Easing of precautions: premature, or about time?

So the CDC today said, vaccinated people, no need for precautions at all. No masks, no social distancing, indoors or outdoors (including indoor dining), no nothing, with some tiny exceptions (hospitals, long term care facilities, prisons). Non-vaccinated people, still some but fewer recommended precautions.

I'm not talking about the economy or politics. Private businesses, governors, mayors, they should do as they feel fit. I'm NOT for lockdowns. I'm not trying to make of this, a political or partisan thread. Republican governors want to prohibit any mandatory precautions? Fine with me. Democrat governors want to keep some? Fine with me. Whatever.

I'm just talking about CDC recommendations and whether or not they are wise versus premature.

On one hand, I'm thrilled. Who isn't sick and tired of this, and eager to go back to normal life?

On the other hand, I look at our 38,344 new cases today, and 744 deaths (so far; the day is not over yet). Both numbers are 3rd worst in the world, only behind India and Brazil. 4th place Argentina, 26,000. Then France and Colombia, 19,000 each (already 5th and 6th place, half of what we have). Germany, 17,000. Iran 14,000. Turkey 11,000, in 9th place. From 10th place on, all countries are below 9,000, four times+ fewer than what we have .

OK, so, still with the third worst outbreak in the world in absolute numbers (a bit better in numbers per capita), we're tossing precautions out the window. The Europeans are also saying they'll reopen everything including international travel.

My point is, what is that we've seen over and over and over again, India being the most prominent current example?

Countries celebrating victory over the pandemic, easing up precautions, and boom, there we go again: another surge, another wave.

Sure, we're less subject to it now here in the USA, given that we're reaching 50% of vaccinated people; not the case of India or Brazil, and we're doing better than most European countries, too.

But I confess that I'm still a bit nervous about this. We should be fine: we got lots of vaccines; unlike the ones in some other countries, ours are very effective and safe; we're getting to warmer weather... but there are variants around... precisely, the ones from India and Brazil, the B.1.617 and the P.1., and we can see what they are doing over there.

So, is it entirely excluded that we might see some additional surge/wave if we drop precautions too soon and these more aggressive variants get a foothold here? Yes, unfortunately yes. I hope that it doesn't happen, but it's not totally excluded, especially if new mutations result in more escape from the vaccines.

So, we'll see.

Opinions?

I know that some people here think that we should never have had precautions to start with, which in my opinion is a misguided and irresponsible view; anyway, let's try to refrain from relitigating that; I'm talking about the present and the future, not the past. What do you all think?

 

Long past time...

 

Simple. Ban all travel to and from those countries until they get a handle on it...

 

Not that simple. Travel ban or not, the virus always manages to leak out. We already have these variants here in the USA, as we speak.

 

I believe you are being overly optimistic about "going back to normal." There is no going back. Our new normal will always involve how to mitigate COVID's stronghold until a larger percentage of people are willing to get the vaccine and there are more vaccines to fight the variants.

Sorry I'm not excited about this news. I have two kids that have been on remote learning since last year, two elderly parents and my own precarious health. I'm hesitant to see this as anything more than a feeler just to test the water. We could thrown right back in the thick of it at any moment.

 

Making generalisations about the US as an outsider is very difficult, however the average response between extremes appears to be reasonable precautions to prevent hospitals being overwhelmed, rather than seriously preventing the spread of the disease.

In Australia one person with Covid will lockdown a state. The difference in approach is staggering.

So reducing restrictions when you have Covid running wild seems even more perplexing.

 

vaccinations are slowing down, so he have hit enough vaccines to start returning to normal, the ones at risk now are the ones refusing to get vaccinated, we can't change that, if they get covid that will be on them now

if the unvaccinated want to lie and say they are vaccinated, they take the risk, but reality is, spread has slowed down thanks to those patriotic Americans that have chosen to take the vaccine

we may have a surge, but due to the number vaccinated already, it should be slower to spread

 

That is true, IF a new variant doesn't defeat the vaccines.

 

I suspect that one big reason the CDC came out with these recommendations today, was to get more people to take the vaccine.
If you say "if you are vaccinated you can do everything just like before" it's more likely that people will get vaccinated.
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Airplanes are still carved out as an exception, together with the other ones I mentioned before.

 

We have been so very very lucky in that we have not had to bother much except when we have had the occasional outbreak and then it has been people so cross with the people who were lax and either breached quarantine or precautions - not the government bring restrictions in but the idiots who triggered those precautions in the first place. Don’t get me wrong - we had our fair share of people grizzling and Griping About masks but it was more an issue of “ oh! For heavens sake already we have not had a case for DAYS - lift the restrictions already!”

This has had a downside though - Vaccine hesitancy. Average Joe does not see the reason to muck about getting a shot when it does not affect them directly. That slow uptake and an over cautious government with the added issue of a widely dispersed population in a hot country has added all sorts of logistical issues. And now it is our flu season........... flu vax to add to the logistics............ sigh.......

 

I think the whole world is watching India and........OMG! What a horrific tragedy!

