The moral decay of society

Yes, there needs to be a logical reason for "thou shalt not kill".

If you're going to go off on christian white supremacists, they might have read a few pages out of the Ol' OT where god ain't exactly against killing people. Hell, he came up with that as a punishment because of Eve.

 

Morality would not exist were in not for us. It is defined by us. Now while the social aspect does play a part it is largely hardwired into us through empathy. When others feel harm, we feel harm, and so on. Whether you call this inherent personal concept the soul or a conscience doesn't really matter. Thus any ethics stem from this concept of harm and the relative amount of it. Anything that does harm to you or others is immoral. There is no need of a God, though sure you could put it in there, but really kind of redundant/unnecessary and is really just an easy way out of coming up with a reason offhand. Like Belch just said. "Cause I said so".

 

Well, I tried that one a few times, but my kids weren't having it.

But yes, you're right. It's about being consistent. I don't want you to steal from me, you don't want me to steal from you, so we have a shared moral value. Is there somebody who might want to be stolen from, and they can steal from us? There are many who will say something like "Yeah, I'll take your stuff, and if you try to take my stuff, I'll kill you!"

That's not a shared moral value, and that is the essence of morality. It's the golden rule that allows us to develop a shared moral value that everybody agrees to. The same is true for every moral value. If it's shared, then we have a moral truism that can be applied no matter what.

Do you agree that I shouldn't kill you? Do I agree that you shouldn't kill me? Then we have the basics of an ethical agreement that doesn't need religion. All we need is the idea that nobody should hurt anybody, because nobody really wants to be hurt.

This is why things like taxation are immoral. They want to take 10% of my earnings, but do they want me to take 10% of their earnings? Let's make it 100% and the same answer which is "hell no!"

Lefties are immoral because they want to do to others that they don't want done to themselves.

 

Not quite that simple. Simple concepts aren't necessarily simple in practice. Ie concepts like fractals, organized chaos, etc, while simple in concept are not actually simple at all. This also applies to morality. I don't mind taxes as long as it helps me. If it helps another person who also helps me, even better. A rich person effectively gets more back for the same amount of taxes, which is harmful to me and the next person in the grand scheme of things, so they get taxed more. Nice try to get out of paying your taxes though. I couldn't help you anyway as I don't work for the IRS and it would be difficult to bribe me, but I like how you shoved the concept of progressive taxation in there.

 

So we cant have a society unless it is mutually agreed upon, according to your definition of mutually agreed upon. Good luck with that. Also, what crazy scheme are you talking about? Taxes in general?, cause that's not mine and if not could you please enlighten us on this magical way of funding a government, even a minimalist one, without some form of taxes, or fees (taxes).

 

We can have all sorts of societies, but a moral society needs to be mutually agreed upon by everybody involved.

would slaves agree to be slaves? I rather doubt they would.

 

I don't remember saying anything about this crazy scheme of yours. You'd have to quote it. The rest borders on random ad hom but I'll waive it since I'm tired right now.

Agreed, I hate paying for wars I don't want. The problem is our representatives don't actually represent us. So, yeah there is no mutual agreement. In reality we should be revolting because "no taxation without representation", but we are too comfortable with our opium for the masses. Not sure where you were going with the taxes thing, but I'll just head somewhere since you didn't respond.

 

Another massive load of bovine excrement!

It is only those on the RIGHT that have a problem paying taxes, NOT those on the left.

 

Don't you, Mr. Logic and Reason?

You seem not to understand the term. What you quoted presents no logical argument, it merely challenges you to do so.

lol

And if in your reply you fail to use the quote function per rule 15, the conversation terminates.

 

I could be wrong, but doesn't every television have an Off button? No one is forcing you to get yourself out of the 1950s. Heck, most cable and satellite providers include TV Land in their lineups, just stay tuned to that and it will be like those good ol' days are still here.

What your children watch is up to you, isn't it? Don't you pay close attention to what they watch, what they listen to, who they associate with, what they read, and so forth? That always worked for me, but it does take a lot of time and effort. And personal responsibility ... don't conservatives believe that personal responsibility is key to a moral society? I certainly do.

Morality is not about who has sex with who, it's about who does what to who, and for what reasons. It's about living by the golden rule, and doing no harm. Who we have sex with is no one else's business as long as it is between consenting adults.

 

Yes, the good old Christian "buy bull" with all it's rules about who to stone to death for what reasons.

The logical reason for "Thou shalt not kill" is pretty clear, Belch. It is simply crushingly wrong to deprive someone else of life. It not only ends their life, but possibly traumatizes their family, maybe leaving them destitute and dependent upon others. It also harms the killer emotionally, unless said killer is a sociopath. The only time it is logical to kill another person is if they are trying to kill you or your loved ones.

Do you really need this spelled out for you? Or are you simply trolling for a "fight?"

 

Trouble is, if you are brought up to steal, stealing from someone is just part of your moral nature.