Why are blatantly racist threads allowed?

Because black people are stupid? I jest, of course. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion I suppose....

 

There are many people with dark skin who are more successful than people with lighter skin.

 

That doesn't answer my question. I want to know why your hatred is justifiable but Zook's isn't. What gives you the authority to determine which kinds of hate are acceptable or not?

This is bordering on conspiracy theory nutjobbery. There's actually a specific forum for that, here.

I don't see anybody doing these things that you are claiming. Glad we agree that racists have the ability to speak their mind, though. Now if we can only get DA60 to see the light.

 

That's very true. However, I was obviously speaking about average data and not stating that every single black person out there has a lower IQ than every single white person. This is the kind of confusion that is leading to these sorts of discussions.

 

Attacking people for the views they hold is one thing. Attacking people for the colour of their skin, quite another.

Whether we ban them or not, attacks on Jews being Nazis, or blacks being responsible for their own misfortune, is an attack on people form what they are, not what they have chosen to be. This is a wholly different type of attack.

It is by definition hatespeech because it attacks whole groups for qualities that they have no choice or power over. You attack me as a liberal, you attack my views. I can defend those views or renounce them. You attack me for being an Irish gypsy mischling, and you attack me for something that I am, and that I cannot change.

The latter is hatespeech. I think it should be allowed but that we should be allowed to take off the gloves in replying to it. But the rules of the forum are that it isn't allowed. In practice hatespeech is allowed by this forum and its propagators are protected against the just and righteous personal abuse and derision that they deserve. For a long time we had a member who called himself after a Nazi terrorist organization and he was strongly protected against "personal abuse" even though his whole intervention was hatespeech. He spewed a lot of poison. But officially hatespeech is against the TOS.

 

He's not attacking them for the color of their skin. He is attacking people who happen to have the same skin color because they, as a group, are committing more problems in society, in his opinion. There's a big difference.

No, it would not be an attack on blacks who were not responsible for their own misfortune, or Jews who were not being Nazis. Have you read his posts?

If I created an "attack" that said "Liberal women are 20 times more likely than Conservative women to have an abortion" (not saying this is true or not, just making a point), and a liberal woman told me "I'm a liberal and I've never had an abortion", then obviously my comment wasn't directed at her. However, my point would still stand about liberal women if I could show some sort of evidence that supports my argument. Zook's posts (the one's I've seen, anyway), tend to go the same way. He has openly acknowledged that he is speaking in generalities, and is not including every member of every race he is criticizing.

Again, have you read his posts? He makes it pretty clear that the high crime rates and other maladies present in the black community are the reason why he has an unfavorable view of blacks. If those characteristics went away, he most likely wouldn't have the same objections about black people.

It comes down to whether or not someone is making a personal attack against someone else. Making a generalization that happens to include somebody is not the same thing as directly attacking that person. If someone has a problem with somebody having racist views, they can criticize their posts, try to refute them, or they could simply ignore that person if he becomes too big of a problem. Trying to silence their ability to talk, even when they are not breaking the rules, is about the worst kind of authoritarianism that exists.

 

Someone told me that allowing this is the forum's way of promoting free speech.

 

DA60 , since I'm multiquoting this post , I have removed parts of it to respond more directly and save room . My apologies to your OP . To belittle someone is not racist . to belittle someone because of their race might be . it depends on the intent and the contents of the post / thread. sometimes , it just comes out the wrong way , and is misunderstood. As far as insulting a post , that is prolly gonna slip by , but to insult the poster prolly won't , and it's a fine line between the two. the best way is to report the thread with the abuse button , sooner or later , 'PF Staff' will get to it , but they can't look at every thread that's created at the time the thread is being created , and a few slip by , it happens . If you cared enough to create it in the first place , you can police your own thread . If "staff' sees that you care about your own thread , then they will as well .

yeass , and it'll prolly happen here as well , what you say may be true , but it's the way and the words chosen that get people in trouble .

Well said & good advice Jiyuu

 

There is wisdom there Hillbilly.

 

I'm surprised linking a study to racists being dumb was deleted for flamebaiting.

Seems we're not allowed to have an opinion / discuss how DUMB racists are.

I had a thread deleted for flaming for asking if racists hate themselves. Not even a statement but a lowly question. Flaming? That's rich.

Go peruse the race relations section to see the racists having a field day flaming members of this forum. That's if those members are still here. Why would anyone bother staying here when their personhood gets denigrated on a daily basis? Must be great being a racist white male on this forum. Such leniency for you. And too bad for those you denigrate.

 

Apart from, as I have already said, the fact that being a liberal is something you choose, and being black is something you are, which make them completely different forms of offensiveness, your example here is not a castigation of all liberal women. It's not what I am talking about. Liberal women MAY be 20 times more likely to have an abortion. Fine. This is not a generalization but an observable fact if you can produce the stats. It's a poor strawman because I don't disagree with you with that example.

Saying however that "Are Jews Even More like Nazis" (the title of a thread) is an attack on ALL Jews. This doesn't just implicate moderate Jews in Israel, or Israeli Jews who want to negotiate peace (which it clearly goes on to do, condemning anyone who supports the State of Israel in any form whatsoever, even behind 1967 borders, as an enemy of humanity (see Iolo's posts)). It implicates with the statement "Are Jews Even More Like Nazis" secular Jews like my cousins in London and calls them Nazis. It's all Jews. It's the Jewishness that makes whatever group of people the OP is condemning the vital ingredient in their Naziness. It is being a Jew, according to this statement, that makes you like a Nazi. It is not just agreeing with the Israeli government, or the actions of the IDF, or Netanyahu etc., that makes you a Nazi, all of things that you can argue about and discuss and challenge. It is merely your Jewishness. You can't escape if you're Jewish. You are even more like a Nazi. Someone Jewish in Israel does something bad. You are a Jew so you are a Nazi. That's the logic of this statement and the OP and its supporters were unrepentant of that position throughout the thread. This is racist filth. Whether it is allowed or not is another thing. But it is racist filth, without a doubt.

