FoxHastings said: ↑ Women are "allowed" to have elective abortions up to 23 weeks. Not sure what you mean.. No state says women are obligated to give birth. Not in the way the OP indicates they're obligated. Women do not have some "holy duty" obligation to procreate YUPPERS! There should be NO restrictions or laws on abortion... NONE However, RvW protected women from those among us who wish to impose their religious views on everyone like misogynistic dictators.. . In case you hadn't noticed the world treats the 'sanctity of life " flippantly and has for 10,000 years... Unlike Anti-Choicers, I value living people including women[/QUOTE]
They are two very different scenarios though. Abortion is the termination of an unwanted pregnancy and if a woman does not want to be pregnant, the State has no right to force her to be. The woman is protected by individual rights and the fetus is not because the fetus is not an individual. The woman is an actual human being and the fetus is only a potential one and one should never cofuse the two. As soon as one decides to equate the potential with the actual, there is nothing stopping anyone from burying you alive because, afterall, you are a potential corpse. They will justify it with "Think about the undead!" Genetic manipulation is both scary and fascinating. It is a complex matter that, I guess, belongs in a different thread.
LOL, you make it sound so Evil!!! You: ""If the culture embraced the idea a women should not engage in the sex act with a man that has no interest in her well being, or the well being of her possible offspring, abortion would be a very small issue"" Why would "culture " do that....why should women's sex lives be controlled? If raindrops were roses...IF IF IF... Do you believe women are cattle who should only "breed" appropriately? Guess what? Women have sex for FUN!! It's FUN and healthy and normal and natural and , did I say FUN! ...and they have it no matter what anyone else says....and they have it as much as men do !!! LOL!
Just a couple things. Sex is fun. For sure. So is riding a motorcycle without a helmet. So is driving at autobahn speeds on public roads. So is to wearing a seatbelt. Underage drinking is fun too. So, what separates those fun activities where governmental intrusion has been driven, mostly by democrats, which is so inherently different than sex? I mean, folks, like you would tell me that the danger my possible death by head injury from a motorcycle crash demands that government require me to wear a helmet at least. Is manadory condom or BC usage in the cards? Unlikely. Democrats demand that I wear a face covering in public lest I "spread the virus" even though I don't have the virus. But no tickets, or arrests for not using BC, right? I mean, shudder the fact that unprotected sex leads to disease, inconvenient offspring, etc, but government cannot get in the way... It boggles the mind the level of hypocrisy the democratic party stance on sex is these days. Sex is fun. Evidently smoking crack is fun. Lots of things might be fun, and yet, only sex, it seems, is the bridge too far for democrats to consider being reasonable about. One actually wonders why. Democrats would have us believe that any expectation that hinders unprotected or irresponsible sex must be costs borne of the state, including medical termination of pregnancy just because no one should not be able to experience that "fun". And yet, you cannot go out, by yourself surfing in CA oceans lest the police haul you off for violating a quarantine. Cause, you know, that's no burden on your personal idea of "fun"... I say, if liberals can shut down the economy because of fear of covid, what's not covered under that precedent?
LOL, the sexual drive of human beings compared to the "urge to ride a motorcycle"...hilarious... Republicans want to ban abortion so poor women have more kids for TAXPAYERS to pay for!! Republicans, instead of thinking of the welfare of poor children, want MORE poor children to pay for by attempting to take away women's rights, force them to have kids, AND shut down clinics that PROVIDE BIRTH CONTROL.. Republicnas say they are "Pro-Life" but find wearing a mask to protect the LIFE others waaaay too difficult ...you're a laugh riot
No, it cannot, we are constantly told that the threat a fetus presents to a woman's life is remote but it is actually somewhat high and it is always there. Particularly in the final stages even a fetus that miscarries can easily kill or do permanent damage to its host. Hidden conditions in the mother are a special problem here and we are not even considering the extra risks encountered by low-income women who cannot afford adequate medical care. Conservative mythology notwithstanding pregnancy is decidedly not a low-risk proposition And in any case, the fact that a woman doesn't want to deal with an unwanted growth is just about all the "legitimate reason" she should need to terminate it in a free country. If I want to remove a wart I shouldn't have to consult the Vatican.
I don't believe in helmet laws or speed limits for motorcycles. However there should be liability insurance regulations so a road rocket that wrecks my car has to fix it.
