Florida Picked The Wrong Issue To Make A Big Stand Against Wokism!

Discussion in 'Education' started by JimfromPennsylvania, Jan 24, 2023.

  1. JimfromPennsylvania

    JimfromPennsylvania Active Member Past Donor

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    What the Florida state government is doing in preventing the AP program for African American Studies is not good for the country, it may be following the Stop Woke Act in Florida law but it is not good in combating the harm to America from the Woke movement - I hope other states don't follow Florida's lead! If the issue was about things like elementary school teachers teaching elementary school children to question their sexual identity that is their birth gender or that American is a racist society not that racism does exist in the country and it is wrong but things like white people are racists their values their behavior are racist even if no discriminatory actions can be identified of course that would be wrong and the state government would be doing its duty to protect children and stand up for the good by shutting it down. But the issue here is a high school Advanced Placement history or political science course on African American history/studies that teaches about woke subjects touching the African American community in America's history, this is exactly the type of discussions and perspectives we as a society want to have on these woke issues. Most woke issues aren't going to go away because half of the American people think they are illegitimate. They are going to go away because on their merits they deserve to go away. So as a society we to have responsible discussions about them. We need to clearly identify the issues and talk about them from a fairness and good public policy standpoint. We as a society need to approach these topics as learned individuals acting with good faith trying to determine the right thing to do; all behaviors that would be taught in good political science courses on the subjects. As a society America has largely always strived and should always strive to be a great society which in part means not to be afraid of ideas to separate the wheat ideas from the chaff ideas such endeavors move us forward as a country enabling us to giving effect to the wheat or good ideas. One topic that radiates this warranting of dismissal upon a responsible debate is this "reparations" topic, it really is a nutty idea if it is fully looked at and I believe as a society we should do things like give special help to Black schools and do affirmative action to make up for the harm of slavery but reparations - Not! A skilled comedian could make a hilarious show on this topic just breaking down the issue it presents so many wacky sub-issues. One that jumps out is why should descendants of slaves living today get reparations over such descendants living in later generations they seem to largely have the same case for damages; so if we decide to give every generation of descendants of slaves an economic damage award which the proponents seem to be seeking won't that incentivize the descendants not to work hard getting an education and pursuing career growth making the same wise choices that most achieving people of all races make in their life to sacrifice some good times short term to succeed in these valuable areas to achieve a good long term future because they know they are going to get a reparations pay day; wouldn't that be harming these descendants when the goal should be helping them!
     
  2. DEFinning

    DEFinning Well-Known Member Donor

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    I liked your OP, and agreed completely with your main argument, about the type of things that would be primary school propaganda, which should rightly be banned, versus legitimate history, which absolutely should not be, and which only harms our society, to do so. This would surely be included in DeSantis'/Florida's policy, preventing the discussion of any topics that might make white children "uncomfortable."

    You then move on to "Reparations" payments which, again, I'd felt the same way about: that checks to individuals, based on skin color, would not address any problems of racism; to the contrary, anyone familiar with human nature, should realize that this could only stoke resentment, the feeling that blacks were being given undeserved benefits, or apathy about the subject of racism: that is, if this was seen as renumeration, those who paid it, would want that to close the book on the subject, and would not be interested in hearing more complaints. Yet, all the discrimination would still continue, largely unaltered by Reparations checks. So my opinion was in sympathy with your own, that this needs to be addressed systemically. There are, as well, all kinds of "fairness" issues involved, with who would pay for, and who would receive, these checks to individuals, which would not apply, if we were using funds to address societal issues.

    All that said, from the way this subject is working its way into the mainstream, there may be a stronger push for Reparations checks, than I had originally assumed. One potential basis which may be advocated, occurred to me, when hearing President Biden speak about a highway project-- that had ripped apart a prosperous, black community, in the 1960s (not an uncommon event) and which has led today, along with government Redlining policies, to the value of the properties on one side of the highway, in the black neighborhood, being significantly lower than in the other side, which is now a white neighborhood-- would be property adjustment checks. That is, I could imagine this as a possible explanation used, for calculating an individual benefit. Of course, though, one would not expect that non property owning blacks would be left out of any sort of compensatory Reparations, so my example would only be a part of an overall package.

    Wrapping up with your OP, its ending argument, was the weakest part, as it was based on the illogical assumption, IMO, that every succeeding generation, would continue to receive checks. To my mind, this would have to be a one time deal, purportedly setting things right, which is why I think it would only dull the interest, overall, among white Americans, to put further effort and expense into combatting something which many would predictably feel, they had "already paid for." To my mind, the principle that these checks would undermine, is that the children are not supposed to be held responsible, in American society, for the sins of their parents. But that certainly does not mean, that these sins should be hidden away in some dark corner, and not learned about, by that posterity, in school.
     
  3. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It's only being banned from public high schools.

    An African American studies class doesn't even seem like something that should be taught in high school. I don't believe there even are any majority black high schools in Florida.

    I would have expected better from you, Jim. Surely you should have been able to see through the media's smokescreen.
    This totally should have been a non-issue, but some people want to turn it into a big issue.

    Maybe some people are just mad that now they can't use African American studies as a Trojan horse to teach controversial ideas (victimhood and racial identity politics) to high schoolers. No, they will have to wait until college for that.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2023
  4. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    With that sort of argument, maybe we should have a "white studies" class, and a class about the politics of illegal immigration.
    And why wait till college, right?

    I think high school students have to focus on the basics first, like English and math, judging by the abysmally low test scores in many schools. I would teach them a civics class and personal finance class before I would offer them an "African American studies" class.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2023

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