I fully believe President Trump intended to force Ukraine to find dirt on Biden for military aid.

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Dayton3, Nov 14, 2019.

  1. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    So you know that Trump did what he is accused of doing but simply don't care.

    What's "damaging in the future" is allowing it to happen with no consequences...in regards to what he'll do NEXT...and what others will do in the future
     
  2. mitchscove

    mitchscove Well-Known Member Donor

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    The funds, some of which were FY 2019 funds and had to be released by October 31, 2019 were reported released on September 12, 2019 after Durbin, in an Appropriations Hearing, threatened to add an amendment to a 2020 funding bill to redirect other funds. Portman claims he talked Trump into releasing the funds, likely to head off Durbin's amendment. The non-WB misreport was made public on September 18. Since the conspiracy to run a coup against Trump was hatched long before and since Schiff needed time to school the non-WB and the WB form had to be modified to allow hearsay and rumor to qualify to be reported, the release of funds likely followed the conspiracy, even though the hatching of the plot was publicized later.
     
  3. gorfias

    gorfias Well-Known Member

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    I fully believe Biden, who told us in the 1970s that he is a political whore who will prostitute himself out, accepted and/or solicited bribes. That Hunter getting big bucks from Ukraine was payoff for such whoring. And that Trump's duty was to use every power at his disposal to investigate this. Failure to do so could have been impeachable negligence.
     
  4. Daggdag

    Daggdag Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't matter whether or not Trump outright said that Ukraine wouldn't get aid if they didn't cooperate. Ukraine clearly understood that it was going to be like that, and Trump clearly intended it to be like that. An clear agreement is not needed in order to meet the requirements of quid pro quo corruption. All that's needed is for both sides to have the understanding that there is a deal.

    Since Trump clearly froze the aid for the purposes of extorting a deal out of Ukraine, and Ukrainian authorities clearly had the understanding that the aid would only go through if they cooperated with Trump, then that is considered quid pro quo corruption. It doesn't matter whether or not Trump literally told them that they wouldn't get aid if they didn't help him. Intent is enough.

    Also, it doesn't matter if there was a quid pro quo or not. It doesn't matter if Ukraine was ever going to help Trump, or even knew he was freezing their aid. The very act of attempting to extort a foreign nation into helping him for political gain constitutes corruption,and abuse of power.
    Intent is all that matters. The very fact that Trump froze the aid with the INTENT of using it to extort aid from foreign nation for political gain makes it a crime, regardless of whether or not Ukraine knew about it or was cooperating.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
  5. StillBlue

    StillBlue Well-Known Member

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    ALL federal funds are to be used by Oct 31st, that's a red herring. The funds were originally scheduled to be released in Feb.
    The Inspector General notified the House intelligence committee on Sept 9th of the whistle blower complaint and the withheld funds were released less than 48 hours later on the 11th.
    As to the rest of your post, pure tin foil hat stuff. I stand by what I said as it is all in the public record.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
  6. Tim15856

    Tim15856 Well-Known Member

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    It's so cute how the lemmings parrot the same talking point. Once their dream of getting Trump on quid pro quo seemed to a lost cause, now they all parrot the charge of "bribe" using some made up definition of the word.
     
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  7. Tim15856

    Tim15856 Well-Known Member

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    You got him now, the walls are closing in. :roflol:Lefties are such mind readers, they always know what the intent of their political rivals are and always make sure it is ill intent, but is really nothing more than projection.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
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  8. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So politics has become your religion where belief is all that matters.
     
  9. Daggdag

    Daggdag Well-Known Member

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    You don't know how military aid works do you. We give them money, and they use that money to buy arms from us. That's how we work most of our arms deals, instead of just giving them the arms themselves. Ukraine was going to buy weapons from us to use against Russia using the money we gave them.
     
  10. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Still parroting the lie about the stock market I see. Third highest market gain of all Presidential terms.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
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  11. StillBlue

    StillBlue Well-Known Member

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    Generally it's measured in % growth for comparisons. He's 4th among the last 6 presidents only beating out only Bush Jr. and Reagan after two years.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
  12. mitchscove

    mitchscove Well-Known Member Donor

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    My mistake. End of the Fiscal Year is September 30. The funds in question were to be spent by September 30
    FY19 Defense, et al AppropriationsPublic Law 115-245$250,000,000DoDOverseas Contingency Operations for Ukraine Security Assistance Initiative, available only until September 30, 2019. “...assistance, including training;equipment; lethal assistance; logistics support, supplies and services; sustainment; and intelligence support...” No “man portable air defense systems” (MANPADs) may be procured or transferred.

    Emphasis Added.
     
  13. mitchscove

    mitchscove Well-Known Member Donor

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    Should be adjusted for monetary policy. Obama enjoyed 0% interest rates until December 2015. Through 2016, he enjoyed .25% interest rates. 8 rate increases attempted to neutralize Trump getting Obama's Biggy Sized government off of the back of the economy.

    The Bush recovery from Clinton's dot-com disaster might not have ended in a recession had Pelosi and Reid not crushed the financial markets by raising the minimum wage and booting Andrew Cuomo's poor home owners out of their jobs and their homes.

