Vatican bars gay union blessing, says God 'can't bless sin'

Its about gay marriage, but we can talk about participation too. Why would you insist on participating with an organization if you are in complete disagreement with their beliefs?

So, again, does it make sense for a vegetarian to go to a steak house knowing they do not serve food he/she finds acceptable? The answer is no, it doesnt make sense.

There ARE churches who wed gays.

 

Pretty much all evangelical churches allow sinners to enter knowing Jesus came specifically for sinners. However, they are not going to wed gays knowing it would lock them into a permanent state of sin. The church, like Jesus, ask for repentance and for people to 'sin no more', or at least make an effort to do so.

That is what mosaic law says about it. It is not what the new covenant says. Not even Israelis put people to death for it.

 

Something tells me they wouldn't have had you anyway.


Many other churches have tried watering-down their message, and they ultimately lose most of their members and drastically decline after two or three decades.

It's always good to listen to advice, but sometimes we shouldn't listen to advice from people who are going to have very little loyalty towards us, whether that advice was followed or not.

Maybe we can play buffet-style religion, where we selectively pick different stuff from different religions to put on our plate, and choose the stuff we want to hear.
(saying that in sarcasm)

 

I'm no catholic, and in fact I'm far more sympathetic to many of the 'conspiracy theories' regarding catholicism than I am its own doctrine and narratives... but I do think its being consistent if not genuine on at least this issue. It has long effectively been the catholic church's position (if not its stated position) that marriage is largely about procreation (go forth and be fruitful etc). It stands to reason in my mind that the church cant bless a union that will necessarily result in two people not procreating. Its kinda like saying 'we can't tell you you're doing it right when you're doing it wrong.' This of course becomes totally ridiculously bureaucratic when the church will bless a union where, for example, 'go forth and be fruitful' is being undermined by parents who create children and then abuse or neglect them so severely that the children grow up to be a net drain on society as a whole, effectively negating the purpose that such unions are intended to serve. So I can't say the church is ultimately doing any good by upholding this doctrine... just that it is being consistent. I can't say its being genuine because I'm not real familiar with the 'official' version of The Bible that the catholic church recognizes... I go by the YLT version of The Bible as it ostencibly has the least amount of 'translation error' of any 'english' version of The Bible, and YLT does not seem to specify homosexuality as a 'sin', but rather another of the many things that God merely dislikes (like gambling, drinking, premarital sex, even the telling of jokes depending how literal one's interpretation) because of how easily they can become sin (aka- the breaking of one of the commandments). As I understand it, the catholic church recognizes a version of The Bible that was fairly heavily re-interpreted by a Pope a thousand years ago, and perhaps that version does specify actual 'sin' outside of and in addition to those listed in the ten commandments...

Just FTR- I'm not saying I agree with the catholic church that homosexual marriage should not recieve God's blessing. I've no dog in that fight, there's plenty of failed and damaging 'normal' marriages that are apparently 'blessed by God' that imo shouldn't be, and I say avoid 'marriage' altogether because theres no good reason to make your union into a contract with the state as marriage is today. Wed whomever you want, and whether God will bless it or not is between you, your partner and God- no one else. I'm just saying it doesn't make any sense to complain about whether 'the church' recognizes your marriage, because if it doesn't, then your values obviously do not align with the church's values and so why are you trying to have any union with it in the first place? If you don't need someone else telling you how to have a relationship with God, then why try to be a part of the church (because thats literally all its purpose is)? Its like joining a football team and then complaining that theirs too many rules of football- it just means you aren't into football, play something else.

 

Leviticus 20:13 is God's law God gave to Moses to give to His people [the nation of Israel] to administer in their society. God does not change and God's law is still in effect.

So-called "Israelis" are evil antichrist Edomites [descendants of Esau/Edom], NOT Israelites! Edomites feigned conversion en masse in the 2nd century BC and became "jews" so they could live in Judea which they undermined, usurped and ruled. Edomite-"jews" [Herods] ruled Judea [and the third temple that Herod built] as Rome's client kings during the time of Christ. Edomite-"jews" are the FAKE "jews" mentioned in Rev 2:9 and Rev 3:9.

Btw... one of the reasons why God used Babylon [and Babylon's ally, Edom] to destroy Jerusalem and destroy the first temple [Solomon's temple] was because Israelites had allowed abominable sodomites in the temple.

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Maybe according to Judaism, but according to Christianity, the new covenant replaces the old. You can stop sacrificing animals to settle your sins.

"By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear." - Hebrews 8:13

 

Who cares?

 

Why not? (Said without sarcasm). If the idea of religion is about love and goodness, what could be wrong with selecting the best bits from each?

 

I'm in a mixed religion marriage and had to get married by a JP as you can't have marriage between 2 different religions by either of our religions. So, this is nothing new.

 

Steak houses sell a whole lot more than just steak - so they are open to all eaters. If you are talking about people being offended by carnivorous appetites, you'd be thinking of vegans, not vegetarians. And most vegans I know aren't so militant as to refuse to eat alongside a carnivore.

