Are the Palestinians the Jews NOT expelled from Judaea after Bar Kochba Revolt?

There was NO Germany either.. LOLOL.. but there were people other than Jews who lived in Palestine for several thousand years.. European immigrants don't have MORE rights than they have. The people were known as Palestinians.. They had stamps and currency and newspapers that were called Palestinian long before 1948.. Greed and treachery don't prove your lies..

Israel was never a power house.. It was a whistle stop in bandit territory on the trade route,, and compared to the Decapolis it was impoverished and backwards .. It produced no lasting construction or monuments like Egypt or Greece or Byblos or Baalbeck.. Look at the dimensions of Solomon's Temple. It was small and a copy of larger temples in Byblos and Baalbeck.

 

No one can show proof of that... the proof of the pudding is in the eating... When Mohammad raided and beheaded 800 Jews of the Qurayza Tribe in 627 CE only one Jew abjured his religion to save his life while all the women and children were sold as slaves... This includes the Jewish Tribe of Al Nadhir before that in 626 CE that was crushed and expelled.
In 629 CE The Jews of Khaybar were all put to the sword.

I wonder what will happen to the present Jews if all Mohammedan had an opportunity to penetrate Israel... Would they not emulate Mohammad slaughter of 626 CE - 629 CE????

 

Any Messianic Jew…. who knows a bit about Jewish history…. could do a good job of questioning the near absolute pacifism that some Christian groups advocate.

An apology to all members of the military and police!

I just want to say that I am truly sorry for all those years that I was close to believing in near total pacifism! Rabbi Jesus/Yehoshua once asked a question of the Scribes and Pharisees that should have made it obvious to me that an extreme situation can call for drastic action by a Christian or Jew who feels called into a life in the military or police!

Mark 3:4 "And he saith unto them, Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath days, or to do evil? to save life, or to kill? But they held their peace."

I am almost certain that Rabbi Jesus/Yehoshua was referring to the situation faced by the Machabees when Greco - Syrian armies were attacking Jewish communities on the Sabbath.

One community had refused to fight back....but the Machabees....in my opinion correctly judged that this is a violation of an admonition by King Solomon:

Ecclesiastes 7:16 "Be not righteous over much; neither make thyself over wise: why shouldest thou destroy thyself?"

Douay-Rheims Catholic Bible, First Book Of Machabees Chapter 2
http://www.drbo.org/chapter/45002.htm
...

- - - Updated - - -

That is a valid point HBendor!

…. but what of the children and grand children of those Jewish slave girls and their Islamic owners………. are they at all under the promise of the "restoration of the lost tribes of Israel?"

What about the Catholic book of Ecclesiasticus…. is this perhaps a genuine writing by a Jewish scholar that we Christians……."borrowed?"

http://www.drbo.org/chapter/26048.htm

"And Elias the prophet stood up, as a fire, and his word burnt like a torch. [2] …... [8] Who anointedst kings to penance, and madest prophets successors after thee. [9] Who wast taken up in a whirlwind of fire, in a chariot of fiery horses. [10] Who art registered in the judgments of times to appease the wrath of the Lord, to reconcile the heart of the father to the son, and to restore the tribes of Jacob."

 

Israel was what it was, all the beautiful conquerors mentioned in your post cannot compare with the original owners of that Land... The Jew Jesus of Nazareth gained recognition as savior some followed him some did not.

I am not a liar for I know too much History! And in your case, it is easier to throw grenades than to catch them...

I will not let anyone drag me so low as to make me hate him. Have a nice day!

 

Most of the Jewish squatters at Kaybar oasis returned to Jericho.

The number of Jews of the Qurayza tribe was never recorded by anyone, but most experts think is was fewer than 90 .... Jews always exaggerate numbers.. like climing 93 million babies were killed by the Romans at Betar.

 

SO if the number of Jews of the Qurayza tribe was never recorded how those experts could estimatd their number? smething isnt right with what you said about the number of the Qurayza tribe!

The Romans killed half a million Jews, the number of the Jewish babies cant be 93 Million!!!!

 

The Jews claim that the Romans burned 93 million Jewish babies in Torah scrolls in the tiny village of Betar.. Ridiculous exaggerations.. .

