Russia Declares War on Ukraine<<MOD WARNING>>

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by Bill Carson, Feb 23, 2022.

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  1. ManYacK

    ManYacK Banned

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    you're lying again. There are no conscripts in Ukraine - only contract soldiers. Having lied about one thing, Highly likely you lie about everything.
     
  2. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    Makes no difference whether they're conscripts who signed a contract or just plain conscripts. They're demoralized, lacking supplies and getting wrecked.
     
  3. ManYacK

    ManYacK Banned

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    Well, you, from across the ocean, of course, know better who is demoralized there and who lacks supplies. You might think those 16k mercenaries who fly to Ukraine to die will be provided with top-notch supplies :)
     
  4. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    https://www.timesofisrael.com/israe...critical-choice-capitulation-or-calamity/amp/

    There is a good chance this war will end soon.
    Israel says Russians now want demilitarization of Donbas and recognition of Crimea. On the top of that - neutrality, but no demilitarization and no EU restriction.
    I think Zelensky will work with that, as he already signaled he is cooling to the idea of Ukraine joining nato. I think most would agree here that Ukraine should be a strong neutral state. It earned its spot under the sun with this war.
     
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  5. ManYacK

    ManYacK Banned

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    how so? Ukraine was going to win ... and then suddenly, instead of indemnities, she is ready to give up Crimea. And agree to all the conditions that were originally. :-D

    Yes, this politician deserves his place under the sun... under the sun of Rostov.
     
  6. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Well-Known Member

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    The Russians are still banking on the Israelis, which is why they shouldn't ever be trusted as far as anyone can throw them. Their "reportedly" softened demands are less than the things they could have easily had, and at far less price, if they had followed the course I had outlined from day 1: take-over the breakaway regions; no ground invasion/occupation of Ukraine proper; ultimatum for Ukraine to commit to strict neutrality (both NATO/EU), backed up by Russian aerial (missiles, drones, combat aircraft), cyber warfare, and special forces, driving whatever would remain of Ukraine's government and command & control underground until they capitulated.
     
  7. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Well-Known Member

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    If the settlement works along the lines the Israelis are pushing, the only thing the Russians will have gained is a hugely diminished status in the world with practically nothing to show for it despite the huge costs and investment. Crimea was in no danger from Ukraine and the rest is sugar coating Russian capitulation. A capitulation which is the direct consequence of Russia's tactical and strategic mistakes. Ukraine was never going to be part of NATO anytime soon, but now it will be a western client state more than ever before: economically, militarily, geopolitically.
     
  8. Kyklos

    Kyklos Well-Known Member Donor

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    What an excellent article! Very well written, and I think best summarizes my own view. Thank you for saying the unsayable!

    I wouldn’t call it “Whataboutism,” but simply contradiction. If one advocates submitting a war crime complaint against Russia before the International Criminal Court, but at the same time refuses to recognize the same court’s authority to prosecute—that’s a contradiction, incoherence, and irrationality!

    “Whataboutism” is a linguistic meme meant to discourage discussing inconsistency, contradiction and irrationality. Showing a contradiction is not the same fallacy as “Tu quoque,” or in English, “Two Wrongs Make A Right Fallacy,” as the article points out. War fever resulting from Empire Wars would miss these subtle, but important distinctions.

    Is ‘Whataboutism’ Always Bad? (ft. Nathan J. Robinson)
     
  9. Richard Franks

    Richard Franks Well-Known Member

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    It's going to be hard for Putin regardless on dangerous he will be. That would include his own people and maybe himself.
     
  10. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Well-Known Member

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    Yet, Libya, Serbia, and Syria were all Russian allies. The Russians can't go on blinking all the time, working to have their cake and eat it too, betraying their allies every chance even when their presence in Syria was explicitly based on division of responsibility where they were supposed to handle and protect Syrian airspace (not pressure Assad to keep Iran backed forces away from the Israeli border and occupied area or getting involved on the ground and actions to hurt Syria's most effective units such as Syria's 4th armored division). The fact that Russia is, indeed, a superpower when it comes to nukes (nukes and hyper-sonic missiles only), makes their habitual blinking even more dangerous since it leaves no clear red lines, increasing the chances of miscalculation on all sides.
     
  11. bigfella

    bigfella Well-Known Member

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    I love it when you set out to prove me right Jenny. I was referencing the work of Mr Lancaster in my post. Vile Putinista shill that he is he is the guy who filmed the report of the 'IED attack' where it was painfully clear that the whole thing was faked right down to the corpses in the car with obvious signs of autopsy. Sounds like your sort of 'independent' journalist Jenny - one who reads straight from Putin's script.

