Why the Second Amendment needs to be amended or abolished

I’d love to see the factual evidence you have that shows the political affiliation of all those involved in gun crimes.

 

You said "There is not a conspiracy to disarm Americans..." That's hardly 'addressing it.' You probably don't want to disarm all of America. That doesn't mean there arent others who do and work toward that end. I at least supplied a logical motive to support my assertion that some do want us disarmed, one that you havn't even attempted to challenge. Your claim thus far amounts to 'nuh uhh.'

Lets try this- how much gun control is enough? At what point would you stop, turn around and say 'guns are now well enough regulated, further restrictions could be harmful'? If that point doesn't exist for you, then you'll just be making the same arguments as in OP until all guns are completely banned.

As far as solutions go- we need to overhaul our mental health systems. And not just by throwing money at them (though I agree that is part of it), but we need an entirely new approach that doesn't involve treating the mentally ill like criminals before they've even committed a crime. Italy is very good example of where we should be looking to improve how we treat the mentally ill to prevent them from becoming 'criminally insane' and then using weapons to hurt people.

Psychiatric reform in Italy - Wikipedia

 

Um…1st amendment doesn’t apply to private businesses. That you don’t know this is astounding. No one is coming to take out guns. My lord…have you always been afraid of your own shadow???

 

Biden mentioned 9mm pistols in his gun control speech.

 

Tell that to the Japanese interment camps.

 

I read all of your authoritarian post, there is no need to go any further until you can address the real issue, you IDed the issue but failed to propose any solutions but take all guns from everyone, something you have advocated before.

 

I did not propose that at all.

 

Well, you told me I didn't read your OP, since you just make things up,. Others can't ?

 

Based on your responses so far, you haven't.

Then again, I'm talking to someone who has a sig line of "Biden is not my pwesident and he sniffs kids." Maybe you're not interested in having a real discussion?

 

Your authoritarian opinion on what to do to take our rights does not constitute a " real discussion "

Until you can address your first point I quoted, there is little to discuss.

 

You suggest fixing the problem while leaving the lawful out of the solution, but as with motor vehicle regulations, it really isn't possible to do that. What I don't get is why you think saving lives isn't worth some added inconvenience for the lawful in the case of guns, and apparently guns alone.

 

That's a strawman you and the other guy can argue.

So you are advocating that everyone needs to be limited in their rights for a tiny fraction of people.

Here's a very novel idea.....go after those who break laws.

When you fail to enforce EXISTING, CURRENT laws....what on gods green ball of dirt, makes you think new laws will be any different?

 

While I don’t agree with the OPs proposals, could you show us where in the OP he proposed taking all guns from everyone?

 

So the problem is those with mental health. OK. So why not address the mental health? Why must guns be limited or taken away because mentally ill people have problems? Why not just address the mental health instead?

"As it is interpreted today"? Is it YOUR interpretation that we're supposed to you? Which interpretation exactly are you going by?

 

it’s a fact.

 

Look at who they elect. Simple.

 

So no evidence backing up your claim. Got it.

 

they are not losing elections. it seems as if for a democrat to win an election the repub must kill 600,000 americans through neglect (trump) or get caught wearing diapers and being spanked by prostitutes (vitter). the repubs have great majorities (and increasing majorities) in most state legislatures. any constitutional amendments or (shudder) constitutional convention will come from there.

 

We are going to see about that. Of course you do know they hold a monopoly over how a large portion of our communication is done.

Anyway, sadly for you, the U.S. Appeals Court for the 2nd Circuit in New York agreed to review a lower courts decision on Big Tech's Section 230 immunity. Big Tech censorship just might have met it's match!

 

That won't make a difference and here's why. Our Founding Fathers wrote this during a time when the worst weapon was a musket. It took skill and practice to operate and there were far, far fewer people. They weren't psychics that could know today, weapons can be automated and there are millions of people under our flag. And, it's unrealistic to expect them to have written for such a time far removed from where they were.

The arguments that 2As make are valid. I don't believe anybody denies there are real and present dangers in our daily lives. There are times that people need a gun to protect themselves and their loved ones or possibly strangers. The problem is NOT a reflection of those people and it's unfair to punish them because the others aren't so responsible (to have them stolen or used against them or whatever). It would be something like sterilizing all virgins because some girls and women became pregnant out of wedlock. It makes no sense and they don't like it, and rightfully so.