 

In the Torah? The Romans were first existed at 752 BC, long after the period of the Torah!!

The Torah is talking about the birth of the universe until the Israelites came to Egypt in the first book, in the second one is talking about the first part of Exudos. In the third one is talking the 10 Commandments and the rest of the laws that need to be followed. The fourth one is talking about the second part of Exodus until the Isrealites came to Cna'an . In the last book of the Torah is talking about what the Isrealites can and cant do in the land of Israel.

BTW- the Roman smashed the Jewish babies's heads, they didnt burn them!!

 

The claim is that 93 million Jewish babies were wrapped in Torah scrolls and burned by the Romans.. LOLOL.. Yet Jerusalem NEVER could support a large poplulation (no water to speak of ) ...

The Torah was rewritten during the reign of King Omri combining the various myths of Judah and Israel in an aborted attempt to reunite the two areas... and the OT says the Amorites lived in the Negev.

Numbers 13:29

The Amalekites live in the Negev, and the Hittites, Jebusites, and Amorites live in the hill country. The Canaanites live along the coast of the Mediterranean Sea and along the Jordan Valley."

 

People could claim even that they are the Massaiah, but until there isnt a real evidence for that it will remain always a claim.
Historical evidences showed that the Romans killed half a million Jews, so the assumption you are using was debunked because of history!
Who ever said that 90 million Jewish babies were killed by the Romans is a pathetic humen beeing that just use religion to seperate Jews from the rest of the population. You are better then believing something that dont have any proof.

History, as I already showed you rainforced what the bible said (not the torah, yeah?), and you agreed with me about them!
The Bible without the Torah is an historical book.

Ok, and all of those people are no longer exist! so I dont know what is your point by mentioning them!

 

Gittin 58a of the Babylonian Talmud:

"There were four hundred synagogues in the city of Bethar, and in every one were four hundred teachers of children, and each one had under him four hundred pupils, and when the enemy entered there they pierced them with their staves, and when the enemy prevailed and captured them, they wrapped them in their scrolls and burnt them with fire."

400 synagogues x 400 teachers/synagogue x 400 pupils/teacher = 64,000,000 children

- - - Updated - - -

Gittin 58a of the Babylonian Talmud:

"There were four hundred synagogues in the city of Bethar, and in every one were four hundred teachers of children, and each one had under him four hundred pupils, and when the enemy entered there they pierced them with their staves, and when the enemy prevailed and captured them, they wrapped them in their scrolls and burnt them with fire."

400 synagogues x 400 teachers/synagogue x 400 pupils/teacher = 64,000,000 children

 

First of all, do you know what were the borders of Betar back then? Betar was a little Jewish city that ccouldnt have 400 synagogues!! A city that have 400 synagogues is a humangous city!

Secondly, in the Babylonian Talmud was written that 400 children of Betar were smashed on a stone, Even the Talmud say that, yeah? Rabi Asi found the heads of the children of Betar smashd on a stone. It was written in the begining of Gittin 58A.
What you wrote here is a myth to illustrate that the death of the 400 chldren of Betar was horriblle!

Please read all Gittin 58A and you will see for yourself that there were "only" 400 children that were killed! You are better then this!

 

Yes.. I know Bethar was a tiny village, but these sorts of claim are very typical of gross exaggerations...

 

So you know that Betar was a tiny village? so how could 400 snynagogues were existed in betar? because a tny village couldnt have 400 synagogues!
You are, just now, debunking your all calim about the Jewish babies of Betar!

Please I urge you to read all of Gittin 58A and you will see for yoursel that 400 children were killed and not 64 Million or 93 Million, like you caimed at the begining.

 

Hey Sport... I didn't write the Babylonian Talmud.

 

What's that have to do with me refering you to books?
Even me didnt write the Talmud, but it doesnt mean that I didnt interested about it and talked with people that study it and know about the Talmud.

Please, once again, I urge you to read all of Gittin 58A and you will see for yoursel that 400 children were killed and not 64 Million or 93 Million, like you caimed at the begining.
Without reading Gittin 58A you cant talk and say things about what was written there!!

