Isn't Equality Ultimately in Women's best Interests?

Since the highest paid women make obscene amounts of money, even those men risking their lives to do a job won't get paid more than "all women". That's just stupid. They will get paid more than some women, just as they will be paid more than some men. Since more men than women will also be doing those dangerous, high-paying jobs (because of their individual choices), yes, men in the aggregate will reap more of the money from those jobs. They will also reap more of the death and disfigurement that comes from those jobs. But I'm guessing death and disfigurement equality isn't important to you. You want men to do the majority of the suffering, do the hardest work, but then you want average income be the exact same among a group that GENERALLY does less dangerous and difficult work. "Equal pay for equal work" is a fine idea, and when the average woman starts doing equal work as the average man (including taking jobs that are likely to kill you), then the average woman shall deserve equal pay. Until then, it just isn't being earned.

And they don't (because that would be illegal). Not if they put in the same quantity and quality of work at that job.

The hell there isn't a disparity. It's just not one you care about because it favors women. And no, women aren't obligated to take certain jobs, but when they don't, they need to shut the **** up about not making as much money as those who DO take those jobs.

What a retarded statement. As I've said, I've ALREADY seen those stories in the news. To say that I won't see more of it in the news is asinine.

Are you drunk? Because you're not even making sense anymore, and you don't seem to be following the conversation. The rule is, that generally men are the firefighters. You pointed out that there are also women firefighters. My response was, "No ****. Just because you can find rare exceptions doesn't invalidate the rule."

That which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence (especially assertions that seem very unlikely, such as janitors making more money than nurses). If you can't prove your claim, then it doesn't stand. That is just how things work among thinking people. Join us for a change.

 

You are dreaming. There have not been many females on the battlefield fighting.

 

I get it often.

 

Your denial of wage disparity is simply laughable....

 

I doubt it....

 

Oh you can believe it dear.

 

Why should there be? There weren’t many men tending to the home and raising children. I sure as hell wouldn’t want to be on a battlefield fighting wars, especially those I don’t believe in.

 

I don’t, fluffy

 

That's because as a peacenik, you think that by playing nice with the enemy, they'll be nice to us. Newsflash. The whole idea of war is to win at all costs.

 

Your lack of understanding is laughable. It's like you're not even reading the thread. Anyone who paid the slightest bit of attention to what was said would know that I haven't been disputing any wage disparity. I'm simply saying that there are reasons for it that have zero to do with sexism. Those reasons can be summed up in one phrase: "personal choices".

 

News flash: neither do most men. But women have traditionally been exempt from conscription, while men had to go die. Please tell me more about how women don't have equal rights. Oh yeah, weren't you supposed to give me an example of a right men have that women don't have? Not being forced to go die in wars is a right women have that men do not. Your turn.

Male complaint: "I don't want to die in a war"
Feminist complaint: "I keep getting unwanted compliments"

 

I know, diplomacy is such a bad thing....ask the 58,000 who died in Viet nam. Ask the dead and maimed who didn’t play nice in Iraq. ..and Korea.
Might doesn’t always make right, ..newsflash...the whole idea of diplomacy is to PREVENT war. Too bad we didn’t attack Russia . Personally, I prefer cold wars

 

Actually what is laughable is that you don’t think sexism has anything to do with wage disparity...so sad

 

Wow...I haven’t met a male like you in years. Deja vu 1970’s
Women are doing these minor things like bearing and raising children, maintaining a home etc. so unimportant to you and not getting paid. . Why are you blaming women who were “denied from Conscription”? Who set the rules.
You really have such ,contempt for women but as I say...”how do you deal with a problem if you don’t know you have one"

 

Except all women do NOT make the same "personal choices". All men do not make the same "personal choices":..


"Personal choices"" does NOT explain why historically women have been kept out of certain jobs and education and paid less for doing the same work.

As with any sexist/misogynist you blame women for the discrimination

 

And that's why women don't have to play nice to get equality ... I need to find the poster who claimed women should be "nice" if they want to get equality and I want to use your post ..OK?.

 

No ****, Captain Obvious. Guess what else? ALL women do not make less money than their male counterparts. Why are you incapable of understanding the concept of a trend without falling back to "yeah but not all"? No one ever said all.

Historically? I'm talking about NOW. I don't dispute that feminism was a good historically. NOW women are the majority of people in college. NOW women can even be extreme **** most men can't even be, like Army Rangers. NOW the law mandates equal pay. Stop living in the past.

Stop lying.

