Just a thought: Maybe guns moving readily amongst people (particularly if those people have any kind of criminal history) is part of the issue.
That's actually a good question. Congrats! A gun safe is a good measure. After all, most burglaries happen when folks aren't home. Since a lot of folks seem to want a gun in order to protect their lives and/or property from threats, it makes sense to protect the gun from threats when you're not around to use it. It also makes sense that guns that aren't being used by an experienced individual should be secured and out of the reach of kids or inexperienced individuals. This would reduce the risk of criminals obtaining the firearms of lawful owners, and reduce accidental shootings - while doing something that's already common practice for many responsible owners.
Not an addressable one, not that it is the gun instead of poverty and drug addiction that is the driver in violence, gun or otherwise.
Well, I see that the discussion is turning around basic ideas regarding how to avoid that criminals get firearms and laws focused on gun control. From an Italian perspective I can confirm, without doubt, that a very restrictive gun control law doesn't avoid that criminals get firearms. In Italy Mafia, Camorra, 'Ndrangheta have got real armies of guerrillas with all the possible weaponry [Afghanistan style IEDs included!]. How is this possible? Great experience in smuggling and corruption ... it's the same mechanism which allows many tons of drug to pass the borderlines. Criminals are very smart in hiding that drug [and those weapons], but there is also a certain presence of corruption among the officers who should control [this is useless to deny]. So, in US you can introduce all the restrictive laws about gun control you want. This will not prevent criminals to have firearms. Not at all.
So once you figure out that safes aren't all that secure, then you will no longer be satisfied with all gun owners having to purchase an $11K safe anyway. Should we have to store our firearms at the local Police Dept. at that point?
Absolutely correct. And I'll go ahead and speculate as to why you'll never see a serious crackdown on the one place that would do the most good. Because you'll see a disproportionate number of minorities getting arrested. And people like Al Sharpton will be all over the news calling these crackdowns "racist." Thus they will be dropped and we as a society will be forced to return to accusing Charlton Heston of rising from the grave and mowing down school children for lack of a better scapegoat. Not because that's what the evidence shows us. But because our collective feelings simply will not allow us to do the most effective thing to end gun crime. This is what happens when people confuse thinking with feeling. They render themselves completely unable to fix anything.
I do believe that being able to identify those who put guns into the hands of criminals would help limit the number of guns in criminal hands. That being said, I agree that addressing some of the root causes for violence would be an obvious benefit. That being said, I believe that the odds of any act occurring increase proportionate to the ease with which that act can be committed... and guns make violence easier for those who have that inclination.
The easier you make it to have your property stolen, the more likely your property is to be stolen. Are you suggesting that effective implementation of a safe doesn't make assets (like guns) harder to steal, or keep them out of kids' hands? Not sure what point you're trying to make here...
Dude, you're a reasonably smart guy, so I'm sure you understand that guns that come from "an illegal/street source" are ones that have already been obtained by criminals through some other means (most likely theft or straw purchase). Finding a way to limit thefts and straw purchases addresses these illegal/street sources as well.
Being broke, bored or addle brained from drug use seems to be what causes "that inclination". The obvious solutions send democrats into the stratosphere--punishing those who use by taking away their benefits; make people work for that which they receive so they don't shoot joggers because they are bored; and start scattering poor people out of poverty islands in the middle of democratic super majority districts.
I see you've decided to introduce partisan rhetoric... Very well. Please demonstrate any case in which drug testing people who can't afford drugs has done anything more than hand tax dollars to the groups doing the testing. Please demonstrate the Republican plan for creating jobs (getting people to work) which trumps the one that's gotten unemployment below 6%. Please demonstrate that there is a greater per capita rate of welfare recipients in democratic states than republican ones.
