90% of the germans are discusted about Putin

Fabien let me go into a bit of history for you. Kiev was the home of the Rus and they became Christians under the Greek Patriarch of Constantinople. When the Mongols entered Russia, the part of Russia which is now Ukraine was taken over by the Polish Lithuanian Empire. When pressure was exerted on them to go under the Latin Pope, the Eastern half of Ukraine revolted, and asked the Tsar if they can reunite with Russia. They are still under the Moscow Patriarch, the other Orthodox Churches in Ukraine are not recognized. The Western part of Ukraine went under the Pope, and this is how they became two different cultures. They are not the same people.

You can no more force the people in the Eastern half who were always a part of Russia to join the E.U., than you can force the people in the Western part to be with Russia. They are two separate people. Now do you get it?

 

I doubt if he can get it. Agenda overwhelms learning of history.

 

Ukraine is one country , recognized also by Russia. Souverain. All Ukrainians deside together. Pro russian terrorists do have no say and must be send home to Moscow in prison.

History did not stop. What 1000 years ago did happen, who cares? Than germany is at the Black Sea? The Gotics where there!

Today Ukraine is a country including Crimea.

If they dislike Russia, thats life.

Be wellcomed in Nato soon.

Nato bases all over Ukraine where the solution. Than pro russians terrorists might be quite.

Russians are bad behaving guets in Ukraine it seems here. If a guest runs mad and freaks out, I shall call the police to arrest him. Putin and other foolish fascists there run wild. They do need treatment.

 

It seems to us that russians do have a constant need to tell the world the world is russian. It is not.

Some do need to be reminded that they are not the kings on earth.

Russians in Ukraine shall learn to behave. If Ukraine is as nice to tolerate them, they should be very friendly and quite and not freak out into civil war.

I think Ukraine should force these russians out of the country so that they learn to behave. Only a strong hand will be understood by these bandits.


Kiew has spoken! The Maidan did win. On 25.05.2014, a new democratic elected goverment will deside. The russian visitors in East Ukraine shall shut up and leave the foreign country. Isn't it anyway forbidden to bring guns if you cross borders?

 

Merkel loves Russia and its gas.

She will do anything for a quick Euro.

 

Blah blah blah, and longer ago to that it belonged to the Romans, and before that the Greeks. Spare me your disgusting apologetics for overt military conquest and imperialistic expansionism, nobody is buying this horse(*)(*)(*)(*). I demand all of Russia for the Mongolians under the Hun? How about that? It's just as logical as your nonsensical bull(*)(*)(*)(*). It is sovereign Ukrainian territory in law and in fact, any assertion to the contrary is a lie, and any occupier is a war criminal.

 

You responded to someone else. I did not say a word about coal. I meant that Germany has all the chances to reduce energy imports from 2/3 to 1/2 of consumption from renewable energy sources. And I mean that Russia will successfully develop chemical and mechanical engineering in next 5 years. And the Germans are already helping Russia to achieve this. Germany today on the 3rd place in the world for investment in Russia.

There are 1,5 thousand companies with German capital more than 40% in Russia. Electrical companies Siemens and Bosch, as well as chemical concerns BASF and Henkel put first their manufacturing facility in Russia.
Major German automakers Volkswagen Group, BMW, Mercedes Benz built their plants in Russia. German financial institutions Raiffeisen Bank, Deutsche Bank, Commerz Bank and insurance company Allianz play important role in the Russia financial market. Metro CC is a one of retail market leader in Russia.

Do you think this is happening in spite of Putin's policies? And personal relationship Putin and Merkel did not play any role? Many years that Putin worked in Germany also signifying nothing? Do you think that German entrepreneurs do not want to work in Russia because Putin's policies? You doubt not answer these questions? Read http://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/so...dax-chefs-pilgern-nach-russland-a-968870.html

 

Putin did not "work"in Germany unless you do consider crimes as a regular job. So the Mafia is doing.

Espionage is considered as criminal. He was a KGB criminal.

- - - Updated - - -

I do think she is just trolling.