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-05...india-to-take-coronavirus-seriously/100136506

 

That's been my suspicion as well. It's a bit of a carrot to urge people to get the vaccine sooner than later. Long as we don't have some major flare-up of new cases over it, I suppose it will be a good idea. Feels like a bit of a gamble.

 

I suspect something quite different, copying from another post I made:

Here it is folks, the DNC's 2022 strategy.

• Only 28% of the people in America are considered fully vaccinated.
  
• The vaccines aren't fully effective in all cases, diminishing widely from averages along certain factors such as age and overall health condition.
  
• The vaccines are unproven against a number of mutations including the India variants which have now been found in the UK and is probably already here in the US as well.
• The vaccines have not been proven to prevent the spread of COVID from a vaccinated person to others.

So why, in the holy **** of all ****ing mother ****s, has the CDC just told people to cast off their masks? It makes no scientific sense, it makes no medical sense, it makes no sense of any kind... EXCEPT political strategic sense. Because this move leaves a mountain of unknowns on the table but the one thing it surely does is robs us of our best front line defense against a resurgence. And so herein we arrive at our point. The Democratic Party, suffering massive policy losses both home and abroad, is facing a sizeable midterm defeat because every single item on its agenda is failing categorically and catastrophically except for one: its COVID approach. No other policy from the Dem Congress nor the Biden White House has achieved the approval ratings that their COVID actions have, not even close.

Therefore, knowing that Dems can win on the COVID ticket, and knowing that a maskless America is all the more likely to descend back into dark days, I unofficially present to you the DNC's 2022 strategy. Go forth and make it happen. Cast off your mask, spread sickness, bring on death, and help the DNC take that very very very small step towards absolute (and thereby permanent) control of Congress.​

 

Its a dumbass terrible hella gamble idea. Does this pro-vax vs anti-vax, pro-mask vs anti-mask culture of ours really feel like the sort of environment where we can pick up big gains in vaccination numbers with a ploy like this? I think its more likely we'll have far more people lying about being vaccinated so they can go un-masked rather than actually getting it. This is such an incredibly stupid move by people who aren't stupid, soooo... why did it happen? My thinking is, they're trying to cause a new outbreak.

 

Nonsense.

 

Uh, what? So, if the Dem strategy fails and get a damaging new wave, that helps the Democrats? Okaaaaayyyy....

 

yup, since we have a Democrat POTUS, it won't be called racist this time

Ahh the politics of a virus

 

Maybe the economic situation is also pushing this line of thinking. It will take a while to spool up the economy and get back to some semblance of normal, and here we are with about as many vaccinated, vulnerable Americans as we are going to get.

 

With the preponderance of evidence now in existence concerning the ability of the vaccines in use in the US to prevent symptomatic and asymptomatic infections, there really is no other option if we are truly “following the science”.

If a vaccinated individual doesn’t “feel safe”, I recommend wearing an N95 quality (or better) mask in the environments where that individual is most likely to be infected.

 

I wouldn't say that this announcement is declaring a victory over the pandemic in the country, but I would say that it is good news for the vaccinated. We will, of course, see unvaccinated claiming they are in order not to wear a mask - but they are simply endangering other non vaccinated folks. I think its a little early to be going back to normal life (packed concert halls, maskless), but it will be wonderful to not have another hot summer under a mask!

I am one who supports the idea of a vaccination passport - and this may push the idea further.

 

OH BROTHER! You WILL wear a mask until the day you die, (alone of course, as no one will be allowed near you) and you WILL be vaccinated, the Covidians will compel businesses to deny you buying and selling unless you have the wuddle "passport" and government to use it's vast coercive powers to see that you do. Damn....sounds vaguely familiar to something I heard waaay back in Sunday School. Enjoy the way it's gonna be.

 

If you're talking to me, you are completely misguided in your assumptions. I'm worried about public health and possible further mutations and another wave, but personally, I've been maskless while resuming dinner parties at home with friends, and will go tomorrow with my wife to a restaurant, maskless. The situation is unchanged at work because I'm a physician and hospitals are still carved out of the maskless recommendation, so it is mandatory for us to continue to wear masks at work. And I'm not a proponent of the vaccine passport, and I have posted my contrary opinion to it in other threads, with the reasons why I oppose it.

So, complete failures of assuming stuff about people you don't know.

This said, I don't know if you simply replied to the thread, addressing your response to the original poster (me) or if you are replying to someone I have on Ignore so that part doesn't show in your post. If it's the latter, never mind.

 

Sure, they are following current science, but the mutations/variants conundrum is what worries me. And I did say, hopefully it wont happen to us since we have a decent vaccination rate as compared to most other countries.

 

Dimple was a dentist. I can't think of a more risky job than that during a pandemic. It's *possible* for a doctor, hospital employee or nursing home employee to avoid unmasked people to a certain. It's guaranteed that a dentist will always be up close and personal with unmasked people.

How tragic.

 

And, like the unvaccinated who will lie to go maskless, people will be buying and making forged vax passports. They are rolling them out in the UK soon. I hope that gives us some idea on how to make this work effectively in the US.