Mike Pence on ‘Defund the Police’: ‘We’re Going to Back the Blue,’ ‘Give More Resources to Law Enfor

You have things a bit backwards - and it is not what I suggest - these are the founding principles.

If there is a referendum - (a) 50+1 is not enough as this would be "Tyranny of the Majority" - (b) Some elected official claiming some mandate based on getting elected is Tyranny of the Majority - according to both Republicanism and Classical Liberalism.

In a Constitutional Republic - "BY Definition" - Gov't has no power to mess with essential liberty on the basis of a or b. In fact it has no power period to mess with essential liberty - Essential liberty is "Above" the legitimate authority of Gov't

For Gov't to make such law then requires a change to the social contract - construct by which we the people give authority/power to Gov't.

Gov't requires "Consent of the Governed" in order to make such law - and this consent must be an "Overwhelming Majority" at least 2/3rds. A change to the constitution requires 75% of States.

 

~ Crime is up because government allows it. Gun and ammo sales in Democrat run states & cities defunding police are through the roof. If this crime wave continues the average citizens are going to deal with it themselves and crime will quickly drop. It will be a lesson learned the hard way for the small percent of the population that will prey on the defenseless.

 

I don't think I have things backwards.

In my state at one time you could kill a man over a property crime.

Are you saying you want to bring it back?

 

~ Don't shoot unless your life is in danger ...

 

How about having a police force that can protect us from being in a position to have to try to determine that in the 1st place with the castle, stand your ground, and open or concealed carry and 2A rights there in the rare moments the police can’t get there soon enough.

 

yes, I would support more federal dollars going to my local police, this is what the left wants, new departments to handle things like mental illness and that will take funding

I would not support for example, more funding for the war on drugs

 

~ Yes that is what most of us want. However today CHAZ can happen anywhere with these goofy Democrat run states and cities. Really hard to believe ...

 

You think they will detain people differently. I doubt it.

“yup, this dumbass is mentally ill. Take him down.”

knowing someone is mentally ill isn’t going to make them less violent.

 

No idea why you would suggest the above ? I never mentioned property crime.

 

Oh boy! More tanks and missile systems to combat crime...

 

Are you amendable to it?

 

No -but my opinion on the issue is irrelevant to the legitimacy of such law. If you can get and "overwhelming majority" 2/3rds to agree - that some action is so dangerous to society - that the state need be "given" the power to punish those who engage in such action - then the law is legitimate. If you can't - it is not. Keeping in mind this is w/r to essential liberty -

The legit authority of Gov't is protection from harm - direct harm -one person on another (murder rape theft ) - so your example of a property crime is within the legit authority of gov't in a way unlike Pot.

I apologize for the "Political Science" speak but, when talking legal issues it is important to use correct terminology. "Legitimacy of Authority" means something - in legal speak -and when looking at the Founding principles. There are defined parameters as to what constitutes "Legit" vs "Not Legit" authority .. and we can go over that if you like - basically going over what the purpose of the DOI is and what it says and means.

But for simplicity sake

The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.
-- Thomas Jefferson, Notes on the State of Virginia, 1781-82


Tom packs alot into one sentence 1) legit authority is for only acts that are injurious to others 2) authority of Gov't does not come from God.

These are 2 of the fundamental teachings from the DOI - setting out some principles by which Law and the Constitution are to be interpreted.

 

republican States probably not, dems States maybe, time will tell, more federal funding is not a bad thing though

you send the people that handle mental illness with cops - same as other departments can go with cops, it's not all or nothing, common sense must be used - 99.9% of mental cases can be handled without cops escalating the situation and being violent

 

the explosion of crime is because we have the worst President we have had in a long time, and we now have the worst economy we have had in a long time

Biden will have to spend the next 8 years trying to dig us out of this mess, and I am not sure it's possible

 

CHAZ was a scary thing for sure. I live in the same democrat controlled state you do but fortunately my county and city are not.

 

You actually oppose more training and accountability for police officers and increased public safety?

 

While I strongly oppose defunding the police, I had to vote No because there was no option to maintain current levels.

 

Where the hell did you get that statistic?? If someone with mental illness is violent to the point that cops are called, their is a pretty good chance force will have to be used to calm the person down.

 

~ Unfortunately this is often the case. People are scared from someone's behavior and call police. When the situation escalates to violence it's not the time/place for psychoanalysis. These people are often on drugs. Very dangerous to everyone involved.
I am fairly certain that at this point it is the general population that needs "training" on how to interact with police - not the other way around.

 

The current training they are getting seems to be rather lethal for those in custody because of a lack of restraint bgy those already trained..

 

yes, the new department would be used for non-violent people, if they later become violent, the police would take over at their request

hospitals have a good record of not using a gun as a first resort to handling people with mental issues, most people with mental issues are not violent

I think medical personnel are just better trained, I do not think it's that cops are not as brave

 

A very subjective statement.

 

If they are not violent, police will not be violent. They are humans, not monsters.

 

if that were the case, this would not be a issue, sadly that is not the case

 

So you think police officers are monsters. That’s pretty sad.