Pathway to sensible gun reform,

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by archives, Nov 13, 2017.

  1. Cubed

    Cubed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think the mish-mash of laws is why I'd prefer and overarching Federal Law vs a hodge-podge of state ones. I'd pull back on the most onerous ones, and push forward on the really lax ones to find a middle ground. Differences in gun laws are the loopholes that many go through.

    Technically, any restriction on firearm ownership is a 'Restriction'. So, as the SC says that some restrictions are reasonable, now it's just a matter of dickering over which ones to implement.
     
  2. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    Please soundly demonstrate how anything I said is wrong.
     
  3. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    I said no such thing; the ignorance of your statements speaks for itself.
     
  4. TrackerSam

    TrackerSam Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You'll never know because you won't be around to see it.
     
  5. Dispondent

    Dispondent Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Semi-automatic weapons have many purposes, its an ideal type of weapon for hunting feral hogs, coyotes, and other pest animals that tend to roam in large numbers. Yet every year semi-automatic rifles only kill a tiny portion of those killed by guns. In our inner cities semi-automatic handguns are the weapon of choice for gang members to hunt their feral human kin.

    What I don't get about you gun grabbers is how you can latch onto a few excessively rare instances and completely ignore thousands and thousands of daily incidences without batting an eye...
     
  6. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    Semi-automatic weapons are in common use for all of the legal purposes of a firearm; as such, they qualify as "bearable arms" and fall under the protection of the 2nd.
    Thus, it doesn't matter if anyone thinks we "need" them.
     
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  7. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    That would be against the retailer not the manufacturer. The manufacturer has nothing to do with the retail sale.
     
  8. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Can you show the ad they run that promote their product to be used unlawfully?
     
  9. Bastiats libertarians

    Bastiats libertarians Well-Known Member

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    A couple of talking points to add to this.

    1. The NRA direct lobbying expenditure for the entire year was slightly over 3 million dollars. Which equates to about $6,000 per congressmen and house rep. Which means that the NRA lobbying isn’t even in the top 50 of lobby donations per senator.

    2. The best path forward is to strengthen the background check program and to hold government officials accountable for failure to document criminals who pass background checks they should not. We also need to invest money and man power into enforcement of said laws. If you illegally sell or make a straw purchase you should be charged for the same crime as was done with that firearm. Legal purchases should not result in charges.

    3. Give up on the semi automatic ban and large magazine ban. Utterly pointless. For that matter just give up on banning anything less powerful than a fully automatic rifle.

    4. Mandatory waiting periods of 6 days in all 50 states. Shut up conservatives, this is about saving potential suicide victims. I promise you will be fine waiting a week. Don’t be a child.

    5. Ccw permits should be honored in all 50 states no exceptions. All bans on semi automatic rifles should be repealed in all states.

    6. People moving or traveling through states that have different gun laws than the states they came from or destination should be held to the laws of either the state they came from or their destination. Tired of people getting pulled over going from Michigan to North Carolina and being charged for possession in Maryland.

    7. All firearms sold, including privately must have a background check done through an FFL dealer. It’s not that damn hard. Giving firearms to family members who can legal posses then (father/son) should not require a background check.
     
  10. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    A right delayed is a right denied.
    This can only affect someone who will only commit suicide with a gun, and does not already own one. Thus, there's no rational argument for forcing -everyone- to wait 6 days, especially those who already have a gun.
    Absent universal registration, universal background checks are unenforceable.
     
  11. Bastiats libertarians

    Bastiats libertarians Well-Known Member

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    Horse ****. If it takes a week to acquire it you still acquire it your right is not denied. There is a rational argument for it. People who want to commit suicide usually will change their mind within 48 hours if they don’t have access to the tools to do it. That’s a fact. I am a rabid gun owner and own several semi automatic and I can stand to wait 6 days to acquire a weapon should I need it.

    The government can absolutely enforce the law by simply pulling the denied checks list and doing an investigation. No need for registration at all
     
  12. Professor Peabody

    Professor Peabody Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  13. Aphotic

    Aphotic Banned

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  14. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    Ah. You disagree with Dr King. Interesting.
    How about a 6 day wait on abortions? Constitutional?

    You also have yet to explain the necessity for this -- how many people buy a gun to commit suicide with, and how many of them will only use a gun? You also have not explained why people who already have guns should also need to wait.

    You need to show a compelling state interest here, and how the restriction you want is the least restrictive means to achieve it.
    Really.
    I sell a gun to a stranger;l i did not run a background check.
    Absent one of us talking - and why would we? - how does the state prove I violated the law?
     
  15. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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  16. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    So fat people can sue spoon manufacturers?
     
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  17. Professor Peabody

    Professor Peabody Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    How you get that out of 27 million guns sold in 2016 I'll never know. Have you been denied a purchase?
     
  18. Mrlucky

    Mrlucky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I support the Hearing Protection Act.

    Hearing Protection Act of 2017. This bill amends the Internal Revenue Code to: (1) eliminate the $200 transfer tax on firearm silencers, and (2) treat any person who acquires or possesses a firearm silencer as meeting any registration or licensing requirements of the National Firearms Act with respect to such silencer.

    H.R.367 - Hearing Protection Act of 2017 115th Congres…
     
  19. Bastiats libertarians

    Bastiats libertarians Well-Known Member

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    We’re talking about guns not abortions. Straw man argument. 70 percent of all successful suicides are done by firearms. Suicides make up 2/3 of all gun deaths, roughly 20,000 or so suicides a year. So for the sake of argument let’s say half of them buy a gun to execute the suicide your still looking at 10,000 possible preventable suicides. Which is almost as many as all firearm deaths combined. If I have to wait 5 days to save even half that number to acquire my 8th firearm it’s totally worth it.
     
  20. Xenamnes

    Xenamnes Banned

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    Except for the simple, undeniable fact, that there is no hard evidence that proves conclusively, that the desire to commit suicide comes into existence only once the individual in question has decided to legally purchase a firearm, that this desire ceases to exist after a five to ten day waiting period, or that once the initial desire passes it never comes into existence again.

    It is mind boggling that the act of suicide can be completely unpredictable, while simultaneously being easily predictable as to coincide with legal firearms purchases.
     
  21. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    Ah. You see the validity of my point - a right delayed IS a right denied. Good.
    The CDC says 51.7% - 313k out of 605k, 1999-2015.
    Um... no.
    If you want to argue it is necessary to limit everyone's right with a 6 day wait, you don't get to make up numbers in support.
    How many people buy a gun for the purpose of suicide, and how many of them will only use a gun?

    You also have not explained why people who already have guns should also need to wait. Well?

    And, again:
    I sell a gun to a stranger; l did not run a background check.
    Absent one of us talking - and why would we? - how does the state prove I violated the law?
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017
  22. DDT

    DDT Banned

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    You need to at least watch this before giving anything relating to Sandy Hook any credibility whatsoever !!!!! It's a good start .

     
  23. Woolley

    Woolley Well-Known Member

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    You got that right. You don't need them, we don't want them and if you need them to feel like a man, you are one sorry excuse for a man.
     
  24. QLB

    QLB Well-Known Member

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    Till you absolutely need one.
     
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  25. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    Wow. There's a rational, reasoned argument if I ever read one.
    Not.
     
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