So VERY true. Consider how most anti-reproductive freedom conservatives act once the baby is born and their actual true motivation becomes blindingly obvious. They want to punish women (and ONLY women) for daring to have SEX in some way they disapprove of. Anything else is smoke and mirrors, they know it and so does everyone else.
No, abortions should be mandatory if the child will be on public assistance. In fact, you should need a license to have a kid. In most cities, I can't have a cat for companionship without a license but I can pump out humans to my heart's content and nobody says ****
Well, Republicans are only for small, laissez-faire governments when the lights are turned on and beds are made. As soon as lights and blankets are off they want big government. Just one in many ways in which Reps and Dems are actually one and same.
I get that women have a special relationship with their children, but they have an even more special relationship to their own bodies. Also, early-stage fetuses lack many of the traits we think of in persons.
Most Dems are not all that upset about who you want to marry, nor what bathroom stall you feel comfortable in.
FoxHastings said: ↑ LOL, the sexual drive of human beings compared to the "urge to ride a motorcycle"...hilarious... Republicans want to ban abortion so poor women have more kids for TAXPAYERS to pay for!! Republicans, instead of thinking of the welfare of poor children, want MORE poor children to pay for by attempting to take away women's rights, force them to have kids, AND shut down clinics that PROVIDE BIRTH CONTROL.. Republicans say they are "Pro-Life" but find wearing a mask to protect the LIFE others waaaay too difficult ...you're a laugh riot Oh, just stop with that crap.....I AGAIN remind you this is the ABORTION FORM.....and Democrats are on the side of women having the same rights everyone else has.....Republicans are NOT. And I , once again, showed how Republicans do NOT REALLY CARE ABOUT LIFE.
I can understand your angst. My father , who would've been 100 years old this year, paid attention to politics for MANY years. He wisely told me, " Politicians are all liars and crooks, but when the Democrat crooks are in office we (middle class) do better and when the Republican crooks are in office the rich do better....so who are you going to vote for?" At least you responded to my : """"Republicans, instead of thinking of the welfare of poor children, want MORE poor children to pay for by attempting to take away women's rights, force them to have kids, AND shut down clinics that PROVIDE BIRTH CONTROL.. Republicans say they are "Pro-Life" but find wearing a mask to protect the LIFE others waaaay too difficult ...you're a laugh riot""""" NO one else could
Sounds like a great man. I am not a partisan tribalist. I am for small government, individualism, freedom and capitalism and no party represents these ideals and values. Perhaps Rand and Ron, but they are too principled to win the nomination.
My Old Man was fond of saying, "Those G--damn politicians in D.C. are like a bunch of cats, one s--ts and the rest come running to cover it up!". I miss him.
Genetic manipulation does belong in abortion threads and so does the fact that tens of thousands of babies per year spend the first few weeks in intensive care because they were born addicted to drugs. Both situations evoke questions about what human rights exist prior to birth. I posit that humans do have at least some rights prior to birth that are violated by the above practices.
I am part of the world, and I don't. Also I care about the living. For example, the tens of thousands of babies in the ICU right now addicted to drugs. They are there because of an increasingly normalized opinion that it doesn't matter what one does to a fetus.
Maybe individuals care about the sanctity of life but the world in general doesn't....and hasn't. Maybe if their mothers hadn't felt an "obligation to give birth" they wouldn't be suffering now.
"A woman has an obligation to give birth" no one should ever force a rape victim to have her rapists baby
Or when Leftist Pro Choicers show they do not actually believe in choice when they talk about markets and guns. Ugh. I never understood why Pro Choicers keep repeating this useless "gotcha" argument of a strawman. They really have nothing to do with each other. The inconsistency of "Pro Lifers" is not that they do not believe in a Welfare State, but that they do not believe in life. Yes, since they are guided by religious mysticism, they oppose sex only "because God said so". They hate the fact that people are having sex for other reasons than those listed by God because they hate individual life since they are altruists. However, it is not true that it is a purely misogynistic stance. They would have been against abortion if men got pregnant and opposing abortion hurts men just as much. Furthermore, if they are prepared to regulate abortion, they are certainly prepared to regulate other things too. Illegalisation of abortion hurts the woman, the father and the child - Everyone just as much.
