Why can't the market deliver healthcare at a low cost?

So how are you going to sell this "it only works for the wealthy, so to hell with them!" to the wealthy? Seems to me that's who is paying most of the tax now, so... umm... I'm sitting pretty nicely at the moment, so give me your sales pitch.

Why should I care about poor people?

 

Typical. Might as well say, “ why should I care about sick people” or pollution or anyone of a myriad of other problems that affect the everyone. This is obviously why you support an autocratic form of govt. when the poor people out number you at the ballot box, you can then support apartheid.

 

End brick and mortar school for kids past the age of 13. Get them into their first jobs earning OJT, certificates and licenses. IT should not matter how one got educated enough to pass a license test, just that they can do so. You will radically increase the number of medical providers who have not gone through the crushing, expensive and lengthy education process. Their services will lost much less. Instead, we pay hospitals NOT to train more doctors.

 

I'm still not convinced...

I can move my money or myself to all sorts of countries, so you're going to have to do better than poor people voting.

 

I don’t care to convince you of anything. If you were well informed, you’d get it on your own.

 

Pretty silly. Businesses are screaming that kids need more, not less education. Btw, fewer corporations teach English and math.

 

Well I would not argue that it was low cost prior to Obama, but he managed to triple the cost of insurance and triple the out of pocket risk for individuals, so there is that. And yes, that is ONLY because of Obamacare. A fact.

 

That’s easy, if you believe it’s right and proper that corporate business should supply and run all the services that supplies the running of healthcare for a profit, then you have that already in America.
On other hand if you believe that it’s the government’s duty to care for its citizen’s health impervious of their ability to pay, then you have to look at the systems run by European nations.

 

Show the reference for “ triple the costs.”
The real facts are this. Mandating that you must insure people with preexisting conditions and not drop them when they are sick and too expensive for profit based insurance. The cost for Medicare has always been cheaper per person. It has nothing to do with Obamacare being too expensive. 90% of the people who lost their jobs during the recession were middle class and most lost their employer based health insurance. Obamacare was for the millions of middle class left un insured. Deal with it. For profit sucks and employer based insurance stinks during the last nine Republican lead recessions.

 

They need more education. Not education credentials. We recently had that scandal where people selling entrance into Harvard. (Legacy, that, for instance, Bush Jr. gets in as Daddy had done so before, has been around forever). The problem with Harvard is not that you cannot get a good education there. You can. The problem is you can graduate from Harvard and not be educated. I think a business would hire a 22 year old that left school at 13, got a 6 month Business Cert. and has been working for 9 years and has refrences rather than a new college grad with a degree that is pretty much just given away these days, no experience but wants high pay as that applicant has $250K in college debt to pay off.

Med coverage should be like car insurance. It is only for catastrophes. Single payer could be very efficient but has a problem. Make your health care a government expense, and you've just given your own government a reason to murder you. This guy had a hand in drafting the ACA: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2014/10/why-i-hope-to-die-at-75/379329/

 

Didn't read thread. Healthcare costs in the U.S. were completely reasonable... until the government got involved via Medicare and the welfare state.

Education costs in the U.S. were completely reasonable... until the government got involved via guaranteeing student loans and protecting student loan lenders.

The mortgage market in the U.S. was stable and conservatively managed... until the government got involved via encouraging, enabling and insuring unwise loans.

The banking industry as a whole in the U.S. was stable and conservatively managed... until the government got involved in the money supply in the early 20th century, and then turned banking in the U.S. into the most heavily regulated industry in world history.

And this isn't just a U.S. phenomenon, we have numerous datapoints of governments all over the world interfering with private sector functions in various ways... and the same eventual results are inevitable, spiraling costs, diluted services, hypercylical booms and crashes. All the while the purveyors and cronies get rich and the taxpayer pays and pays more and more.

Essentially -every- -single- industry that the central government involves itself in races to the bottom, the self-interested who became wealthy shift blame unduly to the private sector when things go wrong, and they inevitably do, and MORONS buy into the anti private sector, anti capitalist hysteria time and time again.

But surely more and more government is the solution.

 

Of course it costs less in other countries because it is rationed.

