Women want right to go topless in public, take case to state's Supreme Court

There are many legitimate causes....tons of them . But if you’re being realistic it is numbers of people behind the cause that create change. You used hitler to make your point, but it made my point. If there were enough people protesting his actions, perhaps there would be millions alive today.
People thought the Vietnam war honest and righteous . People thought women shouldn’t have the right to abortion, people thought gay people should be in the closet ..for the same reasons. What brought about the change? Millions of protestors raising consciousness

 

I see I’m being misunderstood.there are many causes that many find legitimate. when a few people want to be able to marry their dogs because they think they should be allowed, do you give it the same credibility as those fighting for gun control? There are causes we probably disagree on and some are worthy and some are not. Women going topless is one I will pass on. I’d rather focus on sexual harassment in the workplace
I also find your “jumping to the cause” diminishes the sentiments of the movement. Perhaps the motivation was there but not the leadership. Do you think the millions of young people don’t want gun control? Do you think the millions who protested the Vietnam war didn’t care? Do you believe the #metoo movement is just “jumping to the cause”

 

You would pass but you would consider it to be a legitimate cause?

Weren't you the one who first mentioned "thousands or millions of people jumping to the cause" making it a movement?

I can safely say NO to all of that.

 

So you admit being an ass?

 

I don’t really care.If that is the cause to some then let them fight it. I choose my battles.
I think I reacted to “jumping for the cause” as though there was a lack of sincerity and just followers. I apologize if I misunderstood. Millions of women felt isolated when they were sexually harassed and as soon as it became a cause we felt credible. I was nearly raped and would never have dreamt of doing anything about it But it became a movement and we now feel empowered

 

Equal in terms of what?

 

In terms of respect for a start. People still see men as superior because women are held to a higher standard..,like how we look, how we dress etc

 

Interesting. I don't see how the two are connected. How does holding women to a higher standard mean that men are seen as superior?

 

They set the standards...we will just have to agree to disagree. you don’t see sexism, and I do..

 

What is an example of one of these standards and why do women follow them? Do you follow them yourself?

I don't agree nor disagree because I don't yet understand the issue which you are referring to - but I'm hoping to reach an understanding - Hence my line of questioning!

 

An example is what women had to endure in the workplace. Men controlled it. I have been sexually assaulted, sexually harassed many times but nothing would be done about it. We weren’t believed! It’s very easy to say why didn’t we do anything, but when you feel powerless it is hard. With the me too movement now, men are thinking twice
It’s all about raising consciousness. I remember telling my students that I was not allowed to apply to Harvard or Yale because I was a girl and the kids said, “you show must’ve been angry”. I explain to them that I wasn’t because that’s the way it was.

 

"Had?" Past tense?

 

I stand corrected.....but the point I was making, is women do not have to endure it as I did. If I had the same experiences today, I would report them and be believed . We also had to endure lower pay for the same work. Thanks to the Ledbetter bill obama signed, it is illegal

 

Before this bill, a junior salesperson could earn more than another junior salesperson?

 

Yes...a male could earn more for the same work

 

Including compared to another male I assume.

 

I guess you’re not familiar with the bill....men were paid more than women for the same job. I don’t I understand where you’re going with this comparing men to men.

 

Well with the way US employment law is currently, isn't it the case that two people, regardless of gender, earn the exact same pay for the exact same work?

 

Thanks to the Ledbetter bill and the activism of the women’s movement.
Do you think it just happened in a vacuum?

 

So in the US, people can only get a pay rise if every other person with the same job title and job description also gets a pay rise?

 

We are talking specifically about paying women less. Women got a smaller percentage in commissions, women were made managers as were men and men got more money. Hollywood star actresses got a fraction of what male stars got....and now that’s changing.
The reason that women were paid less was because they were able to pay them less. My husband was a Wall Street trader and there was a woman who was a dynamo and made a fortune for the company. My husband was shocked when she talked about her bonus. It was half of what his was.
Women are also less comfortable demanding large payments. I am a keynote speaker and I got my nerve up and asked for $1000 For a speech. I thought I was being paid a bloody fortune because after all I was a classroom teacher before .. at one of my speeches the man who hired me said, “ You cannot charge us more, but you should be charging a lot more than you are” . I learned a lesson. The more I charged the more in demand I was. My husband once heard me and cracked up laughing. I said in one sentence, “my fee is… But I’ll come right down“ he said that I should say what my fee is and then ask if that that is doable.

Do you think someone with the same job title and job description and experience , same amount of time put in should be paid differently because one is male and one is female? Why do I get the feeling that you’re just playing with me.

 

Pay is an important facet of life, if you are in a profession, people will have expectations, good clothing, your vehicle, everything costs money, hence why a Plumber charges so much, or an Electrician, a Carpenter, a Technical specialist, Computers etc.

So if a specialist comes to a home, a Service call is charged to cover the expenses involved.

I know many deadbeats that hire Drug Addicts, so they do not have to Pay reasonable prices for work, and I would never work that cheaply.

I have seen Men charge Women twice as much as they would charge a Man for the same work, and that is wrong.

 

Charge them for what?

 

This Ledbetter bill you talked about - I looked it up. It has to do with increasing the statue of limitations so that someone can sue their boss in a pay dispute. What does this actually do for women's pay?

What if her bonus was bigger than your husbands? Would that be a problem too?

Absolutely not. In the same way that I don't believe that two people of the same sex with the same job title and description and experience, same amount of time put in should be paid differently as long as there is no distinguishing quality which separates them from one another. However, as soon as an employer sees that an employee has a distinguishing quality, separating them from others, they should have he right to give them a pay rise. Would you agree with this?

Well that's a question which only you can answer, but I can assure you that I'm not "playing" with you! I'm just genuinely curious how pay works in the US.

 

Ledbetter bill allowed women to sue without a statute of limitations. When they were beginning to find out that they were being underpaid the Ledbetter Bill allowed them to sue . I’m surprised you can’t see what that did for women’s pay.

If my husband’s Bonus was smaller because he was a man that would be a problem too but that’s a typical strawman argument.

In your last argument you talk about and employee having a distinguishing quality which would give them a pay raise. That’s called a promotion