Are you sure you really want socialism---think about this one fact

Trade has been around for far longer, but the industrial age took it to a much higher level. I think what you are trying to refer to is the history of the modern definitions of capitalism and socialism....which are far older than 1918. Example; Marx published "Das Kapital" in 1867. He wrote his famous letter to the Social Democratic Worker's Party of Germany "Critique of the Gotha Program" in 1875. It's where "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" is first idealized.

Is there any doubt that thousands of tribal cultures across history had socialist principles even if they didn't call it that?

 

Yes. Mostly in college. What? You want me to prove a negative? Feel free to prove me wrong by showing me one socialist state that is thriving. You can't. You know it and I know it. Why? Because it doesn't work for two main reasons: Human nature and the competition for limited resources. Technology can fix the second problem, but the only way to get rid of the first problem is to get rid of the humans. Good luck!

 

There has never been a socialist state nor a capitalistic state. They have all been hybrids. Most of what you refer to as "socialist" states would more accurately be described as dictatorships or criminal enterprises by a very small group of individuals.

 

How do you stop a state from becoming a dictatorship? Stop it from banning guns? From asserting authoritarian control over rights?

 

So, conflate any advance, in any aspect of society, towards a WORKING TOGETHER, as GOING SOCIALIST? And you call that, FROM ASSERTING CONTROL over RIGHTS. Using a SHALL NOT INFRINGE, to make them seem unassailable for any and all reasons? YUP. That, is the poisoned premise.

 

That is really the communist version of socialism that really only exists in nations like North Korea and even China and Europe doesn't have anything like this. Everyone both liberal and conservative agrees this is a bad idea.

 

Since all those countries started out with the "good" socialism, do you think concerns are justified?

 

Those countries started out as dictatorships. They never had any Europe-style democratic socialism.

 

Slippery slope, in itself, is a fallacious argument form.

If you are asking, Is any aspect of socialism implemented, necessarily going to CAUSE all the nefarious aspects of totalitarian authoritarianism to follow soon after, then it is correct, and PARANOID.

 

Dude, most countries started out as "dictatorships".

 

I'm not, but nice try getting around the forum rules on false accusations.

 

So socialist governments in Europe, the government doesn’t control all the money and everyone doesn’t work for the government.

So is this another one of those “facts” you have pulled out of your ass?

 

No, nothing is free but giving the youth of a country a free college education gives them a better chance at better jobs and then they pay taxes and that helps the next group of students who then get good jobs and pay taxes that help the next generation get a good education so they can have good jobs and they can pay taxes.....caught on yet?

A country that buries it's brightest in debt must not like a good economy or it's citizens.

 

Which governments are socialist? All are capitalist from what I've seen....some better at it than others.

 

Free? Colleges will just start teaching for free? The teachers will work for nothing? How noble!

 

The Scandanavian countries are socialist.

 

I await your proof. Here, let me help you: https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/

For a definition:
"A Socialist country is a country where the government or the public as a whole has control over the economy. In a socialist country, the producing and dispersing of goods is owned by the government. Socialism is placed in between capitalism and communism."

 

So is your contention that government regulation of the economy is not control?

 

FoxHastings said: ↑
No, nothing is free but giving the youth of a country a free college education gives them a better chance at better jobs and then they pay taxes and that helps the next group of students who then get good jobs and pay taxes that help the next generation get a good education so they can have good jobs and they can pay taxes.....caught on yet?

A country that buries it's brightest in debt must not like a good economy or it's citizens.

No, duh, the taxes those graduates make pay for the education, that means the colleges and professors will get paid by taxes.

 

I don't think there are many folks advocating for a total move to socialism. And there's no need to. Elements of socialism can be incorporated into our current government without needing to go balls-to-the-wall absolute socialism. That idea seems to be lost on those who quickly jump to extremes as soon as the boogeyman S word gets mentioned, in any context. It's worked for hundreds of years in this country, and will continue to work as long as we don't let total greed overtake common sense and pretend that most rich folks and private companies actually give a rat's ass how the country itself turns out.

 

By pure coincidence, I'm watching Wild, Wild Country on Netflix. Currently on part 3. Watching how a peaceful movement evolves into malevolence is interesting. It's not the religion, but the people. Human nature in its typical form.

 

Thanks for fessing up that "free college" isn't free. The burden will be place on American Middle Class tax payers like it usually is when Democrats give away "free stuff".

 

If you can't see the difference between democratically installed regulations and government control, then obviously you see no difference between a modern free country and Orwell's Oceania.

 

“Democratically installed” would be a form of government would it not?

Regulations are a form of control, are they not?

 

Agreed. Like advocating banning guns, they know there would be an immense amount of push-back. Instead, they push for it incrementally. "Free college", for example. What, at first, begins as a benefit soon becomes a right. That "right", of course, is paid for through higher and higher taxes along with other "rights". The "right" to an independent dwelling. The "right" to study one's chosen lifestyle or vocation such as smoking pot and playing a guitar.

It wasn't that long ago when Congress was discussing welfare reform that our nation saw protests, some violent, because many people saw those entitlements as a "right".