Illegal immigration preferable to legal immigration

That is of course an individual who immigrates to the US who is not a legal citizen is more desirable than the individual who immigrates here to become a citizen. The principle for this is the same for why immigration was desirable during the earlier 20th century. As economist Milton Friedman explained"it is one thing to have free immigration to jobs, it is another to have free immigration to welfare.. and you cannot have both"

Friedman went on to say about illegal immigration "Look, for example, at the obvious, immediate, practical example of illegal Mexican immigration. Now, that Mexican immigration, over the border, is a good thing. It’s a good thing for the illegal immigrants. It’s a good thing for the United States. It’s a good thing for the citizens of the country. But, it’s only good so long as it’s illegal"

Why is this? because as long as immigration is illegal (that is, non-citizen workers), the people who come here do not qualify for federal welfare, they do not qualify for social security, they don’t qualify for the other myriad of benefits that legal citizens qualify for

[video=youtube;nniuaZuP_vo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nniuaZuP_vo[/video]


Milton Friedman was not a politician running for office, he was not in the business of saying what people want to hear to get votes, he was in the business of studying and understanding the economy. Milton Friedman received the nobel prize for economics in 1976, and was an economic adviser to president Reagan during the 1980s.

Milton Friedman's philosophy is something of the anti-Trump conservative. You almost never hear Donald Trump talk about his big wall at the Mexican border without talking about the big door for legal immigration he is going to open up. According to Trump's platform, we need to kick out the workers in the US who are not citizens, and let in more people who want to become US citizens. This platform stands as an antithesis to the economic theory of Milton Friedman

..and its not just immigration that the two stand in contrast to one another, take a look at what Milton Friedman and Donald Trump had to say on trade tariffs, and our trading with China


[video=youtube;7DhagKyvDck]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DhagKyvDck[/video]


economically speaking, Donald Trump is not a conservative, he is more to the left than Barrack Obama, Hillary Clinton, or Bernie Sanders. Among economists, both liberal and conservative, Trump is the most unpopular candidate in the race for president


Why a conservative economist says Trump could make America ‘the North Korea of economics’
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/05/06/how-trump-could-make-america-the-north-korea-of-economics/
Economists savage Trump's economic agenda
Raising tariffs and deporting millions of people will drive up prices and cause recession, experts assert.
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/01/trump-economy-217496

Donald Trump's tax plan is a fantasy
http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2015/09/trumponomics

Trump trade plans could cause global recession: Experts
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/03/10/trump-trade-plans-could-cause-global-recession-experts.html
Economists: Trump's charges against China are obsolete
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/ap/article-3312732/Economists-Trumps-charges-against-China-obsolete.html

Trump's Trade Policy Is a Big Loser
http://www.usnews.com/opinion/economic-intelligence/articles/2016-04-19/trumps-trade-policy-is-a-big-loser-for-the-us-economy

By this measure, Donald Trump sounds more liberal than Bernie Sanders
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/trump-is-the-most-liberal-republican-on-economics-since-nixon-2015-12-14

New Report Says Trump As Dangerous As Islamic Terrorism
http://dailycaller.com/2016/03/17/trump-as-dangerous-as-islamic-terrorism-says-economist-report/

The Economist lists Donald Trump winning election as a global risk
http://www.marketplace.org/2016/03/17/world/economist-lists-donald-trump-winning-global-risk

Economists dump on Donald Trump’s boast to bring jobs back from China
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/aug/5/donald-trump-boast-bring-jobs-back-china-gets-dump/?page=all

Economists Say Trump is Wrong
https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/history/americas-economic-history/economists-say-trump-is-wrong-2/

'Trumponomics' doesn't add up, could cause recession: Economists
http://www.metro.us/news/trumponomics-doesn-t-add-up-could-cause-recession-economists/zsJpal---UdV8v25nrVA3E/

Donald Trump’s plan to return U.S. jobs ‘implausible,’ economists say
http://www.pressherald.com/2015/08/05/donald-trumps-plan-to-return-u-s-jobs-implausible-economists-say/

The Economist Ranks a Trump Presidency As a Top 10 'Global Risk
http://insider.foxnews.com/2016/03/19/economist-ranks-trump-presidency-top-10-global-risk[/QUOTE]

 

[/QUOTE]

We are a country of laws established by a Constitution. If know one cares about the rule of law then you no longer have a country.

 

Oh good Lord. Hillary is the one talking about legalizing immigrants and expanding benefits, not Donald Trump.

 

"We can do a wall. We're going to have a big, fat beautiful door right in the middle of the wall. We are going to have people come in, but they are coming in legally"

"This will be a wall with a big, very beautiful door because we want the legals to come back into the country."

"We're going to build the wall, but we're going to have a big beautiful door, because we want people to come in. We want people to come in legally"

[video=youtube;-QeOSWm8WYk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QeOSWm8WYk[/video]

 

[video=youtube;7RdyAiDJN1w]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RdyAiDJN1w[/video]

 

1. Hillary's position does not change Trump's position

2. amnesty =/= citizenship

 

So the OP admits that government benefits are a bad thing.

Good news!

 

Friedman was speaking of the purely economical. There are obvious risks to just letting in anyone, and if they're illegal you of course have no idea who they are. In time like this, that's dangerous.