 

You are just in full bullshit mode now. You just keep throwing out ad homs non-stop because you can't answer the central question in this debate: what specific rights are women currently lacking that men have? So you pull crap like childbirth out of your ass and then assert with no evidence that it's unimportant to me. It's just anything you can do to divert from the core issue while casting aspersions. Transparent as hell.

Blame? Sorry, that's your game. I merely pointed out that women have historically had preferential treatment in this regard. They had the right to not go die in wars, while men were denied that right. If I were like you, I would now go on to claim that I know that the deaths of those conscripted men are unimportant to you because of your misandry.

It defies belief that you really can't tell the difference between "women" and "third wave feminists". I have ZERO contempt for women.

 

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I didn't say that Capt. Oblivious.

you implied all...guess YOU can do that but no one else should...

Denying the past and insisting that sexism disappeared because you don't want it pointed out to you is silly.
It still exists and if the sexist posts in this thread don't convince you nothing ever will.

Good advice, take it

 

What’s so funny is men said the same crap you’re saying in the 70s. Women make less than men in comparable work. Walmart was a wonderful example and they had to pay a lawsuit

Calm down, you’re getting overly emotional..you don’t like my answers...that’s your problem. You seem obsessed with men going to war. Who made those laws? MEN. If you think it is wrong get off your ass and do something about it. What I find so disrespectful is how you dismiss the role women assume. Who watches the family when men are in the armies? Hey, no big deal rearing children and caring for the home. Must be difficult because men don’t want to do it . Wonder why
I lost men in war...wasteful wars that men thought necessary. Many women were in them, I know the difference between third wave feminists and women but I don’t think you do. I don’t know many women who are opposed to equal rights and equal opportunities. If they support these things they are feminists. I don’t care about your "waves". I heard the same crap about "second wave “feminists. The opposers said supported the suffragettes. LOL.

 

Ok, so we agree, not all women make the same choices, not all women are paid less. It comes down to the individual (not the gender). It just so happens that more individual women than men are making choices which do not prioritize a career, or choose a lower paying career, because that is where their interests lie.

I did no such thing. You just CHOSE to take it that way.

First, I didn't deny the past. I merely recognize that the past is not the present. Second, if the reason feminism is still needed is because of internet comments, then it has without doubt outlived its usefulness. I will ask you the same question I asked Renee: what specific rights do women CURRENTLY lack that men have? If you can name any actual rights that are unequal, I will join you in supporting change, to get women those rights. But if you can't, then feminism has no place in modern day America. Period.

 

<Mod Edit> I know old people like to think that things are the same as when they grew up, but they aren't.

Your LACK of an answer is the problem. The fact that you haven't been able to name a single right women lack that men have means that you don't even know what you're fighting for anymore. You're just running on inertia because you've grown too old to change your a way of thinking.

Uh, there is no draft anymore. People already got of their ass and did something about it. Unlike you, I understand that I don't need to go "do something about" issues that were resolved decades ago.

And that is entirely in your head. I did no such thing.

See, here's how I know that YOU know you're full of it. If you were in the right, you would stay on point, you would have specific rights you were advocating. But since you know you're wrong, you bring every red herring you can find to muddy the waters. But but but women have to birth children (totally the Patriarchy's fault), but but but women have to take care of the family while the men are off dying.

Me neither. And yet, most women do not call themselves feminists, because they know feminism is no longer about equal rights and opportunities

 

Women are still being sexually abused on college campuses and the military. Women should have the right to not fear being sexually attacked. Women should have the same rights as men when they walk down the street. Women need childcare centers. Women need reproductive freedom.

 

<Mod Edit> we don’t have to call ourselves feminists.....we are people who believe in equal rights for women. The word feminist has been abused by idiots like Rush Limbaugh. I don’t know many women who don’t believe in women’s causes.
It’s very difficult discussing issues with you.Because you keep going back to the same line. Everything you don’t like is a red herring. You undervalue women’s roles whether you are aware of it or not. And that is the beauty of male privilege they don’t even know they have it.
You are the one who seems to have these problems because you only thinking extremism like everything is patriarchy’s fault. No one said that. The man I associate with don’t talk like you do thank goodness. They don’t seem to have the same fear you have a women’s power. I especially enjoy your red herring that Men are off dying in war..as you said, there’s no draft, that’s their choice. Women can’t abandon their families. How many men do you know who have been killed in the war? I bet you there’s a lot more women who is men left them holding the bag

 

I agree, all people should and do have the right to not be sexually abused. As far as the right to "not fear", no one can grant you that right but yourself.

As far as I know, they do. What rights do women not have while walking down the street?

Men need those too, if they have children. However, a commodity is not a right.

Women have more reproductive freedom than men do. It is 100% their choice whether babies get born, and 0% men's choice.