Nobody with common sense can denie that Russia is the aggressor in that and all is designed by Putins war ambitions / conquer ambitions.

Nobody unless he is liking it, completely braindamaged or totaly naiv.

She can chose.

 

Do you have problems with the history of Germany? Never heard of "Freundschaft UdSSR und DDR" house in Dresden, "Zusammenarbeit Stasi und KGB"? In 1989 Putin was awarded a bronze medal "Verdienstmedaille der Nationalen Volksarmee". Do you understand what it really means?

You think that Stasi = Mafia.

 

Stasi was a communist criminal organisation, ruled by the state (Soviet Union). they killed innocent civilians all over.

Ok. One criminal organisation does honor the other.

To me the creation of GDR (the right name was SBZ, Soviet occupied Zone, or simply OSTZONE) was illegal itself. That should have been considered as betrayal and illoyalty to Germany. All responsible people in the ex GDR are criminals and yould have been send to Nurnberg trial of 1990 just after reunification.

"Verdienstmedaille" for what? For having supported a criminal system?

Let's also give a medal to Al Capone, yeah...


Putin was not working. He was payed for having done crimes on german soil. GDR was not a state, do not forget. It was a vasalle of Stalin. Nothing more. Occupied german territory.

The highest Stasi commanders should have been executed - dispite I do not support death penalty. Hang to death. All

Accusation:

Illoyalty to Germany
Espionage for the enemy
murdering
Berlin Wall
deviding the nation
stalinism / bolchevism

That only can be answered by hanging - if we where the USA.

The reason why I would finnaly not have done it is because of religious believes.

I am against death penalty. But I am an extreme anti-Bolchevic, antii-soviet, anti-communist. In the most extreme way you can imagine.

I am in that, really supporting the Tea Party in the US and the conservatives. In that. In other issues, not at all.

 

If Germans and other Europeans were asked if they wanted any EU (like it was the case with the Swiss voters), there would be no EU and no Euro-Currency.

Neither Germans nor other Europeans were asked if they wanted an EU or a common currency, this fraud was imposed upon European taxpayers by international banksters.

Now German taxpayers have to pay for the banking scam in Greece, and Ukraine would be just the same scam but on a larger scale.

If the people in the EU were asked if they want another bigger "Greece" in the EU, they would say NO.

EU officials do not represent the will of Europeans, because the creation of EU had nothing to do with democracy.

Do you believe in the existence of a "Ukrainian race"?
Oh boy, most Ukrainians call themselves Russians like most Bavarians call themselves Germans.

EU was created without any referendums (except in Switzerland), Germans were never asked if they want to be part of this scam, called Eurotz.

How can a German in his right mind refer to EU and talk about democracy?

NATO was created (according to the General Secretary of NATO Lord Ismay) "to keep Germans down".

How can any German in his right mind be happy with being kept down?

A couple of criminals and racists who were on the payroll of criminal oligarchs and western banksters do not represent the Ukrainians, and there cannot be any vote in the whole Ukraine any more, because Ukraine does not exists any more.

The Junta violated the Ukrainian constitution and that was the end of the former Ukraine in the old Soviet borders of the "Ukrainskaya SSR".

Now the rest-Ukraine can vote their new leaders, but the people in the New Russia and the Crimean Peninsula will not care a rat's ass about it.

If somebody cannot understand that what has happened cannot be undone any more, then he is just a poor [self censored].

 

You really are very radical. Too many slogans, many propaganda lie. Complete misunderstanding of the history of the country in which you live today.

In 1989 I lived in Rathenow (Potsdam district). And where are you in 1989?

 

Give me a 'danke schoen' instead of a 'spaciba' as I myself am a Kraut.

You are better off not allowing the USA, France or Great Britain to influence the relationship between the Russians and Germans.

 

Indeed, Crimea did vote to rejoin Russia... thus, we saw "the Will of the People" in action. Next, the "Maidan" was a putsch, and if we support the idea of "the Will of the People in action", then their will was to get rid of Yanukovich -- although legally he remains the Ukrainian President to this day. These are points I wish to take into my response to Fabien (below)....