    Weren't you telling us that there wasn't going to be an invasion? Weren't you telling us that Zelensky is in Poland? I can't keep track of the untruths and I honestly can't tell if you even know that the stuff you vomit up for us every day is lies & propaganda. I think you just believe it because Putin says it is true....therefore proving the accuracy of my assessment.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2022
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  12. bigfella

    bigfella Well-Known Member

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    Bigger than someone who shills for Putin Jenny. You are cheering as he shells Ukrainian cities. Not hard to be better than that.
     
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  13. bigfella

    bigfella Well-Known Member

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    He is a known liar who produces propaganda for Putin. Assume anything he does is a lie unless comprehesively proven otherwise. Also assume people who cite him are untrustworthy sources too.
     
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  14. Silver Surfer

    Silver Surfer Banned

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    Stop showing your ignorance. To establish a no fly zone over Ukraine the USA/NATO will have to take air defenses systems which are based on the Russian territory. It is obvious that you don't understand what are you talking about. The good thing people like you have a zero say when it comes to a decision making.
     
  15. Silver Surfer

    Silver Surfer Banned

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    If Putin and Russians didn't learn their lessons from the Balkans, Libya and Syria then they will have only themselves to blame. The USA will never be an honest negotiator. Their desirable goal is the destruction of the Russian Federation and war crime trials for Russian elites. The time isn't on Putin's side. He will have to make a historic decision before Brutus takes him out.
     
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  16. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    1 min ago
    Retired US and European military leaders advocate for advanced air defenses for Ukraine

    From CNN's Kylie Atwood and Peter Bergen

    A group of senior retired US military officers and former chiefs of defense of three Eastern European countries are advocating for supplying the Ukrainian military with air defense capabilities to defend against attacks by the Russian air force, according to an open letter obtained by CNN.

    Supplying the Ukrainians with such weaponry would be effective in allowing them to shoot down aircraft or missiles in their airspace, and it is something that Ukrainians have specially asked the US and western countries to provide.

    “The purpose of this letter is to urge, in the strongest possible sense, immediate action to provide the Ukrainian Armed Forces with a viable mid- and high-altitude air defense capability. They need immediate reconstitution of their capability to defend themselves against air attacks from the Russian Air Force,” the retired military officials write. “We cannot stand idly by and wish them well as Russia prosecutes an unrestricted campaign of destruction on the Ukrainian government, its infrastructure, and its people.”​

    ... Live updates: https://www.cnn.com/europe/live-news/ukraine-russia-putin-news-03-09-22/index.html
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2022
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  17. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    Pretty good assessment, except that I would not call Ukraine a client state. ;)
     
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  18. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    Another video by Russians explaining what they think about this war (from Feb. 26):



    I should note that they provide English subtitles.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2022
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  19. Richard Franks

    Richard Franks Well-Known Member

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    Many Ukrainian families are fleeing the homeland to avoid the war. If Putin still thinks he can win over Ukraine and be the Dictator, it's going to be more difficult than he thinks. An evil man like Putin will make his bed and will have to lay in it. I still believe Ukraine despite their homeland being leveled, will still come out the winner no matter how long this will take.
     
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  20. Richard Franks

    Richard Franks Well-Known Member

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    Zelenskyy warns Russian soldiers to not believe their commanders 'when they tell you that you still have a chance in Ukraine' (msn.com)
    • Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy told Russian troops on Wednesday to avoid putting their trust in their commanders.
    • "Nothing is waiting for you here," he said. "Except for captivity, except for death."
    • Zelenskyy's stern warning comes after reports that Russian soldiers were misled about the war.
      Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy reiterated his message to Russian soldiers that they should not believe their commanding officers.

      "Do not believe your commanders when they tell you that you still have a chance in Ukraine," he said in a Wednesday address. "Nothing is waiting for you here. Except for captivity, except for death."

      "You take our lives and give yours," his address continued. "And we know — we have communications interception — that your commanders already understand everything."

      Zelenskyy's stern warning comes just days after a scathing New York Times report that said Russian soldiers on the front lines in Ukraine were not told they would be going into war.

      According to various firsthand accounts from soldiers collected by The Times, Russian soldiers were lied to and kept in the dark about battle plans.

      A captured Russian lieutenant found out about the Ukrainian invasion just hours before going into battle, according to The Times. And soldiers who were ranked lower only found out when they were already on the move, having crossed the Russian border into Ukraine.

