Yes (hear me out), "all" Muslims BELIEVE IN terrorism.

They give their children a book that says to KILL them, in multiple places, if they just happen to turn out gay (like their god made them), and you apparently don't care about that? Time to up your level of compassion towards your fellow human, my friend.

- - - Updated - - -

Intellectual and moral cowards, then.

- - - Updated - - -

You couldn't be more wrong. Terrorism is putting fear into people's hearts that if they don't do what you say then you'll terrorize them.....whether it's torturing you (like Saddam did) in this life, or torturing you in your after-life, it's the same - so Jesus/Allah are terrorists, plain and simple.

 

Great. So I'm sure you'll immediately rightfully complain to thereligionofpeace.com that their list of 27,304 terrorist attacks since 9/11 alone is all an evil Modern Secular Humanist conspiracy to discredit their peace-loving benign religion.

 

I love Muslims.
I hope to get all peoples to believe in science, reason, common sense, and reality, and away from ancient legends and away from believing that magic is actually real.

 

How about you answer the OP: Question: how many millions of Muslims have condemned Mohammad for saying "I have been made victorious through terror"?

 

Parrots are incapable of thought or study. This "quote" is by a Persian who lived 200 years after Muhammed.


Bukhari: Allah's Apostle said, "I have been made victorious with Terror" (Volume 4, Book 52, Number 220)

Here is the complete narration reads as follows:



Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah's Apostle said, "I have been sent with the shortest expressions bearing the widest meanings, and I have been made victorious with ru'b (extreme fear cast into the hearts of the enemy), and while I was sleeping, the keys of the treasures of the world were brought to me and put in my hand."

Abu Huraira added: Allah's Apostle has left the world and now you, people, are bringing out those treasures (i.e. the Prophet did not benefit by them).

Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 52, Number 220

 

OK, you're moving a little.

But, you need to recognize that neither Christianity nor Islam nor Judaism could possibly change the Bible. And, the various other key documents of Judaism and Islam fall in that category, too.

In my view, there are a couple key reasons for that:
- it is unbelievably difficult for any religion to decide that it's foundation was mistaken. God is absolute and unchanging, and that is conferred to the texts. It is far easier to find ways to reinterpret what is there.

- there is no adequate centralization of any of these three religions to facilitate a change. Outside of Shiites (where there is an Ayatollah system) Islam is diffuse, with each Muslim being told to read. So, there are experts within Islam, but there is nothing nearly strong enough to coordinate a change in texts that are considered revelations directly from God (especially the Qur'an, which is a revelation from God, not merely the words of Mohammad). In Christianity, there is the Pope, but there are large numbers of other denominations and no forum for unification. Thus, there is some hierarchy, but not enough to facilitate a change in the Bible.

How would Christianity go about modifying the Bible to remove the condoning of slavery?

(I'm not suggesting they should - my point is they couldn't even if they wanted to.)

 

That's exactly what ISIS was trying to do in Paris.

 

There are large numbers of Islamic scholars that condemn terrorism.

They see ISISism as apostasy.

Again, we win on this. Islam doesn't condone terrorism. That's as much as we can ask for. Islam is on our side on that point! And they follow through with that in supporting the opposition to ISIS through money, troops, bombing by air, etc.

 

Being flexible is always a good thing. Not stuck in a rut. Willing to admit they got it wrong. Being caring enough to improve the texts that they give their own loving children. They appear to be slaves to an ancient book if they can't make a better version of it. Mental slaves....and seeing how the Bible approves of slavery that's fairly understandable.
The texts of Modern Secular Humanism change of course (Dawkins writes something that's wrong, and w/in days of it coming out he'll see that the next printing is corrected, and apologize on his blog....this isn't rocket science, dude.) Showing that MSH is clearly a better belief system, one that's more up with the times, one that's more flexible, more open to constructive criticism. Much, much better.

- - - Updated - - -

Yes, and the roughly 300 million ISIS sympathizers see them as apostates of sorts. Muslims hate apostates, as the Sunni/Shia violence in Iraq clearly shows.

- - - Updated - - -

But not the person who formed the whole ideology of terror (Mohammad.)

- - - Updated - - -

That's because the hero of each ("god") is not real.

- - - Updated - - -

Too bad Christians/Jews/Hindus/Muslims aren't.

- - - Updated - - -

How about you answer the OP: Question: how many millions of Muslims have condemned Mohammad for saying "I have been made victorious through terror"?

 

Show me a dozen Christians (especially the evangelical and fundamentalists) who will condemn Abraham for kicking his concubine WITH THEIR SON in the desert to die.

Or that will will condemn the call the call for HEREM?

Have you met ALL the Muslims? Have you asked them that question? How many answers did you get?

 

dude, look I AGREE with you that religions are equally screwed up.

 

Modern secular humanism is not really a religion in that there is no god and no unchangeable foundation documents. Thus humanist direction is capable of advancing if adequate evidence becomes available. Religion has a harder time, and changing its fundamental documents is for all practical purposes impossible, as change of those documents is a profound statement of god being wrong. In religion, god can not be wrong. That is an unchangeable fundamental.

I think a lot of your objection is to religion.

For those of us like that, I think all we can do is be sure to understand how religion works. We certainly aren't going to change that!!

 

So for example, because pollsters, on political polls, etc. have never MET all voters, you completely discount all polls ever taken in US politics? I'm claiming that Muslims won't condemn Mohammad for that, and I guarantee you you can't prove me wrong. Ready, go.

- - - Updated - - -

Now you're starting to get it. They are simply wrong.

 

well, all Jews believe that God cursed the descendants of Amalek to genocide, to the 7th generation.

does that mean all Jews believe in genocide?

