Poverty in America is Self-Inflicted

A continuation of a previous thread:
If you ask any politician pandering for their vote, the poor are the oppressed masses just struggling to survive as the evil rich corporations keep them under their economic thumbs. But let's examine the real reasons for poverty:

1. Drug and Alcohol abuse. They can't afford a pair of shoes for their children, but boy do they