Political Forum
     

Go Back   Political Forum > Politics by Region > United States


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #51 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2008, 11:56 AM
BuckNaked BuckNaked is offline
Guru
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,651
usa us texas
BuckNaked has a brilliant futureBuckNaked has a brilliant futureBuckNaked has a brilliant futureBuckNaked has a brilliant futureBuckNaked has a brilliant futureBuckNaked has a brilliant futureBuckNaked has a brilliant futureBuckNaked has a brilliant futureBuckNaked has a brilliant futureBuckNaked has a brilliant futureBuckNaked has a brilliant future
Credits: 28,230
Default

First off;

An affidavit is a formal sworn statement of fact, signed by the declarant (who is called the affiant or deponent) and witnessed (as to the veracity of the affiant's signature) by a taker of oaths, such as a court officer or a notary public.

So technically it is a fact according to the person who gives it, or the truth as they know it at the time of the declaration. In all actuality, the truth could be challenged/unconfirmed under cross-examination, or with the introduction of other sworn testimony by a more knowledgeable individual who is even more familiar with the evidence that is being presented.

Without corroboration an affidavitt is not the truth/fact, it is only the truth as the individual making the statement knows it too be.

In American jurisprudence, under the rules for hearsay, admission of an unsupported affidavit as evidence is unusual especially if the individual declaring the statement is not available for cross-examination with regard to material facts. Affidavits from persons who are dead or otherwise incapacitated, or who cannot be located or made to appear may be accepted by the court, but once again usually only in the presence of corroborating evidence.

I will say I am intrigued with the statement that he provided a bogus sample for testing to the FBI, which does not match the actual strain it was presented as. Now if this could be corroborated, with the actual dated documents, the test results and signatures dated and confirmed showing that he did indeed attempt to deceive the FBI much of the circumstantial evidence would indeed be (*)(*)(*)(*)ing to the wacko doctors admission of guilt.

But there is plenty of reasons to be suspicious of the FBI, the gov’t and/or the establishment, whomever they may be. But the commentary below says it all.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/06/AR2008080602834.html

Quote:
Such evidence, even when seemingly overwhelming and conclusive, is the very sort of circumstantial argument that pegged Richard Jewell as the Atlanta bomber, that linked Oregon attorney Brandon Mayfield to the Madrid bombings, that fingered Los Alamos scientist Wen Ho Lee as a spy, and that cast biodefense expert Steven Hatfill as the original anthrax suspect. In each of those investigations, the news media were largely complicit, conveying incriminating details of the government's case as if they were the gospel.
And yet, in each of those cases, the government was wrong -- shaking public confidence even as it eroded individual civil liberties, produced groundless prosecutions and diverted precious time and resources in pursuit of bogus cases.

His death deprives the Justice Department, the press and the public of the one thing that was most needed: a full-dress trial. That would have been the surest way to begin to remove the taint of suspicion and corruption that has attended the handling of the anthrax investigation and others like it. No matter how strong the evidence presented by the Justice Department -- and at first blush, it appears (*)(*)(*)(*)ing -- it is an ex parte presentation and will never be subject to the scrutiny and challenge of the other side.

The anthrax case was particularly toxic to the integrity of prosecutorial standards and judicial process, a process warped by post-Sept. 11 hysteria and a compulsion to cut corners and try individuals in the court of public opinion. It was this investigation that presented the spectacle of then-U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft declaring Hatfill a "person of interest" -- reflecting insufficient evidence to charge him with a crime, but enough suspicion to condemn him to the status of public pariah. (Among other evidence, dogs had sniffed him out.) In June, the government agreed to a settlement with Hatfill valued at $5.8 million. Neither it nor the press, which was only too eager to link arms with the Justice Department in carrying the stories that stripped Hatfill of everything he had, has offered an apology or conceded wrongdoing.

