Forensic audit discredits GOP's election conspiracy theory in Ariz

AZ State Senators tried to pass a resolution to arrest county supervisors. It didn't pass by one vote. Republicans weren't satisfied with the certification, and wanted to take matters into their own hands and threatened incarceration if supervisors didn't comply with their subpoenas.

What is happening here is a microcosm for the damage Trump
as done to America. All this crap about democrats cheating is a
complete fabrication by Trump, and a large swath of the nation believes it. That he as done this is testament to the damage Trump has done to America. Although politicians, in general, have always had trust problems with the public, but amongst peers in congress and in state legislatures, it never was so pronounced as it is now. What it does is erode the spirit of cooperation and, as such, little gets done whereupon everyone believes they are right and are unwilling to compromise. This attitude really took hold when Newt Gingrich was speaker during the 90s, and with the repeal of the fairness doctrine, the advent of hate-the-left AM Radio the king of whom was Rush Limbaugh, this brought us the Tea Party and eventually Trump, and the extreme polarization we have today.

This, last december:

https://www.azcentral.com/story/new...t-vote-election-results-explained/4414408001/

The feud between the Arizona Senate and the Maricopa County Board of Supervisors over lawmakers' insistence that the county perform another hand count of 2020 general election results has escalated in the past few weeks.

Now, the Senate might take it even further.

The Senate, controlled by Republicans, has threatened to hold the supervisors, nearly all Republicans, in contempt for not responding to subpoenas asking for copies of allthe county's mail-in ballots and access to voting machines. The Senate wants to perform its own audit.

Some senators have even threatened to arrest the supervisors over the matter, and the body could vote on the the contempt resolution as early as Monday.

If the lawmakers goes ahead with this, it could be a first in Arizona history. No legislator interviewed could remember the Senate ever passing such a resolution.
In December, Senate Republicans issued two subpoenas to the supervisors that demanded images of every mail-in ballot, access to voting machines and software, and voter information, such as voter addresses, birth dates and party affiliation.

Well, after two more county audits, Maricopa's 2020 election votes were counted correctly, audits show:

The verdict: The election was sound.

https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow...op-s-election-conspiracy-theory-ariz-n1258742

Maricopa County on Tuesday released the results of election audits from two independent auditors it hired to verify that voting machines were not hacked, were not connected to the internet and counted votes properly during the 2020 general election. The auditors found that the county used certified equipment and software, no malicious hardware was found on voting machines, the machines were not connected to the internet, and the machines were programmed to tabulate ballots accurately, according to a letter from county election directors to the supervisors.

 

Thanks for the post. As always, the facts of the matter will prove unpersuasive to Trump devotees. The more factually sound the argument, the fewer responses you get from "the base."

 

Meanwhile, speakers at the CPAC continue spreading the lies of widespread voter fraud during the 2020 election.

Also meanwhile, GOP held legislatures continue working behind the scenes on making it harder and harder for people to vote.

They must really fear the will of the people.

 

What's happening in AZ as a result of Biden's victory?

The most recent example comes from Arizona. There, a senior Republican state lawmaker introduced a measure that would allow the legislature to ignore the state’s certified popular-vote results in a presidential contest, should a majority choose to do so. This, you will recall, was part of Trump’s play to overturn his loss last year, to get state legislatures to throw out the actual vote in favor of his imaginary one.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/01/29/how-rig-an-america/

 

Can't wait for the unbiased 60 Minutes investigation about this to be aired. Hey, let's hire mariachi bands to go to all the Republican senators' houses and block traffic. That's how politics works these days.

 

Why is it Repubs first thought is to change the rules instead of broadening the appeal of their party platform to attract more voters?

The Republican chair of Arizona's state House Ways and Means Committee introduced a bill Wednesday that would give the Legislature authority to override the secretary of state’s certification of its electoral votes.

GOP Rep. Shawnna Bolick introduced the bill, which rewrites parts of the state's election law, such as sections on election observers and securing and auditing ballots, among other measures.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/po...bill-give-legislature-power-toss-out-n1256097

 

A judge in AZ ordered a forensic audit requested by Republicans.

By not following the subpoenas these people refusing the forensic audit are breaking the law.

Democrats think that our laws do not apply to them.

 

As the double-standards and lies continue to tourniquet the Democratic party into disfunction, you say this? The only reason I supported the incumbent in 2020 was because I could easily discern that Democratic politicians were so obviously deceptive in their agenda and it frustrates me to see that people bought it the whole time.

 

It's encouraging to see there are still some Repubs with integrity who are tethered to reality.

Arizona House Speaker Rusty Bowers, a Republican, rebutted President Donald Trump’s meritless attempts to overturn the election results there in a sharply-worded statement in December 2020. He also dismissed the idea of the Legislature appointing its own electors to deliver the state's Electoral College votes to Trump.

"I voted for President Trump and worked hard to reelect him. But I cannot and will not entertain a suggestion that we violate current law to change the outcome of a certified election," he said at the time.

 

Feel free to provide evidence.

Dem disfunction is nothing compared to the party that believes is crap like Qanon, kow tows to white supremacists, anti-semiticism, and can't see that Trump was responsible for the attack on the Capitol.

