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Old 03-10-2008, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by constitution101 View Post
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_denial
Look under Laws against denial of Holocaust. It is illiegal in Germany to deny the Holocaust. Why would German schools go into detail over Holocaust, American schools dont go into deep detail over the massacures of Indian tribes, forcing them to move hundreds of miles from their homelands. Besides countries usually do not push into their youth's minds how they have erred in the past, otherwise the population would drop to 0.
Oh no, you've got that wrong - the opposite is the case: The Nazi regime and the Holocaust are huge topics in German History classes - they actually talk about this over and over again plus there are school trips scheduled to visit former concentration camps or museums.
It's not allowed to openly deny what happend, that's why a handful of conspiricy fanatists feel like someone is hiding something from them. I don't think, this restriction on the freedom of speech is very helpful, I'm with the Freedom Forum on that one "The antidote to distasteful or hateful speech is not censorship, but more speech."
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Old 03-10-2008, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Herr Politik View Post
As a German and Berliner, I have traveled to Amerika several times. I was supprised that so many do not know the difference between a german and a NAZI. Not all germans supported Hitler and very few the Holocaust, I am sick of this ignorant racism towards an innocent people. How do you feel?
(sorry if my English is not good)

I'm Italian and I can understand You very well. A lot of people think the same thing about Italy and Fascism. Moreover, only few people know that before the Italian racial law of 1938 Mussolini and the Fascism wasn't racists, but to acquire the friendship of Hitler Mussolini retreat some ideals. In Italy were a lot of Fascist Jewish that were deportated after the racials laws.

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Old 03-10-2008, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Shallow View Post
Oh no, you've got that wrong - the opposite is the case: The Nazi regime and the Holocaust are huge topics in German History classes - they actually talk about this over and over again plus there are school trips scheduled to visit former concentration camps or museums.
Is this the same in all German schools? I knew a few foreign exchange students back in high school who told me WWII history was not mentioned as much as it should be in the schools. Is it taught certain years and not others, perhaps they just hadn't taken this class yet. Your thoughts?
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Old 03-10-2008, 07:21 PM
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Is this the same in all German schools? I knew a few foreign exchange students back in high school who told me WWII history was not mentioned as much as it should be in the schools. Is it taught certain years and not others, perhaps they just hadn't taken this class yet. Your thoughts?
I guess they've all been to college preparatory high school (="Gymnasium" - dang, our school system is kinda hard to explain ). There, you deal with the Nazi regime every once in a while (starting somewhere around 6th grade), but it's the focal point of the History class throughout the whole 10th grade. In 12th or 13th grade it gets mentioned again in a rather profound way. They must've been in 11th grade when they came abroad, the classes aren't flexible until 11th grade, so they should have heard it right before they came over... Besides that, this is just the curriculum of the History class. It's mentioned in German class and in Religious Education as well...
I don't know what went wrong at their school, they were probably just pretending, for whatever reason. Probably feared to be asked for a presentation or something.
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Old 03-11-2008, 06:12 AM
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Oh no, you've got that wrong - the opposite is the case: The Nazi regime and the Holocaust are huge topics in German History classes - they actually talk about this over and over again plus there are school trips scheduled to visit former concentration camps or museums.
The Japanese are exactly the opposite from what I've heard...they completely gloss over their role in WWII.

So yeah, I think the Germans deserve some credit for taking responsibility for the actions of the Nazis. Despite the fact that they have many stupid and short sighted laws.



Quote:
It's not allowed to openly deny what happend
Case in point. They cant possibly be that naive.

By forbidding people to hold a certain opinion, you only make that opinion stronger. Because now you are building a mystique around it that (naturally rebellious) young people will find very attractive.

The US has no laws against any ideology...no matter how vile. Yet we do not have the problems Europe has (and had) regarding race. Public opinion does what no law can do. Racists have been completely eviscerated in our society. They've become parodies of themselves. THATS what free speech gets you in the long run.
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Old 03-11-2008, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Sadistic-Savior View Post
Case in point. They cant possibly be that naive.

By forbidding people to hold a certain opinion, you only make that opinion stronger. Because now you are building a mystique around it that (naturally rebellious) young people will find very attractive.

The US has no laws against any ideology...no matter how vile. Yet we do not have the problems Europe has (and had) regarding race. Public opinion does what no law can do. Racists have been completely eviscerated in our society. They've become parodies of themselves. THATS what free speech gets you in the long run.
There's nothing left to add!
Oh well, probably one thing : That is exactly the reason why American Forums are sometimes flooded with Europeans/Germans denying the Holocaust, they feel like they need to express their views somewhere and they aren't allowed to do it at home.
Keep that in mind when you run into em, it's definitly not a very common view over here - as a matter of fact it's a very tiny minority.
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Old 03-11-2008, 04:25 PM
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I went to Germany last summer and visited a concentration camp, the tour guide said that German school children are required to visit a concentration camp, so they do teach about it in schools. I was actually shocked at how friendly Germans were, because the stereotypical German is usually stern. I did encounter some anti-americanism, which is to be expected though.
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Old 03-12-2008, 06:22 AM
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Ironically, most of their criticism of us is because they see us as too far right.
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Old 03-17-2008, 11:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by constitution101 View Post
Besides countries usually do not push into their youth's minds how they have erred in the past, otherwise the population would drop to 0.

But we have neither a government nor a country, we are a kind of occupied colony rule by an occupation regime!
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Old 03-18-2008, 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Skeptikos Examiner View Post
But we have neither a government nor a country, we are a kind of occupied colony rule by an occupation regime!
You mean Prussia? At least if you say you're Prussian the same people who equate Germans and Nazi's will think you come from somewhere near the Ukraine.

I also get the feeling most Americans don't equate Germans and Nazis. Though I suppose they might be quick to throw the label around to be mean (especially on forums like this if you're arguing with them).

Personally I think the way Germany has delt with WWII and the holocaust is a model of how other countries should deal with similar things. You acknowledge it, don't gloss over it, but don't let it paralyze you and you return to the world stage.
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