You express your approval for "the Will of the People" when characterized by Maidan, but you reject "the Will of the People" as it was expressed in Crimea...? Furchtbar unlogisch, oder...? You assume out-of-hand, and most uncritically that Maidan was completely legitimate, but you condemn the Crimean expression of "the Will of the People" as being forced by "Russian special troops". Tatsächlich?! Approximately 97% Crimean voters expressed their "Will" to rejoin Russia -- are you trying to tell us that clandestine operatives within the Russian Army forced 97% of these people to vote this way? That would be quite an accomplishment, indeed! Is there any proof for your profound announcement?

May we then also understand that similar recent expressions of "the Will of the People" in other parts of Eastern and Southern Ukraine were also fraudulent and attributable to these incredibly effective, omnipresent Russian "Ninjas"...? These guys must be absolutely superhuman!

The funny part is that if Frau Merkel had any sense, she would see that she could establish a relationship with Putin not greatly unlike the one that von Ribbentrop and Molotov began in 1939. It would have worked out beautifully for Germany if Hitler hadn't gone completely insane and invaded Russia in 1941. No, it wouldn't have to involve invading Poland or anything... but think! Germany could have the Americans eating out of one hand, and the Russians eating out of the other. Sehr klug, nicht war...?

 

What you wrote cannot be more wrong than you did write it.

If you ask the Germans: "Do you want to lsoe the EURO and get the DM back", the answer will be more than 80% no.

It is very easy to give popolistic straigh nationalistic answers as you do inhere. It is harder but more honest to be fair.

But for that, it needs intellegence instaed of stupid "Stammtischgequatsche" (Beer table talk).

The EU was greated after WW2 from germans and french mainly. It is the most sucsessfull Union the world ever has seen. It changed never ending fights into peace, it made economical prosperty, it helped Germans to get back on the feets, it made a save life in Europe since the end of WW2.

You do have no clue about that project, but you want to travel, you want freedom, you want a job, you do want stability, you want all...but you do want all for nothing in exchange.

We do not have a EURO crisis. We do have a currency what is better than anything we had before. What is inflation? What is the business right now? All is great!

What we do not have is strict orders to bann financial poker games in Europe, What we do not have is a united goverment to greate tax all same all over Europe. What we do not have is one army, a foreign minister and less selfish idiots who like the butter without doing some effort.

Than can be understood. We are many different cultures and not all are ready. We have to know (and now I lance for the change a sharp critics on the anglo-saxons) is that we do have a war, an economical war about two systems:

The anglo-saxon capitalism and the social balanced capitalism from the continent.

The first tries to destroy the second, but the point is: the first after that will destroy itself.

Money does not make money. Money is made by:

Production, education, balance in the social parts of a society, in a well done health system (far more than only that "Obama Care"), in good kindergarden (they all shall be free), in non genetic manipulated food, in banks what do their jons but stop speculating.

London does not produce. Switzerland does. London and the USA do not like the idea of a strong EU. So they did bring in more and more members - recently the US wanted Turkey very much to join, great! Allready Roumania, Bulgaria, eaven Poland was to much.

Europe must at first integrate more, than get bigger. To make it bigger was done to destroy it. Why destroy? Because it is the most powerful and also peaceful Union the world ever saw.

People like you of corse do really believe without the EU all was better. Bulls hit. We would have more wars, less exchange and less freedom. What is Germany outside the EU? An easy target for an economical attack! What is Germany IN the EU? I hope a very well moderating leader, always careful not to push the smaller members, but able to handle the balance and beeing reasonable.

Yes...the EURO is not perfect. Some southern countries might shall leave for a while. But that also has other reason:

1. Why greek millionaires do not pay tax?

Because in the EU, we do not have one tax law!!!

2. Why did some countries join the Iraq war and some not?

Because we do not have one foreign policy!


and and and...what shall be done?

The EU should respect that we are different cultures but focus on essential things we do have in common and developp them.