 

Democrats did not refuse a independent audit, (and two audits had already been done and the votes certified, and repubs weren't happy with the lawful result) so what they refused was letting Republicans getting their grubby biased hands on the machines and voting apparatus, and that is what those subpoenas were all about. Trump and GOPers filed no less than seven lawsuits trying to overturn the audited certification and a federal judge tossed out all of the lawsuits as 'lacking evidence' (some were withdrawn). When dems refused those unlawful subpoenas ( they violated AZ state law) republicans then tried to pass a resolution to accomplish it, and the resolution, a first of it's kind in the history of that state, did not pass by one vote.
Instead of responding to the subpoenas,the supervisors filed a lawsuit Dec. 18 in Maricopa County Superior Court asking a judge to decide whether they should provide the information. The county argued, in part, that the subpoenas violate Arizona laws regarding ballot secrecy and access to ballots. But state law also requires that, after results are certified, ballots be kept “in a secure facility managed by the county treasurer, who shall keep it unopened and unaltered for twenty-four months for elections for a federal office.” See, the subpoenas requests were a violation of state law. A few weeks later, they hired an independent audit, no less than two of them, and both confirmed that the results were correct, the machines agreed with the paper ballots, and everything is fair and on the up and up. time and time again, what the bottom line here is the toxic spirit of empty and vacuous mistrust being promulgated by the white house. That is what is driving all of this.

“Using a fabricated crisis to rationalize an alarming abuse of power is unconscionable. If this assertion is not challenged, it will set us down a dangerous path,” “The real threats are the misinformation and manipulation intended to disenfranchise citizens, denigrate a strong election process and disrupt the peaceful transfer of power.” --AZ Secy of State Katie Hobbs.

Apparently, your accusation of "dems think out laws do not apply to them' is, indeed, ignorant of that actual execution of law that was followed by dems and it was republicans, not dems, who were going outside of the law.

 

What do you mean "the party that" does any of that? The R party doesn't promote any of that and public opinion wouldn't have it anyway.

You show me 1 Republican who favors any of that and I'll show you 1,000 who don't.

I know Q is your anchor these days but let me tell you - I lived everywhere and I currently live in a red state and I currently study public opinion and nobody believes that crap. Actually, the only way Q became mainstream was through out-partisans pushing the conspiracy as a way to smear others. Q was nothing until it became the right-wing boogeyman, which is telling.

 

what '1000s' of trump followers believe is Donald Trump and DJT seems to be very approving of them, calling them patriots, etc.

Q became famous because hundreds of Trump followers wore T shirts and carried posters / banners with Q indicias and logos at Trump rallies, noting that most presidents stop having election rallies after they are elected, but Trump continued to have several every month of every year he was in office, promoting Qanon even more, given that they love to attend his rallies. so, the driving force behind Q'a popularity is Trump, and no one else. He did NOTHING to stop it, denounce it, did nothing to call them crazy, but when asked, spoke of them in approving ways.




Oh, don't lecture this forum on boogeyman. You guys harp on antifa just about every day of the week.

 

Run a TURF analysis in your free time (lol I see you mention this later; post in my polisci thread).

>hundreds
Yeah, literally hundreds of his voters were promoting Q.

No, the driving force with regard to popularity (ie the proportion of the population that favors Q) is not those hundreds of Trump-voters; the driving force is news media coverage; +Q popularity <-- +negative news media coverage of Q by out-partisans.

They're already removing statues and instigating public violence in my city. I think you should be agreeing with me. I tie them to the Biden agenda very infrequently yet you tie Q to the Trump agenda very strongly.

 

Forensic audit discredits GOP's election conspiracy theory in Ariz

Nobody is arguing that the ballots were counted wrong. They are wondering what the effect of mass mailed ballots did to the content of those ballots. They wonder how in some places, including some places in Arizona, there were more ballots than registered voters. Things like that. Any fool can count.

 

Didn't happen.

 

Yes, there is always denial.

 

You are misinformed. Q has a following in the millions.

Q is all about Trump rallies, which are going to be on TV. It's not hundreds, it's thousands at rallies. And whatever the percentage is at rallies, it's safe to assume a similar percentage is in his base. Q anon patronage on 8kun and facebook is in the millions.
https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-n...ions-members-facebook-documents-show-n1236317

This is no small group, so the picture of insignificance you are trying to paint is a false one. This is why Trump won't disavow them, they are a large group. In fact, he can't win without them.

 

Show me the data. Show me the tortured data that tells you how many people subscribe to the Q conspiracy theory and I'll go on with your empty claims. "In the millions"... ha. What surveys are you analyzing?

 

Read the article I linked to.

 

Well, the Qanon entry in Wikipedia, saved to PDF, occupies 49 pages 8x11 pages. Hard to believe a small group would get that much info on Wiki.

It's a large group.

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-53692545

https://www.npr.org/sections/insurr...steal-content-twitter-suspends-qanon-accounts

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/aug/11/qanon-facebook-groups-growing-conspiracy-theory

The Guardian has documented more than 170 QAnon groups, pages and accounts across Facebook and Instagram with more than 4.5 million aggregate followers. The Guardian has also documented dedicated communities for QAnon followers in at least 15 countries on Facebook.

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-n...ions-members-facebook-documents-show-n1236317

 

lol None of that is survey data because nobody follows Q.

I said news media coverage was driving up popularity and you show me news media links saying how popular Q is...

 

The following is in the millions, like I said. Guardian isn't going to make up numbers.

Heck, on only one facebook group, facebook reported that there were 200,000 members on the one account they cancelled. There are thousands of other groups.

You are in total denial.

 

Hmm, maybe you should read up on Navanti Group... because the national surveys I see show that 60% of adults think Trump "seems to support people who promote" QAnon, less than 9% know "a lot" about QAnon and more than half of US adults know "nothing at all" about QAnon. Less than 4% are warm toward QAnon at all.

You could have just seen what people are saying but no you pretend social media press releases and AT&T-owned tabloid-format Guardian are more relevant to this discussion.

 

I have never understood the reluctance of the democrats to do full top to bottom investigation in every state. I am beginning to suspect that they are afraid of what might be found.

I am not proposing the election be overturned. Simply determining where the flaws are and make sure they do not happen again. In spite of what the democrats say, there was likely fraud, probably on both sides.