Please demonstrate the Republican plan for creating jobs (getting people to work) which trumps the one that's gotten unemployment below 6% [/QUOTE] I assume that you are referring to the Bush policies that Obama continued like bailing out corporations and quantitative easing that democrats only (*)(*)(*)(*)(*) about when they are playing the class warfare card instead of the "Why look at this glorious economy Obama created" card. [/QUOTE]Please demonstrate that there is a greater per capita rate of welfare recipients in democratic states than republican ones.[/QUOTE] http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/...high-poverty-rates-in-california-arizona.html
imo it is a straw man to say that guns can never be eliminated therefore we cannot do anything in fact if street guns had to be smuggled, it would increase the price and reduce the supply also the simple fact is that there are many countries with more stringent gun laws there is no reason that guns could not be smuggled into those countries but in fact those laws have proved effective in reducing gun crimes in those countries we may decide that we do not wish to do that but imo the evidence is clear that gun laws CAN have an impact
There are currently more firearms than individuals in the united states. Try and present a plan of approach for reducing that number by any meaningful degree. There are hundreds of millions of firearms in the united states. With thousands more being added daily. Do you care to tell everyone what one percent of that amount is in round numbers? One country cannot be accurately or honestly compared to another. Other countries have consistently experienced fewer firearm-related crimes than the united states, largely due to the people rather than the laws. They cannot. And they do not.
i do not claim immediate and extraordinary results but i see no basis for you to assert there can be NO effect ever i
Because the proposed legislation is never used to attempt aggressive prosecution of individuals who are legally prohibited from owning firearms due to preexisting felony convictions. Point to any examples of cities and states exercising aggressive prosecution approaches to tackle gang members and drug dealers, to the same degree they attempt to prosecute out of state visitors who unknowingly violate the state's firearm laws. The state of New Jersey regularly tries to prosecute people for out of state concealed carry permits not being valid, seeking the maximum possible sentence under the law, while regularly plea bargaining again firearm charges against those who should not be in the general public to begin with. You will find no examples of such. Instead you will only find examples of legal firearm owners being forced to comply with new restrictions to avoid being reclassified as criminals by default. You will fail to find examples of career criminals being shown no leniency, in the name of safer communities. - - - Updated - - - They are either stolen from lawful owners, or supplied by co-conspirators who know full well that they are committing a crime in the process, and simply do not care that they are.
Either theft from lawful owners, or co-conspirators who are fully aware that they are committing crimes, but simply do not care.
people in the US have (or can easily GET) LOTS more money than almost anybody can in most of the countries that have stingent gun laws. The ones that do best at keeping out guns are islands (Britain and Japan) and don't have (and never did have) anything like the gun or hunting culture that the US has. Frankly, we already HAVE 100's of thousands of otherwise law abiding people (CURRENTLY) risking felony convictions for guns that their states have ruled to be illegal to possess. Like autorifles in CA, CT, MASS, and NY, or pistols with greater than 7 rd mag capacity (NYC) handguns not on "the list' in CA, etc. So the US already has millions of people who WILL actively resist any sort of general gun law. A few thousand of those people will take drastic measures to motivate 10's of thousands of Big Bro's thugs to resign their jobs, rendering any such law quite unenforced. For instance, 10's of millions of people can get a 6k college loan, just by signing up for 12 credit hours per week for 4 months. If they pick the simplest of classes at their local jr college, they can pass half of them easily, even while working full time. If they pass, they will get another 6k loan the next semester. The dept of education will accept $120 per month as payment on that 12k. So the second 6k will pay for the first 6k for 4 years. 8k will suffice to build 200k worth of credit (on cards) in 2 years, too, if you've got that much time and desire to have real money. You can go a lot of places and do a lot of things on 200k. In fact, you can vanish and live well for the rest of your life, if you know what to do and where to go. There are several countries that do not care if a felon has guns in the house, as long as his (local) wife has a license and she CAN get such a license, without spending much money.
So you must be a big supporter of the war on drugs. I don't support giving my rights up. I support holding people responsible for their actions. It's just like being against prohibition when we know that thousands of lives are lost every year to alcohol abuse or driving a car even though thousands of people die every year because of their misuse or accidents.
