A new poll shows 52% of Republicans actually think Trump won the popular vote

Except of course where I described what right was at risk.

Marriage was specifically the issue. Do you even know what prop 8 was?

 

Channeling Obama much ?? It's all Fox News fault. Hilarious.

 

The constitution says nothing about marriage rights which means that marriage rights are left to the individual states.

 

I never claimed that he did. (Actually, I think that he won 30 states.)

My precise words were as follows:

"[T]he other 49 states, taken together, voted for Donald Trump." (Bold added)

Put another way: If we look at the remaining 49 states (i.e. all of the US, except for California), it gives more votes to Donald Trump than to Hillary Clinton.

Do you not fully comprehend this?

Not at all.

He is actually an admixture of conservative and liberal.

As regarding some issues (e.g. trade protectionism), he is in line with typical liberals.

As regarding other issues (e.g. rebuffing the efforts of illegals to invade our sovereign nation), he is much more in line with conservatives.

 

You stated trump won 49 states. That is not correct.

You said liberals wanted to do away with the electoral college. Trump is on record stating he wanted to do away with the electoral college.

 

Nope. 14th amendment stipulates equal application of the law. In order to deny a civil right, like marriage, the government must demonstrate a compelling interest served by the denial. No such interest has or can be shown for denying same sex couples marriage, which is why bans on same sex marriage are forever struck from US law.

 

Marriage is not a civil right for anyone.

 

That is not correct. Trump once stated "The electoral college is a disaster for a democracy" - he did not state that the he wanted to do away with the electoral college. His current position is "The Electoral College is actually genius in that it brings all states, including the smaller ones, into play. Campaigning is much different!".

 

The Supreme Court disagrees. They've ruled it is in several cases.

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Close enough.

Well obviously he likes it now. Had he lost, he would have said the same thing he did last time he didn't agree with them.

 

It is a matter to be decided by the states.

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Not close enough. And he is currently on record in agreement with the electoral college.

 

No right was at risk. Marriage was not the issue in Prop 8. Surely you know that.

 

Nope. The states can set certain marriage guidelines, such as age of consent, but they can't violate the US constitution. That's why loving v Virginia overturned interracial bans, and obergfell overturned same sex bans.

Yes close enough. And of course he's on record now. Had it gone the other way, he would have been against them, like he was 4 years ago.

 

Correct. Beyond that "marriage" was not an issue in prop 8.

 

Except for marriage

It was the central issue of prop 8. Literally the only issue of prop 8. But you know that of course.

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Incorrect, and marriage was the only issue in prop 8

 

The popular vote in CA is routinely nullified at the whim of the political class. How can elections in places like that be taken seriously?

 

Unconstitutional ballot initiatives are overturned. That is a specific function of the judiciary, lol

 

No, I did not.

I stated that he won the majority of the popular vote in the 49 remaining states (which excludes California), when taken together--not that he won all 49 of those states.

In any case, it is really a moot point, since the Founders (thankfully!) established the Electoral College, in order to move away from a pure democracy, and more toward a federal republic.

Those on the left will (presumably) never accept Donald Trump as a legitimate president, as he did not do the "democratic" thing, and win the popular vote.

And I am guessing that you are among these people.

Yes, (regrettably), he is.

Of course, that sentiment is from the rather distant past.

Whether his recent conversion is a matter of pure principle, or a matter of convenience, I really do not know.

And neither, frankly, do you.

But I believe--and always have--that the Electoral College is the way to go.

Dyed-in-the-wool Democrats surely do not, as the Democratic Party has lost three of the past five presidential elections; and it has actually carried the popular vote in two of those three losses.

 

He did not with the popular vote in 49 states.

I have stated repeatedly that trump is the duly elected president. He won the 2016 presidential election. I only ever bring up the fact Clinton received more votes that trump when you guys (not necessarily you in particular) state trump had a mandate, or that the majority of americans rejected Clinton.

 

Marriage was not an issue nor was it at risk.

 

Nonsense. The ballot initiative was entirely constitutional. The controversy was aimed directly at undermining the democratic process by disenfranchising citizens to strip them of their power to influence the ruling political class at the ballot box. What passes for a "progressive" movement despises the constitution and the democratic process.

 

Nonsense. There was no constitutional issue involved in Prop 8 or any other ballot initiative nullified by the minions of the corrupt political class. Which is why you are unable to cite any specific language in either the constitution or court decision that supports your argument.

 

it was the central issue.........

lol

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demonstrable fact.

not according to the constitution, or the courts.

.
citizens are not permitted to remove the rights of other citizens via ballot initiatives. It's why prop 8 no longer exists.

Prop 8 was overturned by a conservative, lol

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demonstrable fact.

prop 8 violated the 14th amendment, which is why the court overturned it and it no longer exists.

Except for where I specifically cited in the constitution the language which supports my argument. Which was reflected in the court ruling you refuse to read.

 

I note that once again you are unable to provide any language from either the constitution or any court decision.
I am sure I am the only one who notices.

 

I have already stated that Donald Trump won the popular vote in 30 states--not 49. (Of the 49 remaining states--excluding California--when the total popular vote is taken together, Donald Trump received more votes in those states than Hillary Clinton did.

Here are the pertinent facts:

Hillary Clinton: 65,844,610 votes

Donald Trump: 62,979,636 votes

Difference: 2,864,974 votes

But now, please, just look at California's totals:

Hillary Clinton: 8,753,788 votes

Donald Trump: 4,483,810 votes

Difference: 4,269,978 votes

Without California, therefore (in other words, with the other 49 states taken together), Donald Trump would have won the popular vote by 1,405,004 votes.

A fact which you churlishly admit (how could you deny it, since he will be sworn in on January 20?), even though you apparently wish to delegitimize him.

Then why do you not debate those people "in particular" who have stated that "the majority of [A]mericans" voted against Hillary Clinton?

In any case, a "mandate" is usually what a newly elected president makes of his election. For instance, George W. Bush--in 2000--actually received fewer votes than Al Gore did. Yet Bush governed just as though he had, in fact, received a mandate; and he was re-elected in 2004, as a consequence.

 

14th amendment, equal protection clause. I gave you the ruling, you are terrified to read it for some reason.

everyone has noticed you've been given the ruling, but are terrified to read it.

At least you've finally backed away from your easily refuted claim that prop 8 wasn't about marriage, lol.

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14th amendment, equal protection clause. I gave you the ruling, you are terrified to read it for some reason.

everyone has noticed you've been given the ruling, but are terrified to read it.

At least you've finally backed away from your easily refuted claim that prop 8 wasn't about marriage, lol.