Israel's president reminds Ukrainians of genocide they committed

zoom_copter66 · Oct 4, 2016

Silver Surfer said: ↑

This is interesting. I'm sort of surprised that he confronted them directly on their own turf. Well done Reuven Rivlin. It appears that many Ukrainians still cannot face the truth.

Israels President Confronts Ukrainians With Their Past

https://www.yahoo.com/news/israel-president-confronts-ukrainians-past-153150883.html

In contrast to the anonymity of the victims, Rivlin was clear in identifying the guilty. Noting that about 1.5 million Jews were killed in Ukraine during the Second World War, he was unflinching in confronting his hosts with the full scope of the truth: Many collaborators to the crimes were Ukrainians. And among them, the fighters of the OUN who mocked the Jews, killed them, and in many cases handed them over to the Germans particularly distinguished themselves. It was his specific mention of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists (OUN) that prompted some of his listeners to later denounce Rivlin. Formed in 1929, the OUN was a nationalist group that sought to establish an independent Ukrainian state and often employed violence against its enemies, including Poles and supporters of the Soviet regime.

The role of the OUN in the Ukrainian national consciousness has increased as Ukraine has asserted its identity in the face of Russian aggression. The group is an integral part of the countrys history of struggle for independence from the Soviet Union, and is particularly resonant today as the Kremlin continues to delegitimize the Ukrainian state and assert its supremacy over its neighbor. This year, the Kiev city government voted to rename a major street after Stepan Bandera, the groups leader. Thats why, though Ukrainian-Jewish relations have noticeably improved since the collapse of the Soviet Union (Volodymyr Hroysman became the countrys first Jewish Prime Minister in April), Rivlins speech hit such a raw nerve.

Bogdan Chervak, current leader of the OUN which still exists as a political interest group reacted sharply. What the President of the State of Israel did in Parliament today can be unambiguously interpreted as a spit in the soul of Ukrainians, he wrote on Facebook. To accuse the OUN of [taking part in] the Holocaust, and during parliamentary hearings for the 75th anniversary of Babi Yar, no less, is to disrespect the Ukrainian nation.

While it is undoubtedly false to say that every member of the OUN committed crimes against Jews during the Holocaust, it is simply untrue to claim they played no role at all. Involvement of certain units of the group in the murder of Jews is well documented, including units loyal to Bandera. In Ukraines struggle against Soviet colonialism, some nationalist rebels saw aligning with the Nazis as a matter of survival. Yet that choice often entailed participation in Nazi atrocities...
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Oh yes..let's not forget the Jewish NKVD led by Beria and Dzerzhinsky etc, who roamed the countryside during the holodomor killing off anyone who had anymore than a cupful of grain or half a loaf of bread! This articles is a little rich in its accusations, there were a lot of Russians who cozied up to the Nazis..vlasov bunch ring a bell anyone..strange how any Kremlin trolls here never mention that..or how many dirty deals the cccp made with Adolf before he turned around and knifed in the Soviets in the back..I can go on but the Kremlin trolls here will just try to whitewash anything that's contrary to their philosophy, they must enjoy being "useful idiots"!

zoom_copter66 · Oct 4, 2016

I'll be brutally honest here..the Russians need a taste of their own medicine..they were always marvelous at killing defenseless people..I have little heart for these people!

zoom_copter66 · Oct 4, 2016

PARTIZAN1 said: ↑

In every lie , every exaggeration there is that element of truth that in obscured with a lie or obstructed by a half lie.

I know the history of the OUN very well since my dad was a member of the OUN -B faction from hus later teens until he was " arrested" by the Germans and sent to a concentration camp then sent to a firced labor camp.

I know that there were individuals Ukrainians who had cooperated and in a few cases participated in the German genocide. What I also know us that the OUN didvnot partipicipate as an organization in genocide.

My dad said that one major political failure of Stefan Bandera who headed up the OUN -B was that he did not condemn the German genocide of the Jews in any strong official way.

