Discussing the Messiah from an Historical Perspective

You mention just one facet of the New Testament, muslims reject the entire New Testament.

You are correct in that muslims specifically reject the crucifiction and resurrection of Jesus - which is the entire foundation of Christianity. That also means that when muslims claim Christians are "people of the book" and to be treated respectfully, muslims are not just lying but being deceivers.

 

Actually Muslims can discuss our religious differences and similarities with far more tolerance and kindness that many American Christians who have never set foot in the Arab world.

 

I had no idea you were Muslim, Margot. Kinda odd considering your basic views. However, its also very interesting for my upcoming debates with you. Look forward to them

 

Nope.. I am not a Muslim.. In fact I had years and years of perfect Sunday school attendance when I lived in Arabia.

 

But you just said, "Muslims can discuss our religious differences and similarities with far more tolerance and kindness." The word "our" insinuates ownership.

 

Our differences and similarities? So you didn't understand that ... I have had many discussions with Saudis.. They are surprisingly well informed about Christianity and revere Jesus and Mary...

 

Ah, OK. Now I understand. So... Are you Saudi?

 

Nope.. born in the southern US.. My family were in America when New Amsterdam was new.

 

Obviously it does not go very deep with you because this post is completely lacking in substance.

"He also uses a lot of incorrect information" Well perhaps the author does use a lot of incorrect information but you certainly have not proved that he has used any incorrect information.

What kind of a nonsense is it to stand on a street corner claiming "its wrong its wrong" without even stating what you think is wrong ?

What is the point of such a post ?

What is not surprising but equally scary is that Mitt and CD actually clicked "like" in such a post. I mean my God ... what is there to like about a post that responds "there was incorrect information" but does not state one thing that was incorrect.

What the hay is wrong with you people ??

 

Muslims do not reject the entire NT as they view Christ as a prophet.

Muslim's do not reject the resurrection of Jesus. Muhammad supposedly was whisked away by an Angel where he visited with Abraham and Jesus.

You many think that the foundation of Christianity is story of the death and resurrection of Jesus but that is not the case for all Christians.

For many it is the message of Jesus that mattered. The message about how to do what is right in the eyes of God and by doing so earn passage into heaven.

 

Muslims reject the entire New Testament for the reason I previously stated.

Muslims deny that Jesus was crucified and resurrected. Being "whisked away" is not resurrection.

The foundation of Christianity is the death and resurrection of Jesus, that's explicit in the New Testament, such as 1 Corinthians 15:

14 And if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is futile and your faith is empty........ 17 And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is useless; you are still in your sins.​

And that message is that faith is the passage into Heaven. Works follow faith, but works alone do not give passage into Heaven. Sins are only forgiven when the person accepts Jesus as savior, not because the person does good deeds.

For example, Ephesians 2:8 - For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God. Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Good deeds are important as the manifestation of faith.
James 2:26 - For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

 

You have just been brain washed to understand the Bible the way do.

Hypnotism was unheard of in 32AD, and even when Mesmer re-discovered it in 1880, he thought at first it was a strange power given to him.
Jesus, himself, explained that faith in hypnosis was all that was necessary for these healings.

They also explain the mass hypnosis at the wedding, too.

 

What did Jesus say about Mass hypnosis?

 

Yes.
That one thing is exactly what will show Muhammed was the false prophet Daniel 7 explains for us.
Muslims will not be able to explain how Jesus could do all the things over again as described in 1 Kings 18.
Jesus duplicated everything exactly in two dozen verses:

 

What did Jesus say about mass hypnosis?????

 

They are wrong again here, too.

The son-of-God is any man who accepts Truth as the light into the real world.
That man eats and is the image of God, who is Reality.
This was the great trinity which christians could not clearly explain to Mohammed in 616AD.

Truth is the son-of-Reality who is the one God men must adapt to or become extinct.

 

Christianity=Zoroastrianism + Jesus
Islam=Zoroastrianism + Muhammad
Buddhism=Zoroastrianism- human Day 4 resurrection
Judaism=Zoroastrianism +David - resurrection


See anything in common?

 

Jewish people, like Muslims, do not believe in original sin or that hell is eternal.. Maybe God knows more than you.

 

Oh, so you're actually curious as to how I've reached my conclusions huh? Alright, allow me to elaborate.

I'm not too sure how this became a conflict considering that even the Jews knew of the Godhead before the Christians came into being. The Hebrew word for God is "Elohim" which is a plural word. Jesus had explained what the Godhead was himself (John 10:30) and (John 14:9).

Then the article claims that the idea of the "Messiah" being "superhuman" came from the Christians, when in fact, that was never a claim the Christians made. The Christians claimed that the Messiah was God in the flesh. There's a stark difference here. Saying Jesus was superhuman denotes that he was simply a human with special abilities. This article comes to that conclusion on its own. Christians revered Jesus to a much higher standard than just being superhuman. They view Jesus as being what he claimed he was; the son of God, a member of the triune God, and thus God himself.

The article than continues to explain the aspects of being a messiah as simply being of a superhuman caricature. It uses the conclusion it has formed on its own for Jesus to describe the aspect of what a messiah is. It then cleverly links that to the general beliefs of Christians. Its foundational argument was already incorrect, thus it made the entire article incorrect.

** Looks at you weird **

1) How was I brain washed to understand the bible the way I do?

2) What mass hypnosis at the wedding are you talking about?

 

Equating knowledge with logic is less than logical.

Arguing on the internet on the other hand is a test of neither. It's all semantics and who can best google things they don't actually know. Add some overinflated egos and mix until well blended.

To get back to the actual topic at hand. I'm curious to know how many of these people had their messianic activity recorded in their own lifetime. Anyone know?

 

There is a thread just on the various Messianic claimants.. Some of their stories are very interesting.

 

Knowledge and logic go hand in hand. Even with that said, I never said atheists were stupid. Atheists are quite intelligent (some of the most intelligent I've ever spoke to). However, for many atheists, religion is something they seem to not totally grasp, and instead of researching further into those studies, they use that lack of understanding as canon fodder for their arguments. That is illogical. If I can easily tear apart your argument by simply introducing facts, then something is wrong here.

 

Where I would agree that atheists usually go about it entirely wrong, I neither mentioned atheists, nor made an argument. I especially did not make an argument about atheists. So I'm not sure what you think you "tore apart" here. I was simply pointing out that regardless of religion, or lack of, the internet is a poor place to judge anyone's knowledge of anything. Something wrong? Definitely.

I do give you props on the ironic use of the word canon. You were going for irony, right?

Now, weren't we talking about the history of messiahs?

 

Will make sure to check it out.

 

I haven't read about them all, but some of them had somewhat large followings in their heyday.