 

Stuntman… have you ever heard of the Book of Jasher?

Does it seem to correspond with TAlmud at least regarding the story of 30,000 soldiers descended from Ephrayim leaving Egypt several decades previous to the deliverance led by Moses.


http://www.ccel.org/a/anonymous/jasher/75.htm

 

In his personal letters Simon Bar Kokhba has never called himself "king" or claimed to be the Messiah.
However he did mention that at least some "Galileans" served in his army and forbade his general Yeshua ben Galgola to do any harm to them.
Most modern-day historians believe that it was actually the Judeo-Christians.
Moreover, the later Christian authors depicting the destruction of the last significant Judeo-Christian community did not say it had been expelled from Jerusalem (and maybe even from Israel) by the Romans for religious reasons, rather than for political ones.

 

Ok and...? I means what did you want to say? how's that have to do with the murder of the 400 children of Beitar? please explain.

 

This is a valid possibility to be worried about HBendor.

But...… do you personally believe the Jewish teachings regarding the reincarnation cycle?

Do you personally believe that many Jewish scholars and sages from centuries in the past have reincarnated again in this time as Palestinians and residents of other Islamic nations.

To my thinking the understanding of the Jewish beliefs regarding reincarnation will play a huge role in ushering in a time period when nations beat their swords into plowshares.

http://www.chabad.org/kabbalah/article_cdo/aid/380599/jewish/Judaism-and-Reincarnation.htm

(Yerachmiel Tilles)

 

It isn't every day that I get to correspond with somebody who has read Talmud and can refer to it accurately so I was just curious if you had read the Book of Jasher?

There are a number of stories in it that in my opinion have enormous potential to alter the way that both Palestinians and Jews view each other. One important example would be the story of how Esau avenged his grandfather Abraham on King Nimrod who had put Abraham in a furnace but Abraham did not burn.

Another fascinating account is the story of how Abraham visits his son Ishmael and his mother several times.

http://www.ccel.org/a/anonymous/jasher/home.html

That would be chapters 12, 22 and 27 as seen here.

 

The first story about Nimrod and Abraham. is a dairy tale about that Abraham broke the gods of his father. which worshiped those idols , it didnt really happened! so I can see the enormous porential to alter the way that the "Palestinian" and Jews view each other. Because Nimrod was a pagen believer, so because Abraham destroyed the pagen gods he pubsihed him for that.

The second story describes Esau slashes Nimrod's head for a revange of Abraham's death, but it doesnt really alter the way of both sides view each other, Esau was an Edomaic, but you cant compare Esau with the Arabs of today because they are not the same. Because that the Arabs of today came from tribes that buried the girls alive and worshiped several of idols. The Edom's people lived until 11th century BC in the area of Jordan and those tribes that now are the Arabs of today is from Arabian Peninsula,a diffrent district.

The third story describes the land of the Philistines, but of course you cant assume that this is some "forgotten link" of the "Palestinians" or have nothing to do with them! because the Philistines and the "Palestinians" are not the same!! the Philistines were in the area of Gaza and arrived there from the area of Cyprus and Greece, which the "Palestinians" are really several groups from several Arab nations.
Fortheremore, if you really want to say something about the linking between Ishmael and the "Palestinians", if so they are belong to Egypt, because Ishmael came from Egypt.
Dont forget also that the story in the Korean about "Sacrifice of Ishmael" has nothing to do with the Arabs, because it was coppied from the story of "The Sacrifice of Iseec", the Arabs just changed the name to Ishmael.

 

But something of value in the story of Esau slaying Nimrod and his two bodyguards is that he was exhausted from this fight at the time that he meets his brother Jacob/ Yakob and the famous "bowl of soup" sale takes place.

Esau had such contempt for his brother that….. (assuming that the story is true and this might actually be the genuine Book of Jasher reffered to two times in the Jewish scripture)…….. that he didn't tell his brother about what he had just done….. If he had been more open with his brother surely no price would have been put on that bowl of soup?!

This story illustrates the value of communication and how important it is.

http://www.ccel.org/a/anonymous/jasher/27.htm

"And Esau at that time, after the death of Abraham, frequently went in the field to hunt.

