Physicists measure complementary properties using quantum clones

Discussion in 'Science' started by wgabrie, Aug 16, 2017.

  1. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    Physicists measure complementary properties using quantum clones
    https://phys.org/news/2017-08-physicists-complementary-properties-quantum-clones.html
    Ever since I learned that there's a quantum no-cloning theorem I was disappointed because that automatically limits things that can be done on a quantum scale, including what I want to do that is break an entangled connection from a super position quantum source to an observer that collapses a wave function.

    But now they've found a way around the no-cloning theorem so that they can measure complementary states at the same time, something they couldn't do before. Yippy!!! :w00t:

    Okay I know this probably doesn't mean anything to you, at least right now, but this is a big step in quantum physics.
     
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  2. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    Now all they need to do is get around the quantum no-deleting theorem and I can finally take a picture of a quantum object without collapsing its wave function/superposition.

    My idea, first you take a picture and copy it, which creates a link between a source and an observer across space-time.
    QuantumDeletion1.png
    Okay you have two photos between the source and the observer.
    QuantumDeletion2.png
    Then you delete one step in the connection from source to observer, in other words deleting one of the photos, breaking the connection before viewing the remaining photo.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2017
  3. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    True... .I have zero idea what the mathematics of this implies but........
    philosophically the implications are huge.

    Would G-d...... duplicate / clone / replicate.... certain fallen angels in multiple time lines.......
    especially if that fallen angel.... was destined to repent........
    and return to love / light / truth.....???????

    Azazel is the name of a fallen angel.... a son of G-d.... who I believe has great, great, great grandsons and grand daughters .......
    in the form of somewhat predatory aliens..........

    i could be incorrect about this.. .but that is the impression I got from The Book of Enoch......
     
  4. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    Taking a photo is making an observation.
     
  5. Grumblenuts

    Grumblenuts Well-Known Member

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    I see tons of circular argument, wishful thinking, and self-prophesy fulfillment going on, looking over a lot of the thinking currently driving quantum mechanics, much the same as always. Seems to me that if experiments were simply designed with rigorous attention paid to scientific method to begin with we'd be a lot further along in our understanding of what's actually going on. For example, assume taking pictures changes the result, but presume it does so consistently when repeated. Test for that. If true, try to process the pixels after the fact to correct for the interference. See if others can repeat (confirm) your results. Then, and if and only then, try variations on the theme to see what else might work. No point waiting to set up random number generators on the Moon. That's just silly and suggests only endless rationalization for continued government funding.

    Point being, quantum mechanics is simply theoretical mathematics, constantly, desperately, trying to explain things we observe in reality. Therefore, it absolutely is not genuine physics. Physics is defined as a science. Experimentation drives science, not simply theory. If you can't experimentally prove your quantum mechanical presumptions, decade after decade, it's high time to presume the model highly flawed and inadequate, then seriously look at alternatives that may explain what we observe much better.
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2017
  6. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    I know, but taking the photo isn't the observation looking at the photograph IS, and, for those who know, there's a link between a source and an observer. A source photo can be taken in the past and an observer can look at the photo in the future, but the very moment the observation takes place it collapses the wave function of the source, my thinking is that that there's a link between them. So my first thought is that if it were possible to destroy that link the source wouldn't collapse.

    So you could preserve the source while still taking a look at it. But first there needs to be a way to copy the source into a 2 intermediate positions and then delete position 1 so that the line is cut.

    Well I suppose you could call the cut: destruction of a quantum state, or maybe DE/DIS-entanglement. Well, I'll let the physics people figure this out. They already came up with the solution to one problem stopping my idea, by solving the no-cloning theorem.
     
  7. Grumblenuts

    Grumblenuts Well-Known Member

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    Oh. I see. It's an "an" vs "the" thing. My mistake. I was blissfully unaware how much of a religious cult quantum mechanics remains. Sad.
     
  8. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    A quantum computer is a quantum machine, and it must be constructed robotically because no one can view its construction, or its internal components, or it doesn't work.

    Video of the construction of quantum computer can be taken, and the quantum computers only stop working the moment the video is viewed, not before. And if it's never viewed the quantum computer continues to work despite having a video taken of it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2017
  9. Grumblenuts

    Grumblenuts Well-Known Member

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    And, of course, you can't be arsed to supply a link or quote of anyone backing up that nonsense or the video self-destructs, like in Mission Impossible.
     
  10. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    I was basing it on information passed on to me from a friend in another topic:
     
  11. Grumblenuts

    Grumblenuts Well-Known Member

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    Fair enough. So we now have a sensational anecdote from a single source with introductory theory anyone could easily locate in Wikipedia. Do you suppose anyone's major investment may be at stake here?
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2017
  12. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    It's major investment in genius.

    AboveAlpha has a multiverse theory and I do hope he publishes it. Integrating a multiverse theory into the mix is one of the major issues of our time.

    Another important investment is getting quantum mechanics accepted into more fields of study. So far a quantum understanding among the sciences has been sorely absent. At least that's my perspective having taken introductory science courses in college.
     
  13. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I suspect the axiom which quantum physicists take for granted, that superposition always collapses after being observed, isn't entirely true, not on a fundamental level. It just so happens that it's extremely difficult to observe the subatomic scale without excessive entanglement that's detrimental to this kind of experiment.

    If I can use an analogy here, it would be like if you tried to fake your own death to throw someone off your tracks who was trying to kill you, and then you wanted to find out whether your enemy knows you are still alive. You can't very well just go up and ask him because then he will know.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2017
  14. Grumblenuts

    Grumblenuts Well-Known Member

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    Alt-Death entanglement, lol. Yeah, I've never had much a problem with entanglement theory previously. And nothing personally against AboveAlpha for choosing to believe a friend, but this story just strikes me as self-serving/fulfilling fabrication. More than a bit too convenient given the circumstances. I also don't buy suggestions that the field of quantum mechanics has suffered general neglect or lack of acceptance. Where's the competition?
     
  15. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    In the dust bin of history. The two big theories are Quantum Mechanics and General Relativity. And we've spent the last ~100 years showing that they work. There's not much new stuff except the multiverse.
     
  16. Pycckia

    Pycckia Well-Known Member

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    Not until you look at it.
     
  17. Grumblenuts

    Grumblenuts Well-Known Member

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    Not even then, other than observing a photo. But taking a photo definitely creates an entanglement.
    Both "work" mathematically, yet neither explain a lot of things satisfactorily which is why they continue to enjoy limited application. Much about physics remains fundamentally wrong. I hope we get it straight sooner rather than never.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2017

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