One EU army without the british, leaded by France would be a promising beginning. De Gaulle was right!

Europe does need a new De Gaulle!

Europe does not need lots of Ukip trash and Berlusconis.

Europa also does not need more Goerge W Bush or Putins.

Europe can be damn proud that in Europe, we did not had wars (in the EU) , that we do agreed on free borders and common standarts.

People like you, sorry to tell, are simply not cultured enough to understand that. Especially as beeing german ( and I am a german patriot) you should embrace your neighbors i the EU and be glad, that things are going well. I am against paying greek millionaies bills, but I do think we easily can effort to save Greece from 60% unemployed young people - but than...we do have to insist that they tax millionaies and rich people in general...and than, such thing shall not be considered as interfearing, because EU policy is no foreign policy!

For non europeans that is hard to understand. Allready some Stammtischgermans like this one inhere, can't. How do I explain that to a canadian...to an american...

I would say:

The EU is the result of the fact that Europe was saved twice from the USA and that they wont need to save it again...if a gangster like Putin will not run wild...in that case, I would say:

Give the EU 20 years more nd tehy will be able to handle that themselves...

But stuff like global waming...do you think such issue can be handled if allready Europe talks with 30 telephonenumbers?

You should get back to your Stammtisch. But to the others:

His view is often here, but by FAR a minority position.

Almost NOBODY really lieks the idea that the EU brakes up!

And that wont happen, because it is the finest project Europe had since ages. I would say we shall be careful not to regulate all for every little issue. But main targets only can be regulated by combined power.

The EU is and will be the counterbalance to the US and Russia.

 

I came back from having done my Bac in France to Berlin 1988. I am from Berlin. And I am clear about that Stasi. Stasi never was punished enough..

To many Stasi are left. The half of that "Die Linke" is Stasi trash. Funny, that they are in an agrement about russian policy with the german Neonazis..ah i fact not very surprising.

All same

Ok. You are from the EX GDR. What did you do to support the Stasi? I can say I did nothing. I am from France and from Berlin, western part. Parents mixed.

What about you? Did you stand in uniform to shoot people at the wall? Did you hepl russians doing that?

Just intrested. Do you support the Stasi Party Die Linke?

Do you like the atmosphere in Rostock where in the GDR Plattenbauareas people killed foreigners? Do you still think that comunism is the best we had on german soil?

Listen. It is clear: the ex SED and the Stasi where deeply involved in crimes. RThe wall itself was a crime! Eaven worst: they did it to please Russia!

If russians would have done that and Russia would have had a regime change, how many of these SED Mafia would have survived?


The GDR was an illegal construction. The biggest prison ever. And you do defend that? That only can happen in a forum..in public, people here would get irritated like hell indeed...may be not in the Hellersdorf Plattenbauten... kkthxbb

 

The aggression on the Crimea was organized by Moscow special forces. We all know it, Putin does admit it. If I do put a gun to you and ask you: "do you like me"? Well...really good choice...

Anyway: Ukraine is one country. All ukrainians must deside that anyway. You also do not ask one building in a city if they want to be part of an other city. The referendum only is respactable, if they also vote in Lwow. Ukraine is a united country.

So discussion ends here, sorry. Crimea was an invasion.

 

Oh we were almost neighbors. You're in the U.S. Berlin, I'm close to Russian Berlin (since 1987).



My parents is also mixed, very mixed. Father is German (deutsch-baltischen). His family was deported in 1941. Mother is Russian / Pani Polska.

I don't like Stasi as you. But did you support Bundesamt für Verfassungsschutz?

You are wrong. Russians were not near border in Berlin. They were on military bases as well as Americans in the West. I heard about Russian soldiers deserted to West through the wall.

Sometimes I think that people in "prison" were more free and had an independent point of view. People from "prison" developed immunity to propaganda, unlike you.

 

Propaganda is more a problem in the Soviet Union and Putins Russia.

In the West, Mass media is free. You should know that.

