The Attempt to Establish a Climate Ministry of Truth

That was Bush's job. He didn't have to show that he was right. He didn't have to convince the UN.

He could take us to war. But, he had no power over the world of climatology.

No, that's just not true. Climatology can't be changed by a faked temperature record. There are NUMEROUS ways of measuring Earth's temperature. And, there are know factors affecting temperature - solar output, etc. Any faked record would just look stupid. And, it would end the career of any scientist with their name on it.

I've read the Perkins book. And that had NOTHING AT ALL to do with science.

None of these describe how world wide science can be corrupted in a particular way by a specific amount.

 

You have yet to back your assertions which are for the most part bogus arguments which is why you are getting the replies like they are.

I tried to point out how well Dr. Mass forecasted and covered the heatwave, you were dismissive of him in replies which indicate you are not here to develop a meaningful discussion.

Only bogus thinkers publish bogus arguments.......

 

Abraham Lincoln was not only our greatest President. He has also been called our only political saint. I think that's fair.

 

As noted by others, the opposition need not be organized to be effective. Mobs are not organized but are often effective.

 

That is because the deaths of over 630,000 means nothing to the democrats historians that whitewash the crimes of Lincoln.

 

The goal was not to teach accurate history. The goal was to teach concepts.

The Union General at the First Battle of Bull Run is not a concept. That's a factoid, which is of little to no value.

The civil war is a concept. There's nothing special about the US Civil War given that every country save Australia had one. It's even less special considering the US already had one. It's erroneous called a Revolutionary War, when in reality it was a war of colonial independence, which is a type of civil war like revolutionary wars, separatism, irredentism, nationalism, and colonial independence.

Concepts are important, because once a student masters a concept, they'll use it and apply it the rest of their lives.

What's worse, the students didn't understand that the reason Abolitionists were protesting, and the reason newspapers and newspaper editors were criticizing Lincoln and being thrown in jail without benefit of habeas corpus, is because the war was not about freeing the slaves.

If the war was about freeing the slaves, then Abolitionists would be happy and helping kids enlist in the Union Army instead of helping kids evade the draft.

And, I brought it "home" since Lincoln sent federal troops to put down protests here in Cincinnati. That woke all the kids up. They were asking why Abolitionists who opposed slavery were protesting a war that was supposed to free slaves and why Lincoln sent federal troops here.

Well, because the war wasn't about freeing the slaves. It was about preserving the Union, and more importantly, collecting the tax revenues from the South that bankrolled 90% of the federal government.

 

Climate science throughout the world confirms the vast majority of what the IPCC reports.

That either has to be due to what science has discovered OR due to some STUPENDOUSLY well organized conspiracy.

Mobs are a local phenomenon. Climate change touches all branches of science and covers the Earth, both in science and in government.

 

How charmingly naive...

Sure it can, when that record is the one all the other records use to calibrate their data.

And the best ones -- which you dismiss because they disagree with the fake one -- show that the scare stories are false.

Which AGW propaganda insists on because it mismeasures the influence of solar activity on climate.

That hasn't happened in economics; why would it happen in climatology?

It shows that effective conspiracies can be kept from the public, and don't have to be large to affect the whole world.

Sure they do.

It doesn't have to be by a specific amount, just in a specific direction.

 

Yes, because the vast majority of what the IPCC reports is ordinary science, not anti-fossil-fuel hysteria and scaremongering.

No, it's due to your inability to distinguish between pedestrian science and sensationalist scaremongering.

Tell that to the Danes.

But the mob is nevertheless in play.

 

Those deaths are all to the account of the southern slavocracy traitors and, in particular, Robert E. Lee.

 

The IPCC reports are political documents, asserting claims based on interpretations of scientific research, often with political objectives. They are deeply susceptible to groupthink, peer pressure and motivated reasoning. Please see Searching for the Catastrophe Signal by Bernie Lewin.

 

This is a gross misunderstanding of the measurement of temperature. There are NUMEROUS branches of science that independently measure our temperature today and what the trend is. In fact, each methodology has been used multiple times by various bodies of scientists around Earth.