If someone has been brought up Catholic and loves the Mass (I can still be moved by the Catholic Mass) and understands themselves to be gay as they get older, would that automatically make them hate Mass?

At the end of the day, you and I will not agree and will go back and forth endlessly. I happen to believe that if the Catholic Church continues to accept gay men as priests (which is a sacrament) then they should wed gay couples (also a sacrament).

 

I doubt god cares about homosexuality. This sounds more like an issue rulers/priests promoted to increase population growth, as back in the day population equaled power. Gay people have no offspring. Now with an overpopulated world, I'm pretty sure god would agree that more people are not a good idea. Hell, he's probably the reason why homosexuality is becoming more common. He's changed his mind about things in the past, why not now?

But, since we are all god, as is all of creation, the fact that some people are gay is pretty much proof god doesn't give a damn about homosexuality. And god is love. Saying that the love between two people is wrong pretty much makes you anti-god. I wouldn't worry too much about what the bible says. It has some good stuff in it, but was mostly put together to keep the peasants under control.

 

ONLY the blood sacrifices were nailed to the cross when God incarnate, Jesus Christ, became the ultimate sacrifice, the Lamb of God.

God's moral, civil, criminal laws are still in effect. During the past 2000 years of Christianity... Christians and Christian nations patterned their morality and civil/criminal laws after God's Biblical laws.

Today, we are at the evil end of the age which Jesus compared to a repeat of the evil "days of Noah" and evil "days of Lot" [Lot lived in Sodom.] Today, all FORMER Christian nations have rejected God's righteous Biblical laws and they now embrace and promote evil perverted humanistic lawlessness!

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My bold. Well, at least we're making progress, and becoming rational.

 

No, that is simply not true. We Christians are not under mosaic law. You can eat lobster, you don't need to make animals pay for your sins, and you don't need to stone people to death.

 

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As I mentioned on one of my previous posts here... Jesus compared the evil end of the age to the evil "days of Noah" and evil "days of Lot" [Lot lived in Sodom.] God sent TWO angels to Sodom before God destroyed it. Why TWO angels? Because God's law requires the testimony of at least TWO witnesses before judgment and due punishment. The irony is... when the angels were in Sodom, the sodomites never ceased witnessing against themselves!

 

You must just LOVE the stricter Muslim fundamentalists then. If God tells them to go kill everybody, hey, they don't pick and choose, nor do they water down.

 

Tell you what, I'll start listening to this bovine excrement, when you start taking the works of Steven King as "holy" and live your life according to what he says. Because I'd bet money I don't even have that he knows more about spirituality than the goat herders who wrote that book.

How do you even take that stuff seriously?

 

The sooner, the better. They do nothing positive for society, quite the opposite. And lest you think I'm picking on Catholics, I would say the same about pretty much all religions, especially the ones we categorize as "western".

 

Ummmm...god couldn't just see for himself?

 

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God also has TWO witnesses at the evil end of the age - Revelation 11

 

The same scriptures justify slavery and infanticide and outlaw religious freedom. Time to grow past it. Murdering people for being gay isn't okay, and it never has been.

 

Sir Elton John hits out at Vatican's 'hypocrisy' over 'God cannot bless sin' stance on gay unions

The Vatican.......and its hipocracy.

https://news.sky.com/story/sir-elto...annot-bless-sin-stance-on-gay-unions-12247434

agree with Elton. Furthermore ..the nature of relationships and marriage has changed. Time for groups like the Catholics to adapt to the changing and progressive society. Imposing such constructs on personal relationship........ Free will,and free choice applies to who one chooses to marry.
All this does is foster bias and prejudice and rejection of certain people in society. None of which is humane. It suggests ritualism and cult like mentality. When there should be a bigger attempt to address all of humanity. and it's freedom to marry / partner with whom they choose.
It seems arrogant to assume what "god" might think or say........especially for a 'god" that is supposed to love all creatures......with out bias or prejudice.
Mankind has set many of these rules a long time ago.......while claiming that 'God" wants it that way....

This seems like just another way of controlling the followers ........with vernacular like "sin" which implies some kind indefinite punishment..........

For an institution as wealthy as the Vatican....... they might want to focus on being inspirational for all people.( to be the best they can be in their own way)

 

Gay Catholics that want to get married by a priest might care. ..........and technically, the position is prejudicial.

It is quite astounding to consider that loving someone and wanting to marry them........ is a sin (for the gay population)

All humans have the right to marry whom they choose........(or they should)

 

What you listen to, or don't listen to, is no interest of mine.

They were not sent there to witness anything.

 

The Catholic church has only endorsed gay sex when it is a priest or brother doing it to a kid. Then they have protected the assailant(Never the kids) giving them counseling and relocating them over and over.

Religion sucks ass we need to stop wasting our time with it. I was married in a catholic church but have not had anything to do with that church for years.