 

I have to add that those being denigrated by the racists here are MUCH TALLER than the racists. Those posters took time to challenge the racists, and stood firm and threw their nonsense back in their faces.

TALLER than the racists. Smarter, more courageous than the racists. It was quite a spectacle too to see the racists at a (dumb) loss when confronted by the posters they demean.

 

Some people would consider some of my posts on this forum racist. But I do not think the thread mentioned above should have been deleted. Other members have just as much right to accuse racists of being dumb as racist have to argue that some races are less intelligent.

I think that thread "prejudice linked to lower intelligence" should be brought back. I do not feel it constituted "flamebating". Threads like these should be allowed. It is important to protect freedom of speech.

I also made a response to this thread, countering the original posters point. So I actually feel like the thread did more harm to the OP's cause than good.

 

I have just seen this. Where is the quotation FROM ME to justify this drivel?

 

Very true. This site is run by white europeans, why would they allow anti- white topics? Ask yourself this. This has nothing to do with curtailing free speech of course since we are not talking. It's perfectly reasonable imo for them to moderate and promote racism to non whites as they control the domain.

It's tribalism and they haven't long been a civilized society remember, they are like 3,000 years behind the rest of the world when it comes to enlightenment.

 

Well, if they are the nastiest sort of racist, then usually you can just ignore them and let them make fools of themselves. But this is also a debate forum-- as disgusting as a person's political belief(s) may seem to you (and especially me), that doesn't mean you shouldn't treat them like you would any other opposing view. Of course, many racists just aren't worth debating and are mostly blinded by sheer bigotry and prejudice. Still, every so often you might get a rare one who attempts to back up his or her's statements.

But I think if someone is insulting someone in a racist manner that should definitely be looked at by the mods. (and it usually is)

 

Gwen , sometimes , it's not what you say , but how you say it .

If you're gonna whack a troll , you got to make smarter threads / posts .

it takes a while to learn the ropes , my friend , so in the meantime , grow a thicker skin , and learn to phrase your posts/ threads more carefully .

that's good advice , live and learn , and always give as good as you get , never back down from a troll , or they'll hammer you off of PF .

If you stay or leave , it's up to you , but don't just run away because your feelings are hurt , it happens to us all , get mean and clever , or you won't last on PF , or on any other site .

I don't agree with many of your posts , but I'd not see you turn tail and run away when I know if you were to more carefully craft your post , you'd prolly be ok .

PF is a real mean place , at times , plenty of trolls , so get the out and cut somebody , and they'll prolly leave ya alone .

 

I believe that was sarcasm to make a point. The point being that we have a President who has made a political ad based on race. He's not formed the organization....or asked for their vote.....based on his accomplishments. He speaks of their "struggles" that have led to "someone like him" being president in the first place. It's a racist campaign and he should be ashamed of himself for it. This president continues to set race relations back and continues to DIVIDE this country. He's taken us backward in that area; not forward.

We don't moderate based on "views" that people might hold. We promote freedom of speech....and that goes for those we might not agree with. For instance, sexists can post here......as long as they don't break any forum rules. Same with racists, atheists, wiccans, Christians, Muslims, or any others we each might personally disagree. As our president said upon taking office....we need to have more conversations about race. So, why would we prohibit it from even being discussed? Especially the parts we don't like???

 

Er here:

Zionism can mean a lot of things. You made it clear that for you its broadest possible interpretation - anyone supporting the right of the State of Israel to exist in any way whatsoever - was yours. According to your argument, and this quote above, supporters of the State of Israel, including anyone who believes in a two state solution with Israel behind pre-1967 borders, are Nazis.

When I put it to you in this debate that Zionists included people going far back who judged the righteousness of Zionism by how it treated non-Jews, you responded by calling me a Mossad agent. This definition of Zionists included everyone who supports the state of Israel, in any form, behind any borders, accommodating any second Palestinian State. All such supporters of Israel are Nazis. That was your clear argument.

The thread was a Jewbaiting thread where I was vigorously challenging the racist language and philosophy of a gang of Jewbaiters. Your response was that I was a Mossad agent.

It's all there. People can make up their own minds.

 

JP5 , with all respect , my radar just went off reading your post .

if I have understood you , then y'all may as well throw the PF TOS out the window , especially the rules concerning flamebait & strawman posts .

I have too much respect for you to take you to task on an open forum .

 

Clearly a forum double standard.

 

It is clear that racism is dumb. There's no need to discuss that fact.

 

No, it's not. A liberal moderator here has a thread about conservatives having low IQ, backed up by some BS liberal study. That thread remains.

If this forum has a bias, it's towards liberals. The worst liberal trolls get passes whereas conservatives are banned almost immediately.

This is just like the media bias. Even though 99% of major news sources are liberal, the left likes to cry on and on about FOX News. You guys aren't happy unless you have complete control.

 

This opinion piece is supported with what?

Being politically critical of misinformation is not "crying".

You only wrote that because I ordered you to do so. I control your statements! For more details on the matter, see FOX News.