FDA and CDC Could Soon Employ 'Indigenous Knowledge,' Documents Show

Discussion in 'Science' started by Lil Mike, Feb 18, 2024.

  1. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    51,635
    Likes Received:
    22,946
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Say goodbye to the scientific method.

    FDA and CDC Could Soon Employ 'Indigenous Knowledge,' Documents Show

    The Food and Drug Administration and Centers for Disease Control and Prevention could soon employ "Indigenous Knowledge" in their research, a document obtained by the Washington Free Beacon shows.

    The document is a proposed revision of scientific integrity guidelines for the Department of Health and Human Services, which encompasses the FDA, CDC, and the National Institutes of Health. Going forward, agency staff should employ "multiple forms of evidence, such as Indigenous Knowledge," when analyzing data, the document states.

    "Indigenous knowledge" posits that native peoples possess hidden wisdom about the workings of the universe and has been widely dismissed by experts as pseudoscience. The proposed guidelines point to other "non-traditional modes of science," including "citizen science, community-engaged research, participatory science, and crowdsourcing." Including these methods is part of the agency's "support" for "equity, justice, and trust," the document states.


    Well nothing spells science like support for equity, justice, and trust.
     
    GrayMan likes this.
  2. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2020
    Messages:
    28,120
    Likes Received:
    17,783
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Like Sinatra sang:

    Let me live 'neath your spell
    Do do that voodoo that you do so well
     
  3. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    51,635
    Likes Received:
    22,946
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I guess voodoo is science now.
     
  4. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2020
    Messages:
    28,120
    Likes Received:
    17,783
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    “A learned fool is more a fool than an ignorant fool.”
    ― Moliere
     
    Lil Mike likes this.
  5. Pants

    Pants Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2018
    Messages:
    12,901
    Likes Received:
    11,324
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    After the scientific community has undergone such bashing at the hands of conservatives I'm surprised that they are concerned for the future of science. That aside, I believe there can be much learned by partnering with a community with close bonds to the earth and nature. But all in all, I would recommend you look up this topic and read from other articles that talk more about their plans than one screaming about the evils of equality, justice and truth.
     
  6. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    51,635
    Likes Received:
    22,946
    Trophy Points:
    113

    "Equality, justice, and truth" don't have a place in a scientific debate. The fact that you think it does really shows to me that you are on the side of bashing science. I simply support evidence based research, not whatever superstitious gobbledygook this new initiative is supposed to fund.
     
  7. Pants

    Pants Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2018
    Messages:
    12,901
    Likes Received:
    11,324
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    Do you have a problem with this? What is the harm?
    While some experts have raised concerns about the validity and reliability of Indigenous Knowledge, proponents argue that it can provide valuable insights into the natural world and human health. By combining traditional wisdom with modern scientific methods, researchers may be able to develop a more holistic understanding of pressing health challenges.
    https://bnnbreaking.com/breaking-ne...ndigenous-knowledge-in-research-methodologies
     
  8. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    51,635
    Likes Received:
    22,946
    Trophy Points:
    113

    I don't have a problem with it, it's just not science.
     
    WillReadmore likes this.
  9. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    May 31, 2011
    Messages:
    13,891
    Likes Received:
    3,080
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Nice article, but it's not what the document says. I skimmed the actual document, which is 22 pages long, and the closest it comes to that is protections for minority scientists and a safe environment free from discrimination. Something that would be included in any government document on this side of the civil rights movement.

    The Scientific Integrity Policy of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services (hhs.gov)
    pg 19
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2024
  10. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2020
    Messages:
    28,120
    Likes Received:
    17,783
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    The harm is that it took centuries of struggle to rise above "traditional wisdom" nonsense to establish the scientific method and modern health care. This BS would put that at risk to signal virtue for political gain.
     
    WillReadmore likes this.
  11. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    51,635
    Likes Received:
    22,946
    Trophy Points:
    113

    It actually IS what the document says:

    "HHS also works to apply scientific integrity practices in ways that are inclusive of non-traditional modes of science, such as citizen science, community-engaged research, participatory science, and crowdsourcing. This may include expanded scientific integrity practices and expectations, such as granting communities more autonomy over research questions and research design, recognition of data and knowledge sovereignty, and inclusion of multiple forms of evidence, such as Indigenous Knowledge "

    That's straight from the document, so I'm unclear on why you are trying to pass of government boilerplate as the sole purpose of the document.
     
  12. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2013
    Messages:
    59,910
    Likes Received:
    16,453
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I think I get your point. Homeopathy is full of claims and ancient practices that have no scientific validity and should not be included in science based medicine.

    However:
    - science can examine what people are doing to find if there is any value in it. We've found medicinal value in substances used in areas remote from our science. But, those aren't to be considered valid until tested. I think aspirin came from the bark of certain trees that the ancients chewed on to reduce pain. That became part of our medicine through testing, determining proper dosing, etc.

    - once solutions are found, the distribution of those solutions is very much subject to equality, justice and truth. In America, there are millions who do not get the solutions that science has found. Many in America believe treatment should be based on the wealth of the patient!! How's that for equality and justice?
     
    Lil Mike likes this.
  13. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    51,635
    Likes Received:
    22,946
    Trophy Points:
    113

    I've no objections to "indigenous" treatments being examined. Some of them are based on hard won observation over time. Some of them but by no means all, which is why you need a scientific method examination of them.
     
  14. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2013
    Messages:
    59,910
    Likes Received:
    16,453
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Absolutely. Even when something is found to "work", dosage, efficacy, safety, drug interactions, side effects, etc., are all seriously important.
     
    Lil Mike likes this.
  15. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    May 31, 2011
    Messages:
    13,891
    Likes Received:
    3,080
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I stand corrected. :)
     
    Lil Mike likes this.

Share This Page