The Republicans gave it their best shot . . .

Look,

Obama has brain washed the Democrats to a point where even Ben believes the more they try to stimulate the economy, all the more reason to raise the debt limit.

They truly believe that Obama's plan to create jobs has worked and that China can wait for eternity to be repaid. I have news for this administration, China will own us. We have gone too far to think with their plan in 10 yrs. we will be better off.

 

Merry Christmas to you too.

Earlier I said that the role of the federal govt is limited by the constitution---and it is. The fact that we have allowed those limitations to be violated does make them go away. the constitution still says what it said when it was written. Its a shame that it has been ignored.

 

so you were wrong again

 

How so? I said that the constitution limited the roles of the federal government, that remains a true statement. You and meta pointed out things that the federal govt does that are not spelled out in the constitution and somehow you come to a conclusion that since those things are not spelled out, that in some convoluted form or reasoning, says that the govt can do whatever it wants to do.

Are you in colorado or washington?

 

collecting a tax on the value of property owned is not the same as confiscating a % of a persons investment account. But, since you brought that up, what happens to your property if you don't pay your property taxes? Guess who takes ownership of it?

As far as taxing the rich to solve our debt and deficit problems, I guess we will just have to disagree. The numbers are quite obvious, but since you choose to ignore them there is no point in continuing the discussion.

What you don't seem to grasp is that the very rich can always find ways to escape paying taxes, the poor don't pay taxes, so the burden always falls on the middle and upper middle classes. Those of us who work for a living and have our income reported to the IRS.

Our financial problems were not caused by insufficient revenue, they were caused by overspending----overspending by congress to buy votes. Until that is fixed-------------------

 

you said the roles of the federal government are very clearly spelled out

they aren't all clearly spelled out, show me where the constitution says anything about the role of the air force

 

I think I said that the limits of the federal govt are clear in the constitution. But what point are you trying to make? No, it does not call for an air force, planes had not been invented when it was written so we have to look at the intent of the drafters, "provide for the common defense" clearly intended to cover all forms of defense.

again, whats your point?

 

here's exactly what you said:

please stop being so obtuse, my point is exceedingly clear

all the roles of the federal government are not very clearly spelled out

you can substitute 'role' for 'limit', if that matters to you

there you go, this phrase: "provide for the common defense", is quite vague

and it's not at all clear about how to provide for all forms of defense

other parts of the constitution are also unclear and it was done so, intentionally

 

OK, I admit to being somewhat unclear. The point I was trying to make is that the constitution does address the different roles of the states and the federal govt, with the intent being to limit the federal government. Do you disagree with that?

 

funny how you don't mention the section 10 limits on states

 

And I'm (*)(*)(*)(*) proud of ya, sonny. The difference between us is that I work for Robin Hood and you work for Prince John (who was a major thief in his own right).

 

That's just false. Revenue as a percentage is at a historic low.

No one is claiming it isn't an issue. There are adults offering solutions, and then there is you, accusing people of ignoring the problem.

Put forth your deficit reduction plan. I want to see it. With details. Numbers. Etc. Go.

 

I, for one would vastly rather have the governments hands tied than have it able to do somne bull(*)(*)(*)(*) fix that just puts us deeper into debt while offering no real solutions to the economic problems that currently plague us. Unfortunately as it stands right now it is the unfettered government bureaucracy that is the chief economic plague and while the Democrats who are owned lock stock and barrel by the government bureaucracy unions which is to say by the very bureaucrats over whom they supposedly exercise oversight, there will be nothing done about this infinitopod that daily reaches further and further into peoples daily lives.

 

the gop's obstructionism is much more worrisome

 

Cut the right wing talking point BS from that and what are we left with?
Nothing.

 

robin hood was a thief. prince john was a thief. there is no difference except who they stole from.

 

in absolute dollars, revenue is higher than it has ever been.

My plan-----cut govt spending 10% across the board, every agency, every dept, every location. Then close all overseas bases unless the host country agrees to pay 100% of the bill for the base.

Now, what is the dem/obama plan? all we have heard is more taxes and more spending.

 

right, standing on one's principles is to be denigrated at all costs. Obstructing obama's destructive financial ideas is the right thing to do.

 

please explain what point you are trying to make with this disjointed line of comments.

 

But only if you cherry pick to "absolute dollars" whicn thinking people know means nothing.

So your solution is show weakness and to whore out our military? (even more than it is already)

Your media controllers only tell you what they want you to know, why do you let them lie to you?

 

By insisting that we keep doing what we know doesn't work?
Conservatism is how we got here, why do you want to keep going down that road?

 

Oh you mean like continually increasing spending until the government requires one hundred percent of GDP like Obama seems to want. Yeah that won't work and can't work. So why do you talk about Republican obstructionism instead of Democratic madness?