God plays favorites, deal with it

God plays favorites, deal with it

Israel is God's chosen people.
The Bible makes no apology for that assertion and no Christian denies it. St. Paul described Christians as being grafted into the Jewish tree of blessing, adding the warning, “Let him who thinketh he stands take heed lest he fall.”
While some theologians make the case that Christians are the “spiritual Israel” and have replaced the Jews in God's favor they can not dispute that St. Paul also wrote, “God hath not cast off his people which he foreknew” nor is it easy to deny that Hebrews continue to prosper, live longer, produce more scholars than most ethnic groups, indicating that the genetic descendants of Abraham still get unearned blessings.
Since God's first minimal intrusions in the life of Abraham and Isaac through the roundabout way God used Joseph to save the family from starving it is clear God was doing special things for that one large family while perhaps leaving the rest of the world on its own. Joseph was second-in-command to Pharoah for at least 28 years, but there is no record of him even attempting to convert him. In fact, Joseph married the daughter of an Egyptian priest, and when he bought all private lands from Egyptian farmers he exempted the priests.
There is no record of God doing anything specific for any Jew until he called Moses, however they preserved their identity and multiplied their numbers in Egypt, which was sufficient.
Some believe that the humiliation of Egypt by Moses made the country monotheistic. If that is true we must conclude that God was content with monotheism and a friendly country that was often an ally of Israel and Judah for the next 800 years.
Meanwhile China and India was developing a thick culture with no Jews in sight. India eventually had more gods than any individual could ever memorize A consistent theology can only conclude that God inspired Confucius in China and Siddhartha Gautama Buddha in India to direct these people gently toward virtuous behavior and away from polytheism.
The scattering of Jews through the Middle East and Europe began an intervention in those countries.
The Greeks, Romans and Norse developed their own set of deities. These gods exhibited every human weakness and the stories of their interventions with man generally involve lust and petty bickering among them. Therefore it was easy to replace these deities with YHWH and Jesus because of the obvious superiority of the theologies involved.
We can also conclude that God has a special love for the indigenous peoples of the Americas and Australia, evidenced by the fact that he gave them the three most bountiful and beautiful continents on the planet with no interventions for at least 3000 years. Their cultures were far from primitive, but over time it was the simplest of their peoples, with the most respect for nature, ancestors and their fellow man, who thrived longest.
The natives of Africa would seem to be God's least favorite. That could be part of Noah's curse on Ham and Canaan (though that does not justify treating any of them unkindly.) However many of them found ways to survive in unfriendly environments, respecting nature and common law. Their problems began only when whites intervened with less universal intentions.
Christians should not hide from these realities, nor deny them. Just do your best to strengthen your own tenuous relationship with the almighty.

 

Are you familiar with the term "Wall of Text"?

 

Jews are gods chosen people because the bible says so.

In the words of Tevye, "God, I know that we're the chosen people, but once in a while, can you choose someone else?"

 

The old Cascading Illogic Bible Argument-

"Jews are God's chosen people, the Bible says so"

"How do you know the Bible is right?"

"Because... says so in the Bible!"

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Jews write the bible?

 

Just about every civilization who had gods had those gods telling them they were the exceptional, if not "chosen", people.

The difference between judaism and any other ancient religion is judaism has christianity providing them air cover.

 

A little detail that is not included in your message is that Israel is Jacob first and his children later. There were 12 tribes conforming Israel, and only one is Judah, from which Jewish people are descendants.

The chosen Israel goes to the 12 tribes, not to one alone.

Today's Israel is practically the whole Europe, America (continent) and the State of Israel. These descendants of Jacob (the twelve tribes) are in population number very similar to the descendants of Esau. The blessing can be seen until today, while the descendants of Israel are taking the leadership in the world, the descendants of Esau also enjoy other blessings given by Jacob (the BEST oil like crazy is in their lands)

Christians is a mixture of beliefs. This kind of mixture has happened before when ten of the tribes were exiliated from their land and crossed the Eufrates river to come back no more. These ten tribes migrated to what today is Europe and assimilated their culture and practically "went lost". The other two tribes (Benjamin and Judah) were also exiliated but returned back to their land. Thanks to this return, the preservation of the Torah was enforced. We can notice it when Jesus said very clearly, that he came for "the lost sheep" of Israel, and the messengers sent to spread the good news traveled to far away lands (Europe).

About China, Japan, South Korea, etc. their blessings are also mentioned in Genesis when Japhet is told that he "will dwell in the tents of Shem" (ancestor of ****r, Abraham, Issac, Jacob), this is to say, they will progress when working hand to hand with the descendants of Shem.

