Failure of bureaucracy in COVID-19 testing.

Discussion in 'Coronavirus Pandemic Discussions' started by 557, Mar 15, 2020.

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  1. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    So we’ve all heard bits and pieces of why testing in certain parts of the US has been scarce. It’s referred to as red tape, administrative details, etc.

    Tonight I did a bit of reading and searching and came up with a little more “meat” but I’d like input from others that may have more knowledge.

    It’s my understanding the foundations for the problem began in 1902 when action was taken to ensure safety of vaccines after some kids acquired tetanus from contaminated vaccines.

    In 1944 this was expanded into the Public Health Service Act which also laid out the Federal Government’s quarantine authority as well as authority in all aspects of communicable diseases.

    Through the years amendments were made and in 2004 the concept of Emergency Use Authorization was added under The Project BioShield Act. This allowed private enterprises a quicker, but not automatic route to get products to market in disaster scenarios. (Most estimates of time from research to market under normal FDA and CDC regulations I can find are in the 10 year range!)

    In 2013 the Pandemic and All-Hazards Preparedness Act expanded the FDA commissioner’s authority to fast track approval of things like private sector COVID-19 tests.

    Even with all these amendments, in the present it took until Feb. 4 for HHS to declare a national security public health emergency, the precursor to issuance of Emergency Use Authorizations.

    It seems to me the layered nature of bureaucracy is to blame. A public health emergency was issued on January 31, but it was not technically the correct type to trigger EUA powers by FDA.

    Also, even when EUA’s were in effect, private industry was left confused as to whether government was actively soliciting help or not.

    South Korea is held up as an example we should follow. In 2015 South Korea depended on top down bureaucracy and it’s Center for Disease Control to handle a MERS outbreak. The results were disastrous. Since, they have streamlined things to the point when COVID-19 hit, the government just said “go” to the private health sector and testing happened. No confusing public health emergency designations, no lengthy EUA paperwork, no lengthy safety protocols, and no politics.

    What am I missing? Does overemphasis on safety of products play a part? What if EUA’s happened quickly and a private lab ended up killing people? I’d like to hear everyone’s opinion on how we should handle this next time. Add bureaucracy or eliminate it?
     
  2. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    It is a sign of the times that our exceptional country's exceptional government is 3 weeks behind the power curve because we had no test kits.

    How can public health be addressed if there are no test kits for any given contagion? It cannot.

    The unexceptional countries of China, South Korea, Taiwan and other inferior countries managed to get it under control fairly quickly. China built hospitals in days. The US can't even come up with test kits.

    Do some of us live in alternate realities?
     
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  3. XploreR

    XploreR Well-Known Member

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    Failure of bureaucracy in COVID-19 testing.
    I suspect Trump's decision to fire the head of the CDC, then cut their departmental funding to make them impotent during a crisis, may have had an affect on the situation.
     
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  4. 61falcon

    61falcon Well-Known Member

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    Have you noticed how many medical experts trotted out by networks and cable channels are of Indian birth extraction???Thank God for them!!!!
     
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  5. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    I'm flabbergasted. You mean to say we had no test kits immediately available for a disease that no one outside of China even knew existed 3 months ago? How damnably inefficient of them. Good Lord folks...
     
  6. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    You have any documentation? I’d love to see whatever you have.
     
  7. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    So what should we do differently next time? South Korea learned from their previous mistakes. Do you have anything constructive to add?
     
  8. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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  9. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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  10. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    Pathetic!
     
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  11. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Sure, one get rid of the excessive red tape. That will help. Beyond that we're not even three months into into this, give people time to do there jobs. Takes a while to get the relavent production line up and running. Let's remember one of Chinas hurry up hospitals suffered a catastrophic collapse not long after. It is almost always better to take your time and get it right the first time.
     
  12. rkhames

    rkhames Well-Known Member

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    How do you create a test kit for a virus that you do not have a sample on hand of. The US was dependent on China to send them the map the virus' DNC, before they could create the samples. The mapped DNC was sent, probably by show boat, to the US in January. Several US labs had to replicate the DNC, and Samples of the virus had to be created. All before the test kits could be created. China on the other hand sent Iran and Italy test kits and medications for dealing with the virus. Do you see the problem here?

