Rightwingers: America is Multi-Racial. Get used to it.

you didn't make that point. And maybe not wanting to pay 4 diabetes treatment will help people take better care of themselves.

I disagree life isn't fair and laws should not be made to make it fair.

That's how we lose Liberty.

no. Not only can I not afford it but it would be stupid to pay for it just get it when I get sick because I can't be denied.

And that's the problem with making it to where you can't be denied or where you can't be charged more based on your condition.

What I'm doing it's called being smart don't pay for something you don't need if it's going to cost you the same when you need it.

 

There have certainly been cases where someone with their hands up or back turned got shot by police.

But, remember that my post identified the problem as the police losing the trust of the population.

Surely "hands up don't shoot" is a strong indicator that there are communities that have absolutely NO trust in the police. I mean, if you're asking the police not to shoot you when you have your hands up, it's a pretty clear indication that you don't believe the police have the slightest element of humanity, don't you think?

And, THAT is what has to change.

 

But, you don't know that will hold even for the rest of this year. There are numerous threats to health and you are as susceptible as the next guy for most of them.

Several of the countries that have single payer type systems have limited coverage for all. If you want additional coverage, you have to buy that.

The same is true with our Medicare system.

Beyond that, the healthcare of other countries is of comparable quality. Suggesting that everyone outside the US has s*** healthcare is just plain nonsense.

 

Hmmm.... I don't buy that logic. Here is a specific case where we KNOW ... as well as we're able to know .... what happened. A young Black attacked a policeman, tried to get his gun, ran away, then turned around and ran back to attack the policeman again, and was shot. Just what would happen to a young white man who did the same thing. And the Left and BLM KNOW that's what happened, but continue to propagate the lie.

Now ... if they really cared about ending police brutality, as opposed to just discrediting the police, they would use REAL examples, not phony ones. But their credulous audience just swallows these lies whole.

Since they lie about this, very clear-cut, issue -- why should we believe anything else they say?

Let's be crystal clear about this: the "Hands Up, Don't Shoot" slogan is a conscious, deliberate lie.

And I do NOT believe that, today, in general the police go around shooting innocent Blacks. It DOES happen ... and it happens to innocent whites too... but I do not believe that the normal, day to day, interaction of Blacks with police is one of racist brutality. It is dangerous to be a young Black male in the inner-city -- we know that ... how many? 50? ... have already been killed in Chicago this year. Not by police, but by each other. They need more, stricter ... maybe even more 'brutal' .. police presence in Chicago.

It would be really good if you, and other people who think like you, could ride in a police car for a full shift on a Saturday night. I'm not saying this to be polemical. I think it would give you a much deeper appreciation of the 'the Black problem'.

Another point: nowadays, many inner-city policemen are Black. And they're hated by the BLM and similar types just as much, if not more, than white policemen. Are these Black policemen 'racist'? I doubt it -- they're just responding to the horrible behavior of a lot of inner-city residents.

 

What makes you think the avg person doesn't get in a car wreck or have their car stolen? Do you think the people who get in car wrecks are somehow 'special' people?
When it comes to group insurance the coverage has to be one size fits all. My company has about 30,000+ people...do you really think BCBS, or whichever plan, can administer 30,000+ different plans? With all of the employer groups BCBS has they could have to administer tens of millions of different plans. Aside from that not being efficient....it would be an administrative nightmare. You think there are administrative errors now...try have millions of different plans to keep track of.

 

And yet each of those 30,000+ people has their own car insurance plan.

 

Oh but I did. You just didn't want to see it. Right....if being 400 lbs isn't incentive enough to try to take better care of themselves nothing will.

Really? Pre-x is going to cause you to lose liberty. What a crock of *****.

Ah...so you're one of the people gaming the system and causing healthcare costs to spike. Your part of the problem. Not surprising.

 

You're missing the issue. You may or may not win an argument about whether some specific incident was legitimate. But, I doubt it.

And, it doesn't actually make any difference.

Again, the problem is that the police lost the trust of the people.

Tell me about THAT problem. Because THAT is the problem that is important.

Until that problem is solved, what you happen to think about some incident just doesn't matter at all - even regardless of whether you're right.

As for there being black policemen, let's face it. Police can lose trust regardless of their color.