BTW I noted that Bandera headed up the OUN -B faction of the OUN because that was the major largest faction. There was the OUN-M faction M standing for Melnyk which was the tiny faction and I will not defend them.

Now let,s talk more about truth. The NKVD which was Soviet Russia of the Gestopo and Nazi SS. The quirks of history led to the NKVD to be populated by Bolsheviks and by the late 1930's the sons of old Bolsheviks. The quirk of history led to having thecBolsheviks to have a higher percentage of Jewish members than their population.

Stalin used the NKVD as the shock troops to go into Eastern and Central Ukraine, remove foodstuffs by confiscation and that is what caused 6to 8 million Ukrainians to be killed by famine by Stalin and the NKVD.

THE NKVD was populated by a higher percentage of Jews than their population of Soviet Russia. This was as a result of the Bolsheviks being the cadre' of the NKVD. AsI I noted since Jews populated the Bolsheviks in higher than their population percent and Bolsheviks were the main population of the NKVD the quirk of history caused there to be a higher than normal population of Jews in the NKVD.

This fact was not lost on Ukrainians.

Result?

There were Ukrainians acting as individuals who did help the Germans in the genocide. Why? My guess is revenge fir the Great Famine

Is this justification ?

NO NO WAY , What it is , is an explanation.

In 1939 the Soviets invade Western Ukraine which between 1921 and 1939 was occupied by Poland.

Stalin sent in the NKVD to round up Ukrainian priests, businessmen, educators, military officers, Catholic nuns and the NKVD executed them and sent those not executed to Siberia. My grandfather , dad,s dad was among those.

Again there were Ukrainians who knew about the NKVD population and did blame Jews fir cooperating with the Russians.

Ironic isn,t it that the Israeli president points at Ukrainians for cooperation with the Germans but Ibask you Mr. president how about the cooperation that some Jews gave to the Russians in that genocide?
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I found it ironic from the late shimon Peres.. I remember reading it a couple of years ago where he was in Ukraine wioth then President yanukovich indicating that Ukranians should really "FORGET" about their past?? Really..just forget? How simple..perhaps the same question should be put to the Jews also..they should FORGET also..ahhh..but we're talking about a different group here are we???

MrFirst · Oct 5, 2016

One more piece from Vladimir Kornilov.

The Ukrainian newspaper Volyn, editor in chief - Ulas Samchuk, in the nowadays Ukraine - classical writer whose "literature" studied in schools.

October 5, 1941.

Samchuk writes: "September 29 was a great day for Kiev. The German authorities, meeting the ardent expections of Ukrainians, ordered all Jews, who are about 150.000 left, to leave the city. Every hour brings better and better life in the city. Being free from the eastern barbarians Kiev starts to breath a full breast, it starts to live new life."

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notme · Oct 8, 2016

Jeannette said: ↑

Yes but the Ukrainians today are continuing the ethnic cleansing and genocides in the Donbas, except this time it's against the Russians and not the Poles and Jews. Since you mentioned Jesus then wouldn't they also kill Jesus since He said whatever you do to another man you are doing to me?
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The Israeli Jews are committing ethnic cleansing and genocide against Palestinians.
It has been part of their policy since the start.

notme · Oct 8, 2016

DrewBedson said: ↑

Reason why is because the crowd that gathered in front of Pilate early that morning before the people attending the Passover holyday were up and about were not your average Jews rather the Pharisees
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yawn

Hence, the only 'Jews' who could be blamed were only the top priests and criminals.
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Nope. It still was the Jews who did it. Let's not rewrite history because you dislike it.

DrewBedson · Oct 10, 2016

notme said: ↑

yawn

Nope. It still was the Jews who did it. Let's not rewrite history because you dislike it.
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Yes, it was the criminals and established priests not the people themselves. I change nothing rather show you the facts using the same source you use.

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