And Nimrod king of Babel, the same was Amraphel, also frequently went with his mighty men to hunt in the field, and to walk about with his men in the cool of the day.
And Nimrod was observing Esau all the days, for a jealousy was formed in the heart of Nimrod against Esau all the days.
And on a certain day Esau went in the field to hunt, and he found Nimrod walking in the wilderness with his two men.
And all his mighty men and his people were with him in the wilderness, but they removed at a distance from him, and they went from him in different directions to hunt, and Esau concealed himself for Nimrod, and he lurked for him in the wilderness.
And Nimrod and his men that were with him did not know him, and Nimrod and his men frequently walked about in the field at the cool of the day, and to know where his men were hunting in the field.
And Nimrod and two of his men that were with him came to the place where they were, when Esau started suddenly from his lurking place, and drew his sword, and hastened and ran to Nimrod and cut off his head.
And Esau fought a desperate fight with the two men that were with Nimrod, and when they called out to him, Esau turned to them and smote them to death with his sword.
And all the mighty men of Nimrod, who had left him to go to the wilderness, heard the cry at a distance, and they knew the voices of those two men, and they ran to know the cause of it, when they found their king and the two men that were with him lying dead in the wilderness.
And when Esau saw the mighty men of Nimrod coming at a distance, he fled, and thereby escaped; and Esau took the valuable garments of Nimrod, which Nimrod's father had bequeathed to Nimrod, and with which Nimrod prevailed over the whole land, and he ran and concealed them in his house.
And Esau took those garments and ran into the city on account of Nimrod's men, and he came unto his father's house wearied and exhausted from fight, and he was ready to die through grief when he approached his brother Jacob and sat before him.
And he said unto his brother Jacob, Behold I shall die this day, and wherefore then do I want the birthright? And Jacob acted wisely with Esau in this matter, and Esau sold his birthright to Jacob, for it was so brought about by the Lord.
And Esau's portion in the cave of the field of Machpelah, which Abraham had bought from the children of Heth for the possession of a burial ground, Esau also sold to Jacob, and Jacob bought all this from his brother Esau for value given."

I completely agree with you that the Palestinians from this time period are NOT descended from the Philistines of history. I believe that they are largely descended from the Jews who were not expelled from Judaea after the Bar Kochba Revolt was crushed.

 

It is very importent to communicate with each other. In this conflict there is no communication between the Arabs with the Jews, because the leaders of those Arabs want the death of the Isrealies- Hamas, and one side is soppurting it= PLO, and the evidece is that Abu-Mazen said several days ago that the riots need to be continue, or as he said, the Arabs need to have "Day of Wrath", he doesnt restrain them. only puts more fuel to the fire. This is not what you can expact from a leader who want peace or even can talk to him.
Israel tried alot of times to talk with the Arab leaders, but nothing has been fullfiled or was on the right road to fullfilment.

You have alot of Bedouin in the Negav who have Jewish connection, and in the West Bank you have some villages that they are light candles in the Shabat and do Kiddush, there is Magen David all around of one od the villages. They say that they cant reveal their real identiny because they affreid that the Muslims Arabs would kill them.
You have also alot of Arab that a trace of Jewish priests, another evidence of the forcely convertions that happened in history while the Muslims controled there.

 

I am hoping that my nation Canada might just get interested in assisting with an increased level of cooperation between Jordan and Israel that could be focused on an alternative method of combatting climate change.

http://www.politicalforum.com/relig...s-p-m-brokering-jordan-israel-peace-deal.html

Several years ago I was led to read a book again about a near death experiencer who was shown that Jordan and Israel would become like one nation…. I wonder if this is true and if it would be according to the will of God for this to happen soon?


….…
…

(Dannion Brinkley, page 26, Saved By The Light, Scribd version)
My guess on the new colour for Jordan would be GREEN…. as Isaiah 35 is fulfilled and the deserts of Jordan would be turned green through a great increase in desalination of ocean water……. Not to mention the blessing of God!

http://saharaforestproject.com/projects/jordan.html



…………
http://www.angelfire.com/moon2/koran/index.blog?topic_id=1021110