You data is older that Lincoln. Quit falling back on research that predates our own Civl War you couldnt be more wrong with your outdated data: Here's something more current................. here's some numbers, BB http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/...d-States/Crime the bottom line is that you actually have more crime in Aussieland than America Australia has 30.1% as compared to the US which has 21.1%.............your material is outdated and flawed..... currently Australia has a rape factor or 150% greater than the US There is a comparison to suicides rates, Australia still leads the US. Assault victims is greater than America by 100% You also scored higher on the bribe index with an astounding rate of 31.1% and you should be ashamed of your software piracy rates Rape victims? You still surpass the US..... and you think is is so safe over there. This is your source. You have used this time and again, However, you are being selective about the years you use to shore up a collapsing argument.
While I do not have the educational background to refute any of the links above. One of our problems in this debate is the absence of unbiased research on the issue. The only critical review of the different studies that I have ever seen was done in I believe 2004. It was done by the National Academy of Science, they are considered to be gun-control advocates by most on my side of the debate. Only one person on the panel was not a gun-control advocate, he did the dissent. It has been a while since I read it but increased success rate for suicide was I believe the only thing they could say was established by the numerous studies they reviewed. It is a good read but long. http://www.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=10881 It basically leaves our respective sides of the argument at a draw. The other link I posted wrong at first and then reposted, I favor because the author being a expert on constitutional law suggest solutions, that are not a infringement of rights that we are losing rather quickly in the US. While they would meet with resistance by many gun rights supporters, I do believe they could get passed with support by people on both sides. http://www.catb.org/esr/guns/gun-control.html It is very much inline with my views.
You just need to do three things. First, ensure that you're not reliant on one paper (and ignore anything that hasn't been through peer review). Second, ensure that you compare and contrast being papers. Thirds, ensure that there are checks on robustness. Follow that and you'll find that the bulk of the evidence does indeed support the welfare-gains through gun control
You can almost make an argument, but your failure to research things leaves you hanging. Yes, after 2007, only about 2,000 Swiss specialists can keep their GOVERNMENT issused ammo for their assault rifles and handgun ammo at home. However, the same ammo, 5.56 and 9mm ammo for both the assault rifles and 9mm handguns are available for sale to the public. The ammo is registered. What good would the guns be for the defence of the nation if the people were not allowed to train and shoot them on a regular basis? Any serious soldier would have a least a small cache of ammo on hand at his home to use for his weapons---but naturally they wouldn't be talking about it.
Two links of interest in this gun grab debate: Feinstein's New Gun-Ban Bill Likely to be Introduced January 22. Anti-Gun Representatives Introduce First Wave of Bills in U.S. House. If you care about your freedoms, I suggest writing, calling or e-mailing your elected officials, and express your opposition to this stuff.
Clackamas mall shooter faced man with concealed weapon http://www.kgw.com/news/Clackamas-man-armed-confronts-mall-shooter-183593571.html ** Similar incident happened in the Tucson shooting, when a man with concealed-carry permit came out of the adjacent Safewayt but unfortunately at the end of the shooting. The next major mass threat the US faces is not just individuals with guns but those bringing WMD's (such as dirty bombs or Syrian chemical weapons) over in steel containers and boating up US rivers /or carrying in semi's to their final destination. Armed security as well as concealed-carry 'patriots' would be the last line of defense against the suspicious individual shouting "Allahu akbar" b4 detonating...btw, this scenario is said to be a certainty in the future!
So, that is two people with guns who DID NOT stop a mass shooter That adds to the two people with guns who did not stop shooters but got themselves shot http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/09/mass-shootings-investigation Tell me again how effective concealed carry is.................
Ref you link: The results that you seem to miss is that none of the concealed carriers were 'eager' to use their weapons and chose to initially be reserved and monitor the situation to their unfortunate disgust or loss. NONE of them were "Dirty Harrys!" As you like to 'accuse' those kind of ppl of being. It's not those trained in gun safety and ownership responsibility that are involved with mass shootings. It is the criminally insane in most cases who are suspects of violence but not removed from society in time b4 doing their damage. Btw, And you can partially thk ppl like YOU for the increase in membership & new gun ownership.....didnt know that YOU were a 'closeted' NRA lobbyist! Let me set up some real possible daily scenarios for you: Will bypass 'home invasions' which are on the rise these days (break in, theft, torture, rape of those inside over many hours), and look at 2 others that could affect you---a stalker or an angry neighbor for any of a variety of menial reasons. If you knew that a 200-220 lb man was coming after you in just a matter of time, I can guarantee you that you would go out and buy a gun for protection and have it loaded for immediate protection, if not just a naive YOU but for the safety of your children---dont let them pay the price for your ideological stand. Btw, there are many ways to protect your children from your gun including trigger locks. Again this is where over-emotional insane reactions show true hypocrisy and the failure of hyped-up response to tragedies and not addressing the basic problem of a violent society (video games/movies...which if YOU attend are buying in to the onscreen violence, as in GUILTY of propagating).
Police: Text messages helped foil teens' school bomb plot By the CNN Wire Staff updated 8:29 PM EST, Fri January 27, 2012 This in the heart of 'peaceful Mormon' country! And YOUR answer to this possible mass killing is _________? Ban the Inet, or just Censor it?! (as the TV said they learned how to make bombs on the net) BTW, have you ever watched "more than" a single Clint Eastwood, Bruce Willis, Quinton T., etc. move ??" After seeing the 1st movie exploiting violence and in the case of the latter producer, w/unemotional, callous, head shots of victims, then YOU are guilty of financially backing a violent society...hypocrisy, hypocrisy, hypocrisy, hypocrisy, ......
