General Patton's quotes on Russia and the Russians

Yes I would have to agree with you there regarding the honesty of the photo posted - I did not mention the LAGG-3 because the couple of Russians I have talked to on war forums have a pretty low opinion of the plane. The YAK aircraft seem to hold a similar place in Russian hearts that the Spitfire does for the British.

 

Really rather irrelevant- the Soviets took a blood bath when Germany invaded- and lost most of their obsolete tanks.

What matters is what existed in 1945- Soviets had probably twice the number of tanks and assault guns as the U.S. in Europe- and generally the equipment was superior.

Again- pretty irrelevant- most of the Soviet losses were at the beginning of the war. What mattered was 1945.

While there are those who would argue that- I would agree that the P-51 was the best all around long distance fighter in WW2.

 

Wow them Germans were something special. They destroyed all 83,696 tanks the Russian had, then another 13,000 tanks that did not exist

 

I'm sorry. You are right. I should have said troianii. I sorry for calling you dishonest.

How many losses do you think America is going to have on the homefront when atomic bombs going off over Moscow unprovoked gives the Russians license to use every single biological weapon in their arsenal on America?

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The LaGG-3 was a crappy fighter but it would have done just fine on suicide ramming attacks on B-29's.

 

Yeah they would have some more bombs by years end. Such a war wouldn't be over in a year either.

 

The war might not be over, but when the Russians take all of Western Europe outside of England, there's not going to be much of a chance at winning. Dropping nukes after that point what just be acts of spite, and that's only if the Russians don't take all of the allied POWs they capture and use them as human shields in Russian cities. I can't see the British or American public supporting incinerating their own POWs just to "save" Poles and Czechs.

 

The fact you recognized you mistook Troijanni's post for mine and apologized, shows you are a person of character
I respect that.

I'm probably arguing from a too emotional aspect anyway. It's quite easy to sit here in 2014 and call out a war chant in 1945, when I was not involved with that conflict. This recent activity in Crimea not withstanding...I do not believe that either the former USSR or the United States wanted to ever directly go to war. Both recognized the industrial capacity of their respective regimes and realized there would be no clear "winner." One of the rationale of going to war is determining if it is even winnable and fighting the Soviets, now and then is unwinnable. Both in blood and treasure, the cost would be too high. America today, would probably roll over before getting involved in yet another protracted war. Putin isn't stupid. He puts his finger in the wind and reads the direction of public perception. He knows the U.S. is in the process of downsizing it's Armed Forces It is very difficult to chastise the Russians for placing boots on the ground on foreign soil to enact regime change on trumped up allegations, when the United States did precisely the same thing in Iraq. As bad as Saddam may have been, there were no weapons of mass destruction found in Iraq and the goal posts were gradually moved as to why we were there occupying a sovereign country enacting regime change with military force. Of course the difference between the Russians and the Americans is we can freely say this here in the States. We can vote incompetent leadership out of office...the Russians...well they are fed State sponsored media and stuck with the leader that can intimidate the citizenry the most.

So, discussing would have, should have, could have scenarios is somewhat moot. Patton was a brilliant General and a hard charger and recognized the USSR as a potential threat to the American way of doing things...he didn't trust them. Cooler heads prevailed and we never actually went to war other than peripheral conflicts with Communism in Korea and Vietnam. It's my opinion that if one lesson can be learned from Patton's 4 letter word expletive riddled and rather brutish approach to foreign policy..is to be wary...and prepared.

 

Patton is interesting, to have risen to the rank and be so poor at playing the political game is unusual. It took Ike, Bradley and the president to keep him on his leash. But once he had a mission he was like a pit bull that had not eaten for a week seeing a bone

 

Why on earth would we fall to the soviets who needed our aid to fight? They would have starved a few times if not for us.

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MacArthur wasn't much better. Generals like that are probably a thing of the past. Stormin Norman being the last one.

 

Hmm...., The Cold War never ended. It was postponed and the Russians regrouped under Putin. The Cold War has just resumed....

 

I tend to agree with you. Today top Generals like Dempsey Twerk for Obama....

 

There are many more in the military similar to George Patton. Obama is pushing them out and replacing them with others that will follow his commands.

 

The only reason Patton wasn't deported from Europe back to the States after Sicily was because of Eisenhower.

