NATO Expansion: What Yeltsin Heard

Discussion in 'Warfare / Military' started by Horhey, May 9, 2019.

  1. Horhey

    Horhey Well-Known Member

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    The genesis of the New Cold War was February 9, 1990. That day in Moscow, Secretary of State James Baker assured Russian President Mikhail Gorbachev that "if the United States keeps its presence in Germany within the framework of NATO, not an inch of NATO’s present military jurisdiction will spread in an eastern direction.” That was lie.

    You'll never hear about this in the commercial media:
    When Washington Assured Russia NATO Would Not Expand
    The American Conservative
    December 20, 2017

    The US ‘Betrayed’ Russia, but It Is Not ‘News That’s Fit to Print’
    The Nation
    January 10, 2018
     
  2. Mushroom

    Mushroom Well-Known Member

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    No, it was not.

    You are missing that what then happened was that tue Soviet Union collapsed, and with it the Warsaw Pact.

    The agreement did hold, and NATO never tried to expand into Warsaw Pact territory. However, once the Pact dissolved in 1991 that was no longer an issue. Almost none of the former members of the Warsaw Pact were interested in entering another alliance with Russia.

    In fact, of the 9 nations that formed the original Collective Security Treaty Organization (CSTO - 1994), 3 of them would later leave the organization (Azerbaijan, Georgia, Uzbekistan) in 1999. In fact, Uzbekistan has left the CSTO 2 times now. They rejoined in 2006, only to leave a second time in 2012 over what it saw as growing Russian expansionism.

    Your claims fail, because any of the former members of the Warsaw Pact could have joined CSTO. It took until 1999 for even the first 3 former Warsaw members to join NATO. In fact, all of the newly joined nations were also members of the second post-Soviet organization, the Partnership for Peace. An organization that encompassed all former WP members, including Russia.

    An organization that was founded by and created by NATO itself. It was an initiative actually proposed by the United States at the 1994 NATO summit, which was enthusiastically endorsed by Russia. This gave the former Warsaw Pact members an organization they could join in the hopes of bringing stability without having to either join NATO, nor tie itself so tightly to Russian dominance.
     
  3. Horhey

    Horhey Well-Known Member

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  4. Mushroom

    Mushroom Well-Known Member

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    That is known as an "Opinion Piece".

    You know, OPINION. Some people have the opinion that the world is flat, that does not mean it is true.
     
  5. Horhey

    Horhey Well-Known Member

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    That's from the Foreign Policy section from "an American scholar and professor emeritus of Russian studies at Princeton University and New York University."

    More from the main establishment journal, Foreign Affairs.
    I always have to argue the basics with you. Always the elementary stuff.
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2019
  6. Mushroom

    Mushroom Well-Known Member

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    Because you come at everything from a biased and often simplistic viewpoint, ignoring anything that does not follow your beliefs.

    If this had been a serious issue, it would have been drafted into a treaty. But it was not, does it? It was only an agreement.

    An agreement that died with the USSR and the Warsaw Pact. It was not so much that "NATO moved East", it is more of a case of former Warsaw Pact members wanting nothing to do with falling in line again with Russia and repeating 50 years of history all over again.
     
  7. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    It wasn't NATO moving east. It was the former Warsaw Pact nations moving west.

    At any rate, NATO has always been a collective alliance. Whatever decision it makes requires agreement by ALL members.

    thus no matter what the Russians thought they heard, the bottom line is that the U.S. had no authority to speak for all of NATO
     

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