functioning democracy. Witness India, for example, or the largely agnostic Scandinavian states.

It attempts to equate "creator" with "God" in our founding documents, a distinction that doesn't quite agree with the use of those terms in the context of the time. References to a "creator" or "providence" tended to be explicitly NOT references to a Christian God.

5.1.2 appears to be a license to ignore the law in favor of "higher principles." Notably, given the detailed litmus test in 5.3.1, it appears to be explicitly advocating using the levers of government to preach Christianity/Judaism (see points 10 and 53), using censorship if necessary (points 11,12,26,53,54,55,56,57,5. It also seems to assert knowledge of the mind of God (17, 1, support religious and national propoganda in schools (27, 2, outlaw premarital sex (30,34), declare homsexuality a choice (33) and outlaw "transgender" actions (34).

On the plus side, they support fair and sufficient wages for everyone (39), if only so that one parent can stay home with the kids. At the same time they would ban welfare for the poor (40) while apparently supporting various welfare programs for the middle class (41).

They believe all "ideologies" are religions (51), a category that includes agnosticism, "cosmopolitanism", Darwinism, Deism, "environmentalism", "hedonism", "materialism", "narcissism", "transgenderism" and a whole other long list of isms. Anyone who adheres to any of these beliefs would be banned from the party.

Other favorites:

8.2.1.2. All party officers or candidates must be married.

8.2.1.4.4. Obsessive interest in, and coerced authority over, members' private lives.

8.4.1. Party charter cannot be changed until the membership exceeds 35 million. Changing the "Beliefs" section requires unanimous approval; changing any other section requires 95% approval. All such votes cannot last longer than 16 hours.

There are plenty of noncontroversial sections, like the ones basically requiring you to be a good and humble person. But much is, to me, nonsense.
You are partially observant. The Bible version used is the Holman Christian Standard (HCSB), not the CSB. The HCSB does remain faithful to the original scriptures and does not attempt to change God's Word to meet someone's political agenda or to justify individual desires.

Much of the rest of your post is just unscholarly and downright inaccurate.

You don't have to agree. Have a nice day.
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