About the curse of Cannan, we must notice that Canaan is not the whole black race but only one of the descendants of Ham, and that Canaan didn't follow his brothers to live in the south (Africa) but went to the land that is known today as the Middle East. When the three brothers split after the Mabul (flood) they separated themselves in three directions but Canaan didn't obey his father in such a distribution.

Yes, your message is correct, there are chosen people by God, but the bible also shows that anyone can be part of such "a blessing". An example for this is Ruth, descendant of Moab (enemy of Israel) who decided to be a member of Israel and have YHWH as her god. (her story is part of the scriptures)

 

Moses wasn't a descendant of Judah but of Levy, in other words, he wasn't a Jew.

 

Not just Judaism...or even Israel....but the Likud Party of Israel. The "Christian Zionists" don't support ALL of Israeli politics....just the Hard Right like Netanyahu.


BTW, on your first point, I'll bet Alexander the Great thought "Zeus is on my side" against the Persians.

 

Are you making the declaration that you KNOW that God plays favorites?

 

To summarize the above:
I believe the Bible which says Israel is God's chosen people and Christians by adoption.
The longevity and prosperity of modern Jews confirms this to my satisfaction.
The fact Joseph never converted Pharoah shows God didn't want everyone.
The long delay in the Gospel reaching the Americas shows God did not want the Native Americans as Christians in great haste but he gave them a wonderful home and liked what they did with it.
To answer Gorn Captain, God helped Alexander the Great because it advanced his plans to introduce Christianity and Judaism and their mythology was an improvement on Persian theology.

 

As some of the more notable skeptics on thins forum would/might say, "belief" is not the same as "knowing". So your statement of sentiment does not answer the question which I posed. Are you declaring that you KNOW that God plays favorites?

 

What I'm attempting to do is assemble facts everyone agrees on and showing the inescapable conclusion. I believe my conclusion is correct based on the limited number of facts I presented. I could add many additional facts that point in the same direction. I challenge anyone to present facts that point in another direction.
Not everyone is born with equally good DNA, family situations or communities. If God did anything for anyone ever to influence even one result he favored that person. All religions except atheism teach that he did. Therefore all theists have to agree God plays favorites. Atheists somehow believe that what theists call miracles (events that defy nature or reason) are not miracles, but since they do happen sometimes the non-god they believe in is even more biased.
Christianity specifically teaches that all people can be saved and all the world must be evangelized. Christians who believe the Bible have no choice but to believe:
for about 1800 years before Christ God did some outrageous things to help one large family grow into a mighty nation, accepting converts but not actively seeking them. In orther words most of the population was on their own spiritually. Among those however God also played favorites by giving some of them better climates. Some of them developed better behaviors and customs (comparable to those he gave the Jews specific instructions about.)
When Christ came he limited his ministry to Jews in Palestine with a few exceptions.
Then God waited about eight years before making it clear it was time to expand the gospel to Gentiles. Even during the career of St. Paul, he was directed to Greece and away from Turkey.
It's not clear why few Christians ever tried to convert China, Japan or India, but they certainly couldn't have found the Americas for a long time. Over 1400 years passed before the name Jesus Christ was spoken in the Americas. He gave them a great continent but witheld the gospel.
Even those of us who get frequent miracles don't get them equally. God improved my health after my conversion, but I didn't become an athlete. God kept many relatives alive longer than anyone expected, but none became the oldest in their hometown. Some of my enemies met terrible fates but not all of them. God has done a lot for me, more for a few, possibly less for you. That's his prerogative.

 

Chosen People where was god when the Holocaust was going on he supposedly wiped out Egypt for much less, did a meteor swarm wipe out Germany or any other action that would matter before millions of Jews were slaughtered? No.

The British, Chinese, Free French, Communist Russia and the USA did that means strongly Christian nations and a pagan nation (China) and atheist nations (Communists in China and Russia) with blood and sacrifice when they broke the Axis and gave the Jews a homeland Israel. No god - humans fighting the Axis with their full measure and defeating the uncivilized.

If they are Chosen they need to find another option.

 

Wheat and chaff. But what makes us one or the other?

I think you should not bother with the arbitrary reasons so much.