 

I can agree with you there! I don't "LOVE MUSLIMS," I just give each person, regardless of how they are dressed, and which "church" they attend, the benefit of the doubt, until they prove that they are cruel and bigoted.

Amazing how often I am wrong to give the benefit of the doubt to people who "seem" so nice, and how often a person whom I feel nervous about because of their "difference" demonstrate how wrong I was by being real nice, honest people!

And, you know what? I find that I am more often disappointed by the real character of those "Christians" than by others, including Muslims. ( I know, it may be because I meet more "Christians" than Muslims or Jews). But I do have friends in each of those religions. . .

However, I find that those who adopt the Buddhist teaching are usually the most trustworthy and happy people to be around.

Personally, I find my "religion" inside me.

 

The point is that ALL religions have blood thirsty leaders and characters. . .and ALL religions have believers who would rather negate their own feelings than publicly deny the validity of even the most horrible dogmas of their chosen man made religions. That certainly doesn't mean that they would all act on it. In fact, If you want to believe the polls about Muslims. . .what about looking at similar polls from the Christians and Jewish faith also?

I do not say that you are wrong. . .I am saying that the SAME TRUTH about "accepting" the idiocies of dogmas and "teachings" goes for EVERY religion, and that we shouldn't single out one religion more than the other for those idiocies.

 

Well, Christianity may have more chance to do that than most other religions. . .IF they could just recognize that the OLD testament is crap, just the bloody and obscene brain child of generations of power hungry, uneducated (at least for this time) MEN, and instead, begin the history of CHRISTIANITY at CHRIST.

I don't know if Christ was "the son of God" (well. . . I guess we are suppose to believe that we are ALL sons/daughters of God, so obviously, Jesus would also be "son of God,") or a really smart and good prophet, a special spiritual leader, like Gandhi, or even this Pope (Yes, I like and respect this Pope!), and follow JESUS' teachings instead of looking back to the old testament.

But that won't ever happen! Pope Francis seems to want to give it a try. . .but I am afraid they'll kill him before they let him throw out the "book."

 

Margot, why are you quoting the leader of ISIS?

- - - Updated - - -

Poop Francis is an intellectual coward, and/or immoral: his book says to kill gays in multiple places, but that sick SOB is so intellectually neutered that he won't change it. Coward.

 

You need to read Mt 5:17 where Jesus approves of the old laws....Jesus was on board with his dad's barbarity - making Jesus virtually as barbaric as his old man. If Jesus had said "write this down: don't bring forward the old texts, they are barbaric", then I'd have more respect for him. But of course we approved of a book that says to kill innocent people (kill gays, kill everybody in the "flood", etc.) Jesus was clearly immoral.

 

Modern secular humanism is not really a religion in that there is no god and no unchangeable foundation documents. Thus humanist direction is capable of advancing if adequate evidence becomes available. Religion has a harder time, and changing its fundamental documents is for all practical purposes impossible, as change of those documents is a profound statement of god being wrong. In religion, god can not be wrong. That is an unchangeable fundamental.

I think a lot of your objection is to religion.

For those of us like that, I think all we can do is be sure to understand how religion works. We certainly aren't going to change that!!

 

I agree with everything you say here. I don't have time to point out the truth in all religions right now, but again, I agree with you.

- - - Updated - - -

You are wise.
But we can show them the alternative, and how wrong they are relative to said alternative.

 

So. . .you never heard of the Crusade, or the Inquisition? You never heard of the way the Jesuites treated the Mexican Indians, the aztecs? How about the way the American Indians were treated in the name of religion? Who do you think encourage some of those American Indians to scalp those of their brothers who were not yet "Christians?"

How about going back to the old testament and (once again), look at the order to annihilate a whole people?

Face it. . . all Christians have the SAME PLAY BOOK also. . .and yet there are some Christians who are truly pacifists and generous, and accepting and looking for good in people, and others who are viciously attacking, even calling for the extermination of gay people, even doctors who perform LEGALE abortions!

One doesn't need to PHYSICALLY, and PUBLICLY update a book to improve their life or follow their own conscience. Come on. . .how many Atheists who do not have ANY books can live a good, conscientious, and giving life. . . without necessary clamoring it on every door steps?

I believe that the least a person depends on the words of others (especially words of religious leaders of any flavor) to lead their life, the more they look within themselves and follow their conscience, the more chance there is that they will live a "GODLY" life.

Most intelligent people do not NEED a book (or a translator of that "book") to know right from wrong. Even small children have that intuition. . . and it is too often the "socialization" into what adults want them to believe that ruins that innate intuition and understanding of good and bad.

No child is born a racist.

 

We agree that religion is a cancer on the mind. But we love religious people.

 

Well. . .once again, these are not (at least in my book) the words of JESUS, but the words of one of his disciples who took some liberties in order to keep the peace with the old folks. . .you know, kind of an "old age" politicien, anxious to get more followers (a means to an end?)

At least, this is the way those words redone within me.

What you seem to accept is that some parts of man made (or at least, men interpreted and men passed on from mouth to mouth, before finally being transcribed. . .and translated from "dead" languages to many hundreds of "living" languages) are REAL and thus they destroy your "approval" of a man who might, by the way he lived his life, been worthy of your respect.

 

We can, but we have to be a little careful about our approach to that.

Trade is a good way of going about it. Nixon opened trade with China on the grounds that trade interaction can lead to movement forward. And, it has.

On the other hand, we propped up the government of Egypt to the point that when the revolution occurred, the people rejected good ideas purely because they came from the USA. The result of our policy was that Egypt voted for the Muslim Brotherhood - not what we saw as best. Also, there are the disasters in Libya, Iraq and Palestine - not the same, but each are examples of mistakes we can make.