That can NOT be changed by one measurement.

There are majorly conflicting models of capitalist free market economic theory that are actively in use in the USA and around the world.

That's why every time we discuss taxes or just about any other topic, there are experts on all sides, making all kinds of predictions for various reasons.

Your last sentence is still proposing that there is a world wide conspiracy that includes MOST of the sciences. And, that is just a ludicrous proposition.

 

Yes, it sucks when you can't refute facts in evidence.

 

Yes, it does include ideas related to solutions. And, solutions are ALWAYS in the realm of politics. Politics is where we measure possibility, cost, commitment, etc., etc.

And, there may well be specific issues in the IPCC which aren't totally accurate, as science doesn't have some sort of end where all is known.

But, you don't have anything that could possibly account for world wide agreement that is counter to the truth coming from the scientific community that includes pretty much every discipline of science.

I agree that such effects might be possible at a university, or other single institution. As I pointed out we do see that in economics and other fields. But, they can NOT cause that sort of unity even in the USA, let alone around the world - even though it is ONE FIELD, not all of science.

 

Yes. The IPCC is not scaremongering.

And, you can't point to anything I've said that comes from me and could be considered scaremongering.

"The mob"??? What the heck??

 

Jack Hays, it is just my opinion but you and I agree on almost everything. I see you seldom say things I do not agree with.

So let me sum it up quickly so we can evade a troubled future as posters.
Abe Lincoln did not invade VA with his huge army over slavery.
It was not on his mind. Matter of fact he went out of his way to deny it was over slavery.
Abe as you recall suffered for his crimes. He got assassinated.

To put it simply, had Abe never called up a huge army, that war never would have happened.

 

I know I am not afraid of climate. Are you fearful of climate?

 

Suggesting an assassination was for cause is just absolutely and TOTALLY NOT ACCEPTABLE. It could NOT be more anti-American. You need to take that back or recognize that you are opposed to our fundamental American principles.

The documents of the secession showed Southern states made that move based on slavery and the status of blacks as being subhuman.

There is no possibility of accepting that while also accepting the founding documents of this nation.

I agree that Lincoln was not uniformly motivated by emancipation. He did not hold blacks in equal regard. But, he DID hold America as being of supreme importance.

 

Let me say this about climate.
It is not simply boiled down to temperature.
Were Earth in danger, as the alarmists persist in claiming, the whole of Earth would be cooked.
But we have a growing Antarctic of ice.
Even our deserts are not showing alarming changes to temperature nor long term climate.
We have one example of the hottest ever place on Earth in CA called Death Valley yet it is not getting hotter. it is cooler than it was in 1913. Back when the Auto was merely a dream for a few who had some money in their bank.

 

I would think even the great Jack Hayes can understand those series of facts.

Abe debunked early on it was about slavery, in his own denials.

 

Climate change has the potential of being a national security issue according to the DoD.

Also, the changes projected will be seriously expensive for the USA. One can look at the costs of the Chesapeake Bay program, the costs to NOLA, the arriving costs to NYC, the costs to Miami Beach, the impact on US agriculture, the water shortages arriving in the US Southwest, etc.

We have a level of moral responsibility for addressing issues that have the potential of major harm to those living in other countries, even if we're wealthy enough to write off the increased costs ro our own standard of living.

There is nothing irrational about those concerns. They deserve analysis and consideration.

 

We are discussing a war.
We are not discussing the reasons why states departed the Union.
Abe himself denied he went to war over slaves.

Our nation was founded on open and rebellious open war on the then legitimate government.

 

Ice growing in the Antarctic does not help those living in some other continent.

How hot death valley is has no relevancy here. If you want to recognize the issues of water, agriculture, etc., you need to look somewhere besides a desert!!

 

You mean Democrats are responsible for the fear campaign they wage on our precious nation.

I can't look at costs that you have only mentioned.

 

Death Valley is the leading indicator. And it is cooler.
As is the Antarctic.