      Zelenskyy has the right idea when it comes to defending Ukraine. I hope Russia expects to take massive losses on their side if they think they can win with Putin and I believe it will be doubtful that Russia will take over Ukraine. Chances for this are starting to dwindle if they haven't already.
    • [​IMG]
     
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  21. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    Putin's pawns. It's all so tragic for them as well as for the Ukrainians.
     
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  22. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    2 min ago
    US defense official says Russia still has about "90% of their available combat power" ready to use in Ukraine

    From CNN's Ellie Kaufman

    Russia has about “90% of their available combat power still ready for their use” in Ukraine, a senior US defense official told reporters on Wednesday.

    The US assesses Russia no longer has “several hundred vehicles of different stripes and sizes” available to them, but the US does not know if those vehicles were captured, destroyed or abandoned, the official added.

    CNN first reported Tuesday that the US estimated that as much as 8% to 10% of Russian military assets used in the invasion of Ukraine are now destroyed or inoperable, according to a US official familiar with the latest intelligence as of Tuesday.

    The equipment lost includes tanks, aircraft, artillery and other military assets. That is close to double the losses that CNN reported last week when it was estimated Russia had lost 3% to 5% of its military assets.​

    Live updates: https://www.cnn.com/europe/live-news/ukraine-russia-putin-news-03-09-22/index.html

    10% of Russia's massive invasion force is pretty significant, I would say, especially given that this is less than two weeks in and Russia has not made significant gains.
     
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  23. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    16 min ago
    British foreign secretary says UK will supply air defense systems to Ukraine

    From CNN's Sugam Pokharel and Sharon Braithwaite

    British Foreign Secretary Liz Truss said on Wednesday that the UK will supply air defense systems to Ukraine.

    “The best way to help protect the skies is through anti-air weaponry, which the UK is now going to be supplying to Ukraine,” Truss said speaking alongside her American counterpart Secretary of State Antony Blinken in Washington.

    The UK is not seeking to set up a no-fly zone over evacuation corridors in Ukraine as that would "lead to a direct confrontation between NATO and Russia. And that is not what we are looking at," she said.

    Truss said the UK would like see a full ban on Russia from the SWIFT payment system and all the G7 countries ending its use of Russian oil and gas.

    “So we must go further and faster in our response. We must double down on our sanctions,” she added.

    The foreign secretary said that while Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is causing "immense pain and suffering,” Russian President Vladimir Putin is “not making the progress he planned.”

    “We have surprised Putin with our unity and the toughness of our sanctions, hitting the banks, the ships, the planes, the oligarchs, and the oil and gas revenues. And the brave Ukrainian people have surprised him with their determination and their leadership,” she said.

    Now is not the time to let up. Putin must fail,” Truss said.​

    Live updates: https://www.cnn.com/europe/live-news/ukraine-russia-putin-news-03-09-22/index.html

    Finally! This and the eventual delivery of MiGs should make a YUGE difference in the long term.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2022
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  24. Kyklos

    Kyklos Well-Known Member Donor

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    In regard to the Ukrainian Nazi problem that will soon will be Biden's Nazi problem on argument one: "But Zelensky is Jewish!"

    Israel Is Arming Ukraine's Blatantly Neo-Nazi Militia the Azov Battalion
     
  25. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    1 min ago
    Amazon halts retail shipments to Russia and cuts off Prime Video

    From CNN’s Brian Fung

    Amazon has suspended access to Prime Video in Russia, and the e-commerce giant is no longer shipping retail orders to customers in both Russia and Belarus, the company said Tuesday.

    In addition, Amazon added, it is no longer selling New World, the company's recently released online multiplayer video game, in Russia.

    The decisions mark the latest steps by Amazon to back away from Russia, and coincide with a move CNN previously reported to halt new signups for Amazon Web Services, Amazon's massively lucrative cloud computing platform.

    "Given the ongoing situation in Russia and Ukraine, we’ve taken additional actions in the region," Amazon said in a blog post. "We’ve suspended shipment of retail products to customers based in Russia and Belarus, and we will no longer be accepting new Russia and Belarus-based AWS customers and Amazon third-party sellers. We are also suspending access to Prime Video for customers based in Russia, and we will no longer be taking orders for New World, which is the only video game we sell directly in Russia."

    The announcement follows an earlier Amazon statement that it has been providing cybersecurity assistance to Ukraine and had observed malicious state and non-state actors attempting to hack "charities, NGOs, and other aid organizations in order to spread confusion and cause disruption."​

    Live updates: https://www.cnn.com/europe/live-news/ukraine-russia-putin-news-03-09-22/index.html
     
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