Against this background, who could be blamed for imagining that an innocent Ivins was hounded to his death? Can we discount the accounts that suggest the government repeatedly harassed Ivins's family, offering his son a reward and sports car if he would turn his father in?

The antidote to our skepticism is not a de facto conviction -- especially one that is posthumous and undefended. If Ivins was indeed responsible for those harrowing attacks, it is good that he no longer poses a threat. But how will we know?
This is actually a bad thing for the government because this case will now be tried in the court of public opinion and not a court of law.


The other hair raising fact is that if this unstable, babbling, incoherent at times, wacka-doodle scientist was working with/among the FBI on regular basis, and always seemed to just skid under the radar until the case crumbled lately against the other innocent scientist. How does someone with a long history of homicidal threats remain employed in such a position? You might think this nothing but it sure seems grounds for scrutiny of those gathering important evidence...

About the freeze dryer from your source;

Quote:
Ivins also had access to a sophisticated freeze-dryer, which could have been used to turn the wet bacteria into a dry form. Ivins' co-worker Jeff Adamovicz says he remembers the unit, called a lyopholizer, in the hallway and says it was used to dry protein samples for vaccine work. Adamovicz said the dryer was signed out to Ivins. Adamovicz remembers FBI agents testing the dryer, but they never hauled it away, a sign that it most likely came up clean. (BUT) An additional (KEY) piece of equipment would also have been required (never found) to mill the dried spores into a powdered form.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=93426239

Quote:
Paul Kemp who was Ivins' attorney. Response to charges;

Evidence, the flask,

RESPONSE: Kemp says (should be easy enough to prove) the University of New Mexico and a Battelle lab in Ohio had received portions of the anthrax in the flask. "There are dozens ... if not hundreds, of scientists, contractors, students, professors, who used that same anthrax — the very anthrax that would have the same genetic component" as the flask Ivins had, Kemp says.

Evedence, the samples he provided;

RESPONSE: Ivins' lawyer says there was confusion about what kind of sample the FBI had wanted — a "pure" sample or one that captured the mix of spores in the flask. Kemp says Ivins submitted a pure sample at first.

Evedence, envelopes;

RESPONSE: These are "post offices that service the entire width of the state of Maryland and then the biggest post office in the state of Virginia," Kemp says. He says there is no evidence that Ivins ever purchased any of those envelopes.

Evidence, long work hours;

RESPONSE: Kemp says the hours were "characteristic of [Ivins'] long-term work patterns" and that Ivins continued to work long hours through the end of 2001.

Evidence, the sorority house;

RESPONSE: "Where is a witness that can put him in New Jersey?" Kemp asks. Ivins' lawyer says his client never hid his interest in the sorority from investigators. Kemp adds that the office near the mailbox is not a sorority house where students actually live.

The governments case;

RESPONSE: "It is nothing but speculation, the government's case," Kemp says. "We don't convict people on the idea that they demonstrate eccentric behavior, or that they had the opportunity to commit a crime, or the knowledge to commit a crime, and that's what the government's saying."
So once again I say, It’s very possible that he could be the guilty party and if he is Amen! But if he isn’t…
__________________
There are only two things wrong with this great nation of ours, democrats and republicans!

Not necessarily in that order.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Red Cross - Donate Today    Save the Rainforest
  #52 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2008, 06:15 AM
justabubba's Avatar
justabubba justabubba is offline
Guru
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,233
us north carolina
justabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond reputejustabubba has a reputation beyond repute
Credits: 36,999
Default curiouser and curiouser

more questions than answers are emerging from this "suicide". emphasis below is not original
Quote:
Contrary to initial reports, Bruce Ivins did give investigators a sample of the anthrax the FBI has identified as the same type used in the attacks, but they destroyed it because it didn't meet their standards for evidence. ...