The Verfassungsschutz is needed to defend us from the Soviets, Putins Russia ect. It is controlled by democracy, unlike Stasi. Also that you should learn.

The americans never did occupie us. They in Berlin, did save us from Bolchevism and Stalin. Berliners liked them a lot. They disliked the Red Army - mass rapes are not forgotten.

Russians made the wall with the east german puppets, not americans.

You shall really learn on the truth and history

 

Russians lost the Cold War. They had already got out of the trench. And you still do not.

 

I was, I was...but Stalinism is back. Putin runs wild. Putin wants to reestablish the USSR with all meanings for its foreign policy.

The world shall not allow Russia to do that.

 

You are mistaken. And propaganda in media imposes you this misleading. They want to Germans quarrel with the Russians. They want to build a new wall. And I see this as one of the main threats to Russia and Germany.

 

http://www.spiegel.de/spiegel/print/d-125080781.html
http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/netz...nen-verbindungen-in-deutschland-a-908517.html

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deuts...nsa-spaehprogramm-xkeyscore-ein-a-912196.html

I haven't forgotten anything?

Are you afraid XKeyscore? Are you "controlled by democracy" too?

 

Listen my friend please and listen well

I am not against russians. I am oposed to a certain policy of Putins Russia. If germans would do such thing as invade into its neighbors country, I would freak out and tell what I think about it; I might would leave the country.

It is not the mistake of germans or americans or of reasonable russians that Putin runs wild and that pro russian nazis do kill unkrainians for imperalistic reasons.

It is not us, it is not the americans. You can ask me about NSA. I do have a clear answer to that one:

If the US does not stop to spy on us, the embassy of them shall be removed to the countryside in Mecklemburg Vorpommern so that they cannot spy so easily andmore and Germany shall establish its own systems to stop that...but that is another issue.

I am also against the free trading agreement - I do not want or need genetic transformed food here...

I am also against fraking for gas....strictly against that!

I do also think Germany shall get its own nuclear bombs and ask the USA to remove their bombs from here...but also...not the issue.

The issue is about Putins arrogance and his aggressivness in Europe. And here I am oposed and the "others" are not responsible.

Easy as that. I am not breaking with all russians. Pro Russians and Putin are not wellcomed here in Germany to my eyes. We do not need pro russians here.

If I did forget anything? NSA? no way! But Putin is may be unwanted forcing germans to put that on the side. It is the direct result of his way to run wild in Crimea and Ukraine.


God save the USA for having saved us from Stalin and Bolchevism!



watch and understand THAT please...nothing more to ad

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hH6nQhss4Yc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nHdB1vJNsg

And than watch that: That is Russia, that is Stalin and that is russian aggression:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtrP5J_2RZQ

my god...watch that...will that be Putins next target? The new Soviet Union causes nighmares to all reasonable europeans....


Watch and understand!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5yBjdU0x0I

My really deepest deepest respect to the brave hungarians who did fight the animals from Red Army

That does happen, if a nation does not want to join Russia.

So understand...that is why I am oposed to the russian crimes in Crimea

 

Thank you, you basically agree that EU is de facto a dictatorship, imposed upon Europeans, and German taxpayer have to pay for this scam.

Who hates REAL democracy uses the codeword "populism".

If the voters are so stupid, why do we need these shows, called "votes"?

BS, Germany was economically a great power before the creation of the EU, and we still have wars in Europe, like in Yugoslavia, and now in the Ukraine.

All this existed before the creation of the EU.

BS! You live in a parallel world!

Yes of course!

EU could not prevent any wars, and we have less and less freedom since EU was created.
We have now censorship laws like in the former DDR, people can be imprisoned for having the wrong opinion about some events of WWII.

There is no free media any more, all journalists have to repeat the stupid propaganda slogans.

This is called "Gleichschaltung".

Germany is a cash cow, milked by the banksters.

We still had wars in Europe, and EU was the aggressor.


MOD EDIT - RULE 2

What are you talking about?

Do you believe in this stupid conspiracy?

MOD EDIT - Rule 2