    It is not test kits or medications that keep our this disease from spreading. It is the utilization of social isolation procedures that keep it from spreading. The US is eighth in total cases in the world. Many smaller countries have far more cases then the US. Contrary to what the liberals will tell you, test kits does not stop the spread of the disease. It takes people doing what the Government tells them to do to keep themselves safe.

    But people have this idiotic trend of doing what they personally believing that the authorities say what they personally believe instead of what they actually say. Confusing? Let me explain. The government has been telling people that masks are for those that are sick, to keep others safe from you. They have said that if you wear a mask to protect yourself from others, then you will be putting yourself at greater risk of getting the disease. Yet, we see people walking around with masks on everyday. The other day, I saw a man with a beard wearing a mask. The mask was over his mouth, and part of his beard. But it was not even over his nose. He was walking around shaking everyone's hands. When he got to me, I refused to shake his hand. He asked me why. I told him that he is wearing a mask, so he must have the virus. He moved the mask over his nose, and said he was only trying to keep himself safe. I said, "You didn't hear that you should shave your beard and mustache, and only use a mask if you are sick with the virus?" I swear he actually said, "That's not what I heard." I pulled the info up on my cell phone, and showed it to him. He then said that he did not believe it, as I was sanitizing my phone. This is the type of attitude that will spread the disease. Not a lack test kits.
     
  13. XploreR

    XploreR Well-Known Member

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    Go online to Google & search for "Trump fires CDC head". The first item that popped up answers all your questions.
     
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  14. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    upload_2020-3-16_20-17-24.png

    Nothing here answers my questions.
     
  15. Aquarius

    Aquarius Well-Known Member

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    We do not need corona virus witch hunts. Just accept corona and the less than 1% mortality rate it carries
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2020
  16. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    Compare and contrast the responses of the socialist government in China to the Big Pharma-owned government in the US.

    While the former was able to test and analyze many citizens in days and weeks, and build 10 hospitals in 2 weeks, the latter, whether through gross incompetence or malicious intent, had no test kits available, and 3 weeks in has tested a wee tiny percentage of citizens.

    The former had a handle on a response in fairly short time as these things go, the latter is still bumbling along with not a clue about how many citizens are even infected.
     
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  17. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    Yes, I think we should evolve our public health policy to include the people of the US, including poor folk who cannot participate in our profit and greed-driven system. I think we should be able to elect real leaders and reject charlatans like DJT/Pence.
     
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  18. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Utter nonsense. 2 months in for them was last January a ccording to some by then they more than ten thousand sick and more than 1000 dead. We are a little more than two months in we have we have hundreds sick and tens dead. And people wonder why I think leftist can't do math.
     
  19. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    You do realize South Korea’s failure in 2015 was attributed to them not relying on a “profit and greed-driven” system? Letting that system loose is what allowed their testing to succeed this time.
     
  20. ronv

    ronv Well-Known Member

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    Go online and look for how did korea get tests so fast.
     
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  21. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    How come Australia was using drive through testing stations weeks before the US really started its testing?
     
  22. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Really???

    Link???

    Meanwhile back in the real universe

    https://time.com/5804899/u-s-coronavirus-needs-follow-s-korea/
     
  23. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Hmmmmmmm

    With so many on the right believing things like this I think I might be seeing an example of evolution in action
     
  24. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    Really!!!

    Sure. I thought it was well known why South Korea had almost instantaneous approval for private industry to begin testing for C-19.
    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wa...a-8a8e-5c5336b32760_story.html?outputType=amp

    Here is the applicable pull quote from above link.
    Here’s more.
    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...hundreds-of-thousands-to-fight-virus-outbreak

    In effect, South Korea relied exclusively on it’s CDC in 2015 and it was a disaster. This time they handed it over immediately to private (for profit) industry and everyone worldwide swoons.

    The real world is amazing, no? The universe is too vast for me to address here. :)
     
  25. rkhames

    rkhames Well-Known Member

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    Australia has closer ties with China then the US, your past leadership did not put the testing constraints on your medical testing programs as they did in the US and finally Australia did not outsource necessary medical supply to China.

    But you missed two points here. The things that have hampered getting out the test kits were not within the President's Control. The second is that the testing does not prevent the spread of the virus. That is done by taking preventive measures. The old adage is as true here as it has ever been. "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure." That was the point of my post.

    BTW, are they still planning to have the Soccer games in Melbourne and Sydney this weekend? How many new cases do you think will come out of those games?
     

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