 

Statistically speaking, illegal immigrants commit crimes at a lower rate than the national average https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ld-trump-is-wrong-about-immigrants-and-crime/

but more than this, a more open immigration policy does not necessarily mean open borders. It simply means making the workers' permit more openly available, and then said permit can double as a criminal background check.

 

That's not relevant.. it might be true the crime rate of all illegal immigrants is lower.. That doesn't change the fact that terrorists might sneak in. If we don't have any control, anyone including terrorists can sneak in. That's the point.

 

Once again, we are not discussing open borders, we are talking about making the workers' permit more openly available, and then using said permit as a background check. This doesn't make us more vulnerable to the bad guys, it makes the bad guys easier to differentiate from the honest workers.

 

the title says illegal immigration is better than legal immigration. if they get work permits they are not illegal.

 

[/QUOTE]

What is killing America is illegal and legal immigration in tandem.

Lots of good references. Too bad none of the Trumpettes will read any of them. You are kind of wasting your 'breath'. Trumpettes are totally mesmerized by the charlatan.

 

We are a country of laws established by a Constitution. If know one cares about the rule of law then you no longer have a country.[/QUOTE] IIlegal immigration is great if there are more than enough Jobs to go around. That sadly thanks to leftists who have ignored most of Friedman's later work is no longer the case. Now most illegal immigrants come here and go straight onto the welfare rolls to be milked for votes by Democrats who don't seem to mind the endless increase in poverty in this country. And please most didn't come here to suck the government tit. They came here for the same reason your ancestors and mine did - to make a better life for themselves and their children. Unfortunately thanks to 60 years of liberal form over substance programs and a daily increase in rules and regulations they find themselves trapped in a leftist created cycle of poverty that didn't exist 100 years ago. so now the same pathologies that grip poor African American neighborhoods are beginning to hold sway in poor Latino neighborhoods and that, sadly, includes a good deal of gang violence,

 

What about diseases the illegals are bringing in, that would otherwise be checked out if they did things the right way?

What about the fact that illegal immigrants pay less in taxes, than they take out of the system?

 

You've got him quite wrong. I'm trying hard to recall where Trump called for limitless immigration. As I recall he said he wants legal immigration - which means footing current law,which is slow and restrictive. And I've heard him say he wants a lot more worker programs. Do they get free welfare? I don't think so.

I'm no real fan of Trump, but it seems to me that your criticism of him has depended on a straw man.

 

As explained in the very first line of the OP "That is of course an individual who immigrates to the US who is not a legal citizen"


Under current US immigration policy, work permits for non-citizens are not open. The notion is to allow honest immigrants to come/stay here with a work permit, and then if they ever want to return to their native country they can go back.

However, that is not our current policy, and the notion of Donald Trump's platform is that we should instead block access to people who do not go through the process to become US citizens

 

Don't have to be a citizen to migrate legally. But anyhow.. You just want to hand out more work permits? okay, fine, I agree with that. I just want to keep out criminals and terrorists, and people with disease. Good, I guess we agree on that.

 

It should be simple enough, instead of deporting 11 million people and putting up a wall with a "big beautiful door" we simply make getting a work permit an easy access thing, and everyone who gets a work permit goes through a background check

If we do this, then we can easily differentiate the bad guys from the good guys. Then we won't need to spend billions deporting 11 million people and putting up a wall. The honest people won't need to hide or sneak into the country anymore, and border security will then be able to focus on real criminal activity

 

Would you also agree to severing every benefit the illegals have? This included medical, education, subsidies, etc.

 

Well I'm not even sure what the purpose of these work permits are. There are already multiple visa programs for people to come in to the country to work. The OP seems to think there is no legal option for people to come here to work. There are plenty of legal options for people to work in the US. But in a country of 320 million people, do we really need to import workers? With the exception some agricultural jobs on the low end, and a few scientific/academic/entertainment jobs on the high end, there isn't a need for foreign labor.

 

With automation coming into play too there isn't a future for 1917 mass immigration for factory jobs either.

 

Because illegals aren't costing us billings right now? Every visit to an ER. Evert child they have or sneak through is costing us far
more then they're putting back in the economy. And when an illegal murders someone, what's that worth? Every time they get in an accident without insurance, what's that worth? Are all those numbers
bundled in what illegals cost the country? Nope. What's the value of the culture degrading? Let's face it. Hispanic culture has no history of great advancements in anything. Central and S Americas biggest contribution is drugs. Considering their numbers they haven't contributed much in tech, medicine or engineering. Almost every Hispanic country is riddled in political corruption. They're mostly all poor countries. NOT leaders.

Why we feel the need to import people who can't help make us better, is mind boggling. We need doctors, engineering. STEM. We don't need poor, uneducated workers. There isn't enough for them to do. How does it HELP us? That's the question no Democrat can answer. The usual response is it adds diversity. But no one can nail down what that truly means and how that helps. Its all philosophical what ifs.

The best run nations are the least diverse. And as we're seeing with the refugees, that diversity is quite dangerous.


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evidently there is a need.. Why else would so many come and work?

 

There is a demand for workers who will work cheaper for citizens, sure. And every job an illegal Mexican takes puts a citizen on welfare, so I don't know that Mr. Friedman's analysis is correct.