Two weeks ago, the Justice Department named Ivins as its sole suspect in the mailings, which killed five people and left 17 others hospitalized. Ivins' attorney has maintained Ivin's innocence. The noted scientist committed suicide on July 29, just before media reports revealed investigators were preparing to indict him for the mailings.
In documents released Aug. 6, the Justice Department stated that Ivins had failed to cooperate with investigators as they gathered samples of anthrax from labs for comparison with that used in the mailings, and cited that as one factor behind its naming him as a suspect. Investigators have said they have a strong circumstantial case against Ivins, but have conceded they have no hard evidence linking him to the crime.
Ivins submitted two sets of samples to the FBI. The first, sent in February 2002, did not meet the standards the FBI had set for a library of samples it was building, said Vahid Majidi, assistant director of the FBI's Weapons of Mass Destruction Directorate. The FBI destroyed that sample and Ivins submitted another set in April 2002.
Ivins' first sample would have been scientifically valid but difficult to use as evidence in court because it was gathered in a different manner than the other samples in the library, said an FBI scientist who refused to identify himself at the briefing.
Over the next few years, researchers at the National Biodefense Forensic Analysis Center, The Institute for Genomic Research and elsewhere worked to sequence the genome of the anthrax used in the attacks, and identified four mutations in that strain. They developed tests for those mutations, which they could then apply to samples from the FBI repository in an attempt to identify the source of the anthrax from the mailings.
The profile they created matched RMR-1029, a batch of anthrax under Ivins' control, but Ivins' second samples did not match that profile.
Although the scientists could not conclusively link RMR-1029 to the mailings until early 2007, by 2004, tests pointed to the U.S. Army Medical Research Institute of Infectious Diseases at Fort Detrick as the source of the spores.
In 2006, investigators went to Dr. Paul Keim, a Northern Arizona University biology professor who had been helping them identify the anthrax, and Keim gave them duplicates of all the anthrax samples, the unnamed FBI scientist said. Keim had kept his copy of Ivins' February 2002 sample, and testing identified it as RMR-1029.
Chris Hassell, head of the FBI laboratory, said he couldn't explain why Ivins would submit one sample of anthrax matching RMR-1029, then later submit a sample that did not match.
Out of 1,070 samples gathered, eight matched the powder used in the mailings, Majidi said. All of them were from RMR-1029 or its descendant.
More than 100 people at two labs -- USAMRIID and a lab officials refused to identify -- had access to RMR-1029, Majidi said. Officials did not explain how they eliminated those other people from their investigation.
... More than 60 researchers worked on the project. It was subjected to critical analysis within that group, but has not been reviewed in the wider scientific community, Majidi said.
"Were we perfect?" Majidi asked. "Absolutely not ... we had missteps."
But the community learned lessons it can take forward, he said.
Dr. James Burans, associate lab director of the Department of Homeland Security's National Biodefense Forensic Analysis Center, said the anthrax powder used in the mailings could have been produced by one person in three to seven days.
Lab workers generally avoid making or working with powder because it is more dangerous than liquid preparations, he said.
Officials declined to give specifics of how the anthrax powder used in the mailings would be prepared, but Majidi said researchers at Fort Detrick had the necessary equipment. "It would have been easy to make these samples at (USAMRIID)," he said.
http://www.fredericknewspost.com/sec...?storyID=78992
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ivins Held Patents On Anthrax Vaccine SweetnessBlog Political Blogs 1 08-02-2008 11:28 AM
7 years later, no answers on anthrax attacks Joe1991 United States 8 08-01-2008 03:53 PM
Anthrax, Zionists and innocent Egyptians Catholic Political Opinions & Beliefs 8 10-16-2005 01:22 PM
Anthrax Investigation??? JP5 Terrorism 6 07-21-2005 08:16 PM
Anthrax Investigation? JP5 Current Events 0 06-14-2005 04:00 PM

Sponsored Links

All times are GMT -8. The time now is 12:54 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0
Template-Modifikationen durch TMS
vBCredits v1.3 ©2007 by Darkwaltz4
Advertisement System V2.1 By   Branden