Let the sheep cry and let the asses bray. Every time they do, the value of my guns increases....keep it up Libs, you're going to allow me to retire again!!!!!
some of them have been grinding their axes since Quigley won the fast draw against three Aussies. subjects............lol
Nope! Live in Australia - no guns remember? Few over here feel the NEED for guns But DESPITE your vast increase in CCW there has been a concomitant increase in mass shootings 16 mass shootings in 12 months http://www.thenation.com/blog/171774/fifteen-us-mass-shootings-happened-2012-84-dead# 88 dead - they did not tally the injured Meanwhile back in Orstraylya we WERE experiencing nearly one mass shooting per year (using FBI criteria of more than four dead) so 13 in 18 years - since then ONE mass shooting So, tell me again if you think reducing the number of guns just might reduce the number of gun homicides?
Have you ever thought that fewer homicides might mean the police were freed up to do more preventative interventions like this?
The Ozzies have just exchanged guns for knives...congrats on your country's 'enlightenment' ‘Knife crime’ in Australia: Incidence, aetiology and responses The Australian Institute of Criminology http://www.aic.gov.au/documents/3/F/2/%7B3F2788C1-BCCC-49F0-A73F-F71620ABF7A3%7Dtbp045.pdf BTW, still want an answer to being threatened by a stalker or angry neighbor with possible danger, and whether you will 'bend over' or keep a loaded gun so as not to fail your children by your naive ideology..?? You seem to enjoy spouting stuff but not answering the tough questions called REALITY! EDIT: I'm also betting that you are vehemently against 'water boarding,' but would be 1st in line to pour water to get info shud a loved one of yours be kidnapped & was REALLY being tortured!! Again, more hypocrisy........
The evidence does point to success from the 'buy-back' policy: Leigh and Neill (2010, Do Gun Buybacks Save Lives? Evidence from Panel Data, American Law & Economics Review, Vol. 12, pp 462-508 ) note: In 1997, Australia implemented a gun buyback program that reduced the stock of firearms by around one-fifth (and nearly halved the number of gun-owning households). Using differences across states, we test whether the reduction in firearms availability affected homicide and suicide rates. We find that the buyback led to a drop in the firearm suicide rates of almost 80%, with no significant effect on non-firearm death rates. The effect on firearm homicides is of similar magnitude but is less precise. The results are robust to a variety of specification checks and to instrumenting the state-level buyback rate
Reiver, I would like to run a few inquiry by you regarding the Duggan study. In analyzing the differences in gun ownership and the buying of Guns & Ammo, he comes to the conclusion that individuals in western and southern states are much more likely to own one or more firearms and buy the magazine more frequently than individuals in eastern and midwestern states. Given that he never addresses this difference in characteristics again, I assume there are exogenous factors at play, correct? If so, what may those be?
For a start your accusation about torture is unfounded because I believe it is totally useless and will in fact lead to misinformation - but then I do not get my information on things like this off of fictional TV shows Now as to the lovely report your cherry picked er sorry - selectively quoted http://www.aic.gov.au/documents/3/F/2/{3F2788C1-BCCC-49F0-A73F-F71620ABF7A3}tbp045.pdf And remember that Australia has a much lower overall homicide rate therefor a small increase in actual numbers may look like a rise
here's some numbers, BB http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/...d-States/Crime the bottom line is that you actually have more crime in Aussieland than America Australia has 30.1% as compared to the US which has 21.1%.............your material is outdated and flawed..... currently Australia has a rape factor or 150% greater than the US There is a comparison to suicides rates, Australia still leads the US. Assault victims is greater than America by 100% You also scored higher on the bribe index with an astounding rate of 31.1% and you should be ashamed of your software piracy rates Rape victims? You still surpass the US..... and you think is is so safe over there. This is your source. You have used this time and again, However, you are being selective about the years you use to shore up a collapsing argument.
So you're not concerned with knives as they arent a weapon of mass destruction, huh? And so if your son or daughter were knifed to death with merely 3-4 other children, but 15 other kids were spared, that would make YOU feel better? That would sound so noble as well as be disingenuous of YOU. And I believe that a knife has 'unlimited killing potential' if wielded properly (not broken off in one of the victims)..... But your ax de jour is guns and so you are not concerned with the knife problem in YOUR country? Ref: Crocodile Dundee, "Now this is a knife!" Well, not much one can do to squelch 'self-imposed' naivety and pointing out blatant hypocrisy is useless. Will have to see you walk your talk of never needing to defend yourself with a gun; so if the occasion ever arises, send me the News clip saying, "Woman Fends Off Large Intruder with Cell Phone & Hysteria."
Ah! Nationmaster - someone ALWAYS trots that out and they always fall into the same trap While most jurisdictions agree oh what constitutes "homicide" not everyone agrees on what constitutes say "theft" with some counting all reported incidents of shoplifting whilst others only report amounts over a certain dollar value Same with rape - our laws are VERY different and here you can be charged with rape if the woman says NO AT ANY POINT and you do not stop immediately There is also the effect of the willingness to report - as we have recently seen in India where despite a high rape incident rate there were few convictions And even there there is a difference with some countries counting charges and some convictions http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_statistics
You know the SAME day that there was the Newtown incident in America there was a mass knifing at a school in China Guess which one had the higher death rate?
Chinese 'Knife' Aussie 'Knife' If that massacre would have happened in your Land of Oz, the results might have been the same....size does matter in knifings!
Turning a blind eye to 'knife control' shows your bias in the conversation. Bet you 'pack' steak knives, "butcher" knives, cleavers, etc, in your household that are accessible to children..tsk tsk But par for the course in regards to typical Liberal hypocrisy.....the emperor better find some 'visible' clothes. [was that the correct verbiage, as I believe you still 'bend over' to Royalty in your island nation]