 

It might be nice if you knew what you were talking about but you don't yet I do. Health insurance is what I do for a living. And I can show you straight up evidence that rates tripled and out of pockets tripled because it was mandated by Obamacare. Facts are facts, too bad liberals are unable to comprehend them. I have published rate sheets from every major insurance company going back 15 or more years/

Why do you suppose medicare is cheaper? Any thoughts on that? Perhaps because physician and hospital reimbursements to providers are a tiny fraction of what insurance companies pay? Medicare costs exist as they are ONLY because private insurers pick up the slack. Without a third party paying the freight medicare cost would skyrocket.

How many millions of uninsured people did Obamacare cover? The exchanges insured 22 million people of which 11 million already had insurance but now got you and I to pay a subsidy for them so they re upped under the exchange. So in essence Obama covered 11 millioin new people. 32 million were uninsured at the start of Obama care 33 million are still uninsured. Is that a success story? For democrats it seems to be somehow. For 150,000,000 rates and costs tripled. Another success story I suppose.
Why are profits evil? Do you have a job that requires your employer to make a profit, or do you work in the government sucking on the taxpayer teet?
Health insurance companies profit is a mere 2% on average, so lets wipe out that profit and save the world 2% in premium. Hooray! You sound like a person that watched Rachel and just regurgitates what spews out of his/her mouth.

 

Health insurance costs what it does because the health care providers charge what they charge. Change corporate greed to profit motive - the source of all wealth in our society.

The OP is actually correct. Healthcare costs are so high because they can be. Doctors, hospitals, pharmaceutical companies etc. hide their costs from the end users because the end users are separated from the payment process. They don't even ask about the costs because they aren't going to pay them. If they did, things would change. That is how capitalism works. Remove competition and you no longer have capitalism.

 

As an old joke goes with construction (applies for most products, including healthcare). Good, cheap, fast, you can choose any two to have. Our marketplace chose good and fast for healthcare.

 

Trial lawyers

Malpractice insurance

Americans getting stuck for paying for the R&D of pharmaceutical drugs.

Americans getting stuck for paying for the R&D of new medical technology.

Illegal aliens using hospital ER's for basic healthcare.

Gang bangers including the Democrats MS-13 using the hospital ER's for gunshot wounds.

Illegal aliens using taxpayer funded hospitals for giving birth to anchor babies.

Doctors no longer accept chickens for payment.

And the main reason....the doctors office staff who do all of the paperwork billing the insurance companies.

 

Wow ................. quite a division of Americans in your mind ...................Sad for you

 

It should then be easy Mr Expert, to back up the claims then.
Show the “ straight up evidence” then. Where are the facts. Just babbling about how “ the facts” instead of referencing them means nothing.

The sheets should compare two comparable insurance plans. Are you claiming that mandating insurance companies accept preexisting conditions did nothing to up rates ? Yet, Medicare for all only insures people with preexisting conditions and has much less overhead. Wonder why.

 

Funny. The average college grad earns 56% more then the average HS grad.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...lege-grads-and-everyone-else-record/96493348/

 

Talk about made up ****.

 

Let's supposed that I am not well informed.

You don't care, but that's the hole in your thinking. Who do you think is going to pay for this socialist utopia that the democrats have planned?

hint: it's not your hordes of homeless.

 

No suppose about it.

 

yeah well, so you want me to take my money and head off to singapore? They love guys like me, and don't charge tax to bring money into that island nation.

Or maybe Palawan in the philippines. there isn't a place on the world that's more beautiful.

See, this is the point. You "we're gonna tax or eat the rich" types don't realize that there are options available. You think we're just gonna hang out and wait for you guys to tax us out of our underoos? No, that's not going to happen.

and you ain't got dick for an answer to that philosophical conundrum, brah. All you have is derision, and that's not paying the bills.

 

And you have all the answers “ you suppose.”

 

True. Buuuuuuuuttt... A person with the ability to get into and through MIT with an advanced degree for instance, have abilities that someone who cannot does not have. I think, with better alternatives to college offered, that person would do better financially than the one with HS only anyway. It isn't the extra formal brick and mortar school that makes the difference but the person, though I acknowledge that person still needs an environment in which to grow. Just not HS and college but OJC, online cert training, apprenticeships and licensing through exams and labs.