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Deal with reality. Any officer that doesn't follow the President's commands should be court-martialed for violation of at least three articles.

 

Way off topic...
quick comment.

I was deployed for 90 days delivering the daily Air Tasking Orders at the "Black Hole" in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia where the war planning took place for Operation Desert Shield/Storm...while he was an old school and highly effective General, determined to erase the stain of the Vietnam war on the U.S. Armed Forces; General Schwarzkopf was the tip of an iceberg, the public face of the conflict. In my humble opinion the logistical genius, one Lieutenant General William Gus Pagoni, doesn't get near enough credit for what he accomplished. If there was one flaw, he made war fighting look too easy...the public perception of war changed after that. American hubris was established, and an air of invincibility set in leading to a fated mindset that the U.S. could interject foreign policy doctrine through military force on an at will basis.

 

Logistics win wars.

That's why it's insane to try to go to war in Ukraine over Ukraine.

 

Those logistics guys are pretty amazing. The amount of work that goes into keeping a modern army supplied is amazing really.

US military superiority really is that far advanced. It is just the politicians who haven't improved much. No point fighting limited wars, no point fighting a regime change and then not installing a military dictator to make sure they follow the changes. Japan should have been our model for Iraq...

 

I don't think anyone is pushing for war. Steady as she goes at this point. Given the reconnaissance technology around today, we can precisely see troop movements and act quickly enough if things escalate.

Observe & Report

 

Better a cold war than an unnecessary 'hot' war.

 

There are more ex-Cavalry men in the military? I would hope Obama is pushing out any Generals who started off by riding horses in the cavalry.....

 

From your computer to God's E-mail address.

 

FDR transformed the most of the Calvary to the tank corps.

 

1945 is not 1941. They needed our aid in the days of Stalingrad, not so at the fall of Berlin.

 

your quotes sound a lot like Adolf Hitler, guess the Russians aren't Aryan enough for your liking

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_produced_aircraft

"Most produced biplane. Production may be as high as 33,000[4]"

The Polikarkov Biplane was the most produced biplane ever, 11th overall for all planes, probably actually in the top 5 (see note, if that actually matters to you). Also, you can try to make objective stuff personal if you want, but if you do, you should note that the plane you cited is actually Spanish. regardless, it's a pretty cruddy plane made on the cheap.

As far as the other ones, I never suggested that their whole air force was made up of biplanes. It may well have been half true in 1940, but it wasn't true in 1945. What was true, however, is that their air force was vastly inferior. That had far fewer airplanes (by some accounts, the United States had 2x the number of airplanes, and by 1944 it had about 4x the aircraft production), less able ground crews, less able and experienced pilots, and their airplanes were inferior. Showing that they had a couple half-decent planes means nothing. To be clear, 16000 was the TOTAL production of the Yak 9 - they didn't have 9,000 by 1945. That model was in production from 1942-1948. Better than Mustang? Doubt it. There's a big difference you're probably not noticing. The Yak 9 was nicknamed "The Russian Mustang" by the Germans, it was similar to the Mustang but was not as capable at high altitude, nor was it capable of long-range missions. The Mustang, with simple tank modification, could be made a shorter-range fighter and quicker, more agile, and beat out the Yak 9.

now, why post a Po2 Polikarpov? Simple. Next to the Il-2, which was the mainstay of the Russian air force (36,000 produced, and most produced Soviet plane of all time), the Po2 Polikarpov was the most produced Soviet aircraft - and the Soviets didn't stop making it until 52! When your most common aircraft is a generally weak Il-2 only useful for ground attack, and your second most produced aircraft is a biplane, and you don't even have half the aircraft that the Americans do, and you don't even have a quarter of the aircraft production that the Americans do, and your AA measures are a complete joke - you're not going to hold up against the Americans.

Polikarpov_Po-2
aircraft production

Don't assume dishonesty when it may well just be your own ignorance of a matter.

 

And this is mostly due to Stalin's 4-year plan. The man was as evil and as incarnate as Hitler himself. He had the Soviet officers gun down civilians, starve them into malnutrition and then worked their ass off. His successor in China, Mao Zedong did much the same thing to the tune of billions.

Communism, in its "purest form" betrays all of mankind.