SPOILER ALERT - It gets real...

As with Roe v. Wade, we can go over these same arguments a gazillion times and it won't make a difference because we're focusing on the wrong issue. We, American citizens, are...

(1) Very hypocritical. We want to make rules for others but don't want to follow rules set by others (ie. people protesting wearing masks think they somehow have the right to tell a woman what she can do with her unborn fetus).

(2) Very judgmental about people with mental illness. If people who are struggling can't risk going to see a professional they are a potential (and probable) danger to other people. They often abuse alcohol and illegal drugs. They are often violent. They are often isolated in their mental prisons before it moves from a "them" problem to an "us" problem. I mentioned this in another thread but it bears repeating. Police officers are at risk of career suicide if they seek professional help from a mental health care provider. Why would we want people with guns, batons and badges running rogue?

I've posted about being abused by my parents. In high school, my father attacked me and my younger sister. I grabbed her away from him and we ran five blocks to the police station. We were both bleeding, bruised and upset. The officer at the desk outright said "Nobody is going to arrest a police officer for this. Come back should he kill one of you." and he kicked us out of the station. After I didn't live at home, he kicked in my door many times and beat me with free abandon. One time, I was living with a roommate who saw him choke me out and kick me when I fell. She called the police and was stunned they wouldn't take me to the hospital. I told her not to bother but she was a person that had no experience dealing with abusive cops. My uncle was also a Chicago cop. He beat all of his wives into the ICU many times. Decorated and all that just like my dad. It's not a pity party.

The point I'm making is that these people are putting their lives on the line every day to keep the rest of us safe. Unlike any other business, EVERY call is something chaotic and probably tragic. They need to have a SAFE PLACE to process that or it wears them down. I am also a former cop and probably the luckiest day of my life was losing my job after being injured by a drunk driver. I wasn't around long enough to become an addict and bully with a badge. I saw it in some of my co-workers. It's not pretty. The human mind is not designed to deal with constant stress. We aren't built that way which is why so many LEOs are addicts of some sort. Sure, we want those tough men and women standing on the front line in a war. Do we want those people - just shy of a total breakdown - on the streets every day? I don't think so.

It is a well-known fact that incarcerated people do NOT like child abusers and pedophiles. Neither survive very long in general population in prison. The reason behind this is most hardened criminals were abused as children and they have specific incidents in their childhood they believe contributed to them ultimately breaking the law and landing in prison. So, if an incarcerated person can make the connection between any and all the times they were hurt as children and the result (criminal behavior that lead to arrest), why can't mental health professionals address the source of the problem instead of the victim of that problem? It's backward and the reason it's backward is that abusive people don't seek help on their own. Their victims do. That's easy money for mental health professionals and they don't have to break a sweat.

Almost EVERY single time we hear about a mass shooting it is someone who was bullied and/or ostracized in some way. It's never the pretty cheerleader that just had a bad day. It's never the jock or class president. Yet, even today in 2021, some educators still prescribe to the theory that "everyone gets bullied at some point. It's a learning phase." It stops being a "learning phase" when that kid gets tired of it and takes his dad's guns and unleashes on people. There is absolutely no reason that a child should be made to endure while trying to get an education. Why are we not helping our children? Why are we not putting a stop to institutionalized apathy toward kids who are struggling? There's no good reason for it. We spend more money on military than anything close to what we spend on providing safe and productive schools for our children.

Our MO is "to fight". We want to be police for the whole damn world. Why? Because we're bullies. It's ingrained. It's what we enjoy apparently. So, we can either get up, go look in the mirror and be honest with ourselves. This societal problem is a direct reflection of WHO WE REALLY ARE and until we come to terms with that we are never going to turn the page on this issue.

 

What about the slaves? What about the buffalo? Reasons to hate America? Grow up.

 

Election results are clear evidence as explained. Duh.

 

What are you talking about?

 

That's okay; remember when another mass shooting occurs; we can just pray for the dead since they won't be needing any rights hereafter. Hug that gun close to your chest boys!

 

I'm talking about your implication of "Japanese internment camps". What were you talking about??????