    Clinton might not have done so well if there wasn't a huge investment across the economy in Y2K remediation.

    Reagan might have gotten off to a better start had Carter not scheduled a minimum wage increase in 1981.

    The boat anchor still exists and is fighting back. 4 of the 6 wealthiest counties in the country are homes to federal govt offices, employees, consultants, and Lobbyists. The CIA that Vladimir Brennan is using to attack Trump is in Fairfax, VA, the 2nd wealthiest county in the country. On a quiet night, you can hear the sound of the federal government sucking the life out of the rest of the country while targeting anyone who might stand in the way.
     
  14. StillBlue

    StillBlue Well-Known Member

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    While we're on this, Durbin introduced the bill but it was Lindsey Graham that took credit by telling Trump he was going to vote for it. Plausible deniability attempt or just another coincidence?
     
  15. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Speaking of the dem clown shows new catch word ‘bribery’.

    Ukrainian officials just released records of every Hunter Biden payment from Burisma Holdings in Ukraine:

    38 payments $83,300 each month

    $3.165 MILLION in total All from the most corrupt company in Ukraine

    ...While his dad was VP

    Why is Schiff blocking his testimony?
     
  16. mitchscove

    mitchscove Well-Known Member Donor

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    Doesn't matter. While Dems whine about protecting Ukraine and put their so-called intel 'experts' on fake news networks like CBS, it was Sen. Obama who was party to disarming Ukraine in 2005 under the promise we would protect them, and it was President Obama who allowed Putin to march in and annex Crimea.
     
  17. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The dem clown show begins again with a star witness that left government in May so was not around for any of this alleged dastardly goings on.
     
  18. Natty Bumpo

    Natty Bumpo Well-Known Member

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    The analogy to a "mob boss" insults mob bosses.

    This insightful profile: Trump has always viewed life through the prism of his next real estate deal, betting he can just bulldoze opponents into giving him what he wants. But Washington doesn’t work that way. explains Trump's habitual modus operandi, and his inability to rise and adapt to his current responsibilities.
    What is especially foul in his attempted extortion of President Zelenskiy - in the "favor" Trump sought - is that it was a coordinated attempt to pressure a foreign government to smear a political opponent, not the usual Sturm und Drang of international statecraft. The foundation for the shady caper had been laid outside legitimate channels:

    Screen Shot 2019-11-15 at 8.44.27 AM.png

    Neither the vast investigative and law enforcement resources of Trump's regime, nor Ukraine, nor China, whose help he solicited, have contrived any evidence of wrongdoing by Trump's political rival.

    Trump's personal agenda - damaging a likely Democratic nominee - did not depend upon any actual evidence being uncovered, of course, merely the appearance that Ukraine deemed such a baseless suspicion worthy of its investigation. That would be far more effective than staging pep rallies with "Lock him up! Lock him up!" being screeched by a flock of red-capped boobies.

    Trump resorted to an implicit threat to the security of a nation to further a personal political goal.

    As the report from the Republican-controlled Senate Select Committee on Intelligence concluded, the FBI, NSA, and CIA were correct in their assessment that Russia conspired to help Trump and hurt Clinton in the 2016 US presidential election. There is no evidence that Putin's and Trump's mutual goal of Trump's election was actively coordinated by their respective agents who clandestinely met and lied about it.

    There are those who desperately seek to malign the current inquiry. Such hysterical anxiety is entirely understandable.

    Their third-hand insistence that Trump did nothing wrong is "hearsay," and their ploy that exposing the truth is a conspiracy to overturn the election - in which 2.9 million more Americans preferred his unpopular opponent - is a sensationalized redundancy: All congressional actions concerning impeachment contemplate overturning an election's result, and the House leadership's adamant resistance to the action finally demanded by recent revelations bespoke their desire to avoid it.

    Ultimately, the American electorate, more knowledgeable because of the constitutional process, will serve as the jury. Were Trump to stop gagging his minions and allow them to share their insights, the American people would be even more enlightened, but a more benighted electorate is far preferable for some.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
  19. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The dem clown show is on full display today with Schiff for brains not allowing any points of order.
     
  20. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    Trump smiles too much. I don't trust people who smile too much.
     
  21. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

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    You are a little short on facts my fiend...Trump has for years talked in a fashion of a braggart and a fool. He does it to build his character and to support his super inflated ego. What he says and his true intent he is afraid to actually state because if he is wrong it falls on someones else as the fall guy, thus his need for ass smoochers in his cabinet.
     
  22. ChemEngineer

    ChemEngineer Banned

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    In a universe that is 99% hydrogen, when we have an abundance of scarce metals, minerals, fossil fuels, oxygen, nitrogen and carbon, a perfect distance from the center of our galaxy, and all of the physical constants are precise to within a fraction of 1%, otherwise no stars and no life......
     
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  23. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

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    People with fake hair and too much pride is always a dead give away not to trust them...
     
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  24. ChemEngineer

    ChemEngineer Banned

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    You should try it some time. More importantly, if smiling is your metric for trustworthiness, you need to reevaluate it very badly.
     
  25. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

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    Which only proves he is not needed to continue as such.
     

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