Nationalize Oil Companies?

So, oil drilling is back in the headlines. I hear chants of "drill baby, drill" and arguments of "screw renewable energy, we need to be energy independent, you Commie!!!"

The fact is, even if we open the entire nation up to drilling, it WON'T be OUR oil, it will be the oil companies to do what they like with. They will export to the global market and try to make even more money than they already have (INCLUDING tax payer subsidies by the way).

The only way to ensure OUR oil STAYS ours, is to nationalize the oil companies into one called "US OIL" or something similar. We can either open our national land to private companies to drain us and profit themselves, or we can nationalize and keep 100% of what we extract making it cheaper for our citizens. We can't have it both ways.

What do you think?

 

I think its a terrible idea.. Don't you remember when Libya nationalized their oil in 1970.. and look at Venezuela.

 

Legitimate points. I am not invested in fossil fuels, but wanted to post because people seem to think we get what Exxon takes out of the ground, false.

 

go to google images and google Who owns big oil...........

 

Our new SOS is one of them

 

Of course. Let the government do for oil what they've done for veterans healthcare, education, and crime.

 

Did you read the OP? Probably not.

 

This is a deflection of the issue I raised. The oil these companies take out of our land is NOT American oil, it belongs to these multinational corporations. I could care less about shareholders or investors, those people get a piece of the profits, not the product itself. That was my point.

 

Nationalize everything and make the rich people pay for it. Makes as much sense as anything Trump has come up with so far.

 

You own any land with oil leases? You could always extract it yourself.

 

No, and if I did I'd build a windfarm on it and rake in the money as Denmark is doing.

You let corporations drill for oil, only shareholders profit, NOT the average American gas consumer. Get what I am saying?

 

The government has no claim whatsoever if it is on private land. The OP's claim makes as much sense in terms of privately owned land as claiming the government should take over every private farm and ranch because the crops and livestock all come for USA land.

As for government land, the oil companies pay royalty to the government - billions and billions in royalty to the government. And the government has to expend no labor to have it since it all is coming from land the government gave to itself, mostly for free.

The OPer also seems to assert that there is American profit from oil drilling in the USA. In fact, there is an entire structure of employment that stems from it - all that money going to the employees and then spent throughout the American economy - with the government taking cut after cut after cut in almost uncountable different taxes and fees.

Finally, there is the gamble of oil and gas exploration. If the gamble fails, the government lost nothing. The company/driller/investors lose everything.

There is no more rational in the government nationalizing "the oil industry" than the government nationalizing anything else.

 

I see you read my OP, but have gotten lost in what you THINK I am saying. I will put it very, very simply.

Conservatives believe if we allow drilling on ANY land, public or private, that this will somehow create cheaper prices for AMERICAN consumers. This is false. The reason why it's false, is that the oil companies OWN the oil, WE AS A NATION do not.

"Drill baby drill, energy independence and AMERICA first!"

"No....oil companies first, you much later, if at all. Depends on global markets"

See what I am trying to say here?

 

That is nonsense too. First, windfarms in the USA are not profitable.

Second, all gas that goes on the market reduced the cost of gas.

Third, in fact oil refined in the USA does end up in the USA. Based upon the economics of delivery, some is sold to others.

Fifth, most oil is shipped in refined form, for which all the jobs, taxes and profits of refining are American if from an American refinery. Much imported oil, however, is crude, for which the USA refineries rake in the refining jobs, profits and taxes, and then ship back out the now refined oil products.

Simply put, the OP is shallow, naive, lack of even obvious understanding of the oil industry and foolish. The comment about building a windfarm instead of drilling for oil shows how much foolishness blind loyalty to ideological slogans can be. Not only are windfarms even viable in limited locations, NONE are profitable and in many areas are banned.

Windfarms may work in HIS country economically because in most of the EU the governments have MASSIVE taxation against gasoline, oil and natural gas - plus his country does not have it to barter with - for which the price people are paying more goes to the government in taxes than for the gasoline.

In simplest terms, the OPer messages are not based in REALITY, just socialist sloganism and nonsensical ideology as if a religious belief set.

 

Problem is not all oil companies doing business or drilling for oil in America are American owned companies. Shell is a Dutch company, BP is British.

 

You're right, another barrier to actually being energy independent. IF you want to even drill for dirty nasty oil, make sure it's going to go to Americans and not the global marketplace.

 

I think you're completely ignorant of the federal governments historical track-record of picking winners and losers in business.

 

The oil is owned by whoever owns the land.

By the same logic, all Florida orange groves should be nationalized because some of the orange juice will sold to other countries and some of the groves are foreign owned.

IF a foreign country is drilling on federal land they have to pay the government both a lease (even if no oil found) and a royalty on the oil if it is found.

It seems this push to outlaw selling oil to other countries - then we should outlaw selling anything to other countries too. Swell idea, huh?

No, no foreign company is stealing our oil. They are buying it either from the land mineral rights owner or buying it from the federal government if federal land or offshore. If on state land they are buying it from the state. That's what a "royalty" is. Paying for the oil, having to do nothing for the royalty.

If YOU had land with oil under it, you would LOSE money if YOU tried to do all to get it out of the ground and transported, even if you could put it all together. BUT if you sold the oil for your royalty fee, you'd get RICH out of it. The MONEY is usually in the royalty more than anywhere else - and that is 100% risk free.

Again, the federal government takes in BILLIONS of dollars a year from oil royalty largely off otherwise worthless land. Some states like Texas take in huge sums of money from royalty since Texas (government) kept it's land as part of the deal of joining the USA. Private individuals (Americans) make billions off their royalties due to having mineral rights to their land with oil under it.

The Dutch are stealing our oil! is incredibly naive, though it sounds good.

 

The ONLY reason the USA imports oil is because often it is cheaper to buy foreign high grade oil than obtain and transported low grade American oil. Not all oil is the same and it isn't free to get out of the ground. The reason Saudi oil is so sought out is 1.) it is extremely good quality and 2.) its cheaper. Saudis got rich by selling oil CHEAP. Good short term plan, real bad plan long term.

 

IF we can buy imported oil cheaper than we can domestically drill, transport and refine it, the result is adopting a "drain America first" - making consumers pay MORE to deplete our own oil. Only an true idiot, meaning someone who doesn't have a clue how this works, would advocate that.

Being "energy independent" does NOT mean only using American oil. That is the dumbheaded view. It means we have the ready-to-use oil in reserve in case prices spike or there is an oil embargo. Being capable of providing all our own oil we need keeps imported oil cheap.

 

so if you dig a hole in your back yard to plant flowers and you dig up a 1 pound gold nugget it isn't yours and you aren't allowed to do what you want with it?

 

Do you understand the concept of private property in America.. You don't own any oil. The oil companies will pay YOU if they extract oil from under your property and they will pay their shareholders, but not every Tom, Dick and Moocher.

 

What's his is his, what's yours is his too. See how that works?

 

Why did Trump say we are going to get America energy independent? That's his excuse as to why we need to drill, right?

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Of course you can keep the gold nugget, but that's not what conservative politicians tell people.