 

I've been developing thoughts about the holocaust for awhile. I'm far from finished but might as well start it here.
The Holocaust, if carefully defined, refers to the systematic killing of Jews and other ethnic persons the NAZIs hated in death camps in central Europe. Though details are imprecise, most scholars date these mass killings to early 1942 until the camps were liberated in the final months of the war.
Prior to that the following events happened:
Many jews left Germany freely soon after the NAZIs became the governing party in 1933. Germany was pleased to let them leave.
Those who vremained were outed, humiliated, slandered, harassed and sometimes assaulted with impunity from 1933 to 1938. In doing this Germany was following an ancient tradition. These Jews still could have moved out voluntarily. Some did.
In 1938 one Jew got tired of the abuse and killed a government clerk. This was followed by Crystal night, in which Jewish businesses had their windows smashed and some people were hurt in retaliatory violence.
Soon after that, Jews had their homes and valuables confiscated and were concentrated, first in ghettoes then in concentration camps. This got worse when the war started. Medicine and food was limited, so they began to die of things that would not have been fatal.
German officers killed large numbers of Jews and others as they conquered territories. These killings appeased either their bloodlust, personal prejudice or the convenience of having fewer conquered persons to worry about. Though they were generally unpunished it is doubtful these officers were ordered to do so.
So what prompted the final solution and mass killings of non-belligerant captives?
In December 1941 the US enterred the war, tilting all mathematical predictions about the war towards the allies. The Soviet Union successfully repelled the attack on Moscow and Leningrad, meaning the battle in the east would continue and Germany was also outnumbered there.
Then came the final blow. FDR told Churchill to accept nothing but unconditional surrender.
Hitler knew what that meant. They would not only lose the war, but he would lose his job and be put on trial for war crimes. Germany would lose and Hitler would be dead.
hitler's bucket list included, "Kill all Jews." While pretending the war was still winnable he planned a major offensive in the Soviet Union. Knowing even that would eventually fail, he gave the order for the simpler task of mass killings.
FDR caused the Holocaust, elevating it from a humiliating life with many incidental deaths to a killing order. I charge FDR with responsibility for about half of those deaths, not to mention the soldiers and civilians of many countries lost because a negotiated treaty was not acceptable.

 

Nonsense. All humans are God's children. What kind of god would play favorites? Maybe some races got help from devious extraterestrials. Likewise, the unperceived foolishness of the well-meaning phrase, "God Bless America." Yea God, help me stomp into oblivion your wayward children in foreign lands.

The Hebrews/Jews were not God's chosen race. The only things chosen were the elements chosen from space for Creation. Like the stone cut out without hands that became a great mountain and filled the whole earth, it's a process, not a personality.

Pharoah had no reason to convert to anything because he was already in a position to bestow all the converting, once Joseph qualified himself. The Pharoah didn't have to be pulled up out of imprisonment or an earthly pit. The Pharoah was not a variant on The Prodigal Son as Joseph was.

Christianity hijacked its way to fame, which is why Judaism wanted no part of a Godman coming here to walk on water.

It's nice that your modern race seems to be physically robust, but I recall reading about some distinctive genetic defects that are unique to certain Jews.

God must not have wanted the bumblebee to continue living, so He crashed it into my car's windshield because the birds, possums, skunks, racoons, and ants gotta eat too.

Whoa. Christianity and Judaism contains mythology? Yes it does, but I"m not accustomed to a Goddite admitting it. Usually a clear distance is maintained so as to elevate way above the heathen pantheons. I'll let you have Demon est Deus Inversus for a real bargain, free. Anyway, a fair amount of Persian stuff was commandeered by the Jehova gang, mostly taken from Mithraism if I recall correctly.

 

That's a very interesting analysis. Thanks for sharing.

 

Chosen to do what? That is where you confuse this issue. You think "God's Chosen" means they are the masters of the earth, and all other people, in loyalty to God, must bow before them.
Chosen to do what?

I once asked a Pastor why God would choose such a ruthless and deceitful people. I was surprised to hear that I actually understood his answer.
He said, "If God had chosen a people like the Quakers, which had no interest in power, his prophecy could never be fulfilled."

He's right. It took a lot of scheming, money, power and ruthlessness to take Palestine for the "Jews." A people such as the Quakers could have, and would have never achieved that. It's not in their character.

God chose the Jews for a purpose, not as his favorites.
Understand the distinction.

 

If there's an invisible sky God as described why would he need to prophesize about anything? Who is he trying to impress? The people he originally made the prophecy to are long dead. How will they know it ever occurred? And even the Bible says that if a prophecy doesn't happen in the prophet's lifetime that he was just full of BS.

 

I am. I also know TL;DR.

 

Agreed. I more of a Deist in that I believe in an all powerful entity is tied to our existence, I also believe that power doesn't interfere in the everyday workings of the Universe.

As for those who use the Holocaust or 2004 Tsunami as proof of either God's rage or of God's nonexistence. I believe it proves neither.

For believers, if God really does exist and everyone has eternal life after death, then what does it matter when we die? Isn't it more important on how we live?

 

I wasn't! But I've always reacted to that format with "I ain't reading that".

 

Moses created the Jews.

 

It's peculiar that so many atheists exhibit an inability for abstract thought. The answers to so many of their questions can be reasoned out abstractly, yet they seem unable to do so.