 

Which are standard plans and much less complicated than health insurance. Please tell me you know this.

 

So? The rules are set up to where I can buy "insurance" after I get sick for the same price. Only a fool would pay for it before they need it.

But you can't pay more for better service.

To country hospitals yes.

Because you want to be right?

Just declaring things i state to be nonsense is no kind of argument.

 

Health insurance plans are also standard. Various options, and various money limits. All standardized and modular. Just like auto insurance.

 

So you don't know what an average is? On average car accidents are rare as is theft.

So your insurance is impossible?

 

That is the definition of insurance.

 

Well, I think we're just going to have to disagree here.

If the Black community distrust Black policemen ... then we have to ask ourselves, is this distrust really justified? I assume Black policemen aren't white racists.

I absolutely understand that police can be biased, can be dishonest. A long time ago -- Christmas 1965, I think -- a friend of mine and I came down from college to New York City to help C.O.R.E. in its rent strike work. We and a reporter from the Village Voice went to a particular tenant's flat where a 'slumlord' (as we called them) was known to be at that time, to serve some sort of legal document on him. (I forget the details.) As we handed it to him, the reporter took a flash photograph -- and this enraged him and he attacked us. My friend was knocked down the stairs and bloodied. The police turned up pretty quickly and ... detained (not arrested) us! They took us down to the police station. As we came in, the desk sergeant asked the policemen who brought us in what had happened, and he replied -- "These two CORE guys tried to rob a landlord". (I was a political radical by then but my reflexive understanding of America was still based on Hollywood images -- the police as good guys. I was shocked, not just by the lie, but by the stupidity of the lie -- two middle class college boy radicals, robbing a landlord .. ha! )He also was overweight and had greasy too-long hair, which also undercut my naive image of policemen. Of course, had we been Black, we would probably have gotten worse treatment. As it was, CORE brought a bunch demonstrators down to the police station not long after, and we were released. (Not because of the demonstrators, I'm sure, but because the 'charge' was so absurd.)

In Houston, I had an acquaintance, Lee Otis Johnson. He was a typical ghetto hustler who latched onto the political radicalization of the time and became a 'spokesman' for the Black community. Naive white radicals ate his nonsense up. A con-man, but ... the police didn't like him. He made the mistake of selling a joint to an undercover cop and got ... thirty years in prison for it. (He did four of them, before a judge let him out.) I don't think a white college student would have got such a sentence. His story, which you can read here, is, in my opinion, iconic of the Black problem. Racism, no doubt ... but that wasn't his main problem.

The problem is: the police don't trust the Black community. They know that Blacks are far more likely to be violent than whites are. They extend this distrust to all Blacks, not just to the violent criminal minority. This then influences how they treat Black suspects -- they are more likely to use force (although not, as it happens, deadly force) against them, than against white suspects in the same circumstances.

This is not going to be changed very much, because the underlying cause of their behavior is not some sort of abstract racial prejudice -- Black policemen are not white racists -- but 'statistical prejudice'.... the same sort of 'prejudice' that would keep you from walking through a Black neighborhood at night in circumstances where you would walk through a white neighborhood.

As you say, it will take a long time to change this. Education is the key. (Also, I think we've hijacked this thread, making what was originally an argument about Obamacare into one about racism in America.)

 

Sure Spooks, I believe you

 

No it isn't. CAREFUL vetting of migrants is the key.

 

Hello Crank!

Friend or Foe this evening?

 

Always friend. Whether you're a 25 year babe, or a 67 year old obese male

 

Absolutely!

 

Yes...that was my point.

 

Right. So 30,000+ people could just as easily each have their own medical insurance policies just as they have their own auto insurance policies.

 

No, car accidents and thefts are not rare

What in bloody hell are you talking about?

 

So tell me again why we pay twice as much for healthcare as other first world countries that have single payer government programs?

 

Oh my lord did you ever miss the point. Someone else was arguing that we should all be able to have our own individual plans with whatever coverage we so choose. That means it won’t be standard. An insurer is not going to administer 30,000 different l, as in all 30,000 plans being vastly different from each other, for a specific employer group. That is an administrative nightmare and also makes the underwriting next to impossible. It’s not efficient or effective.

 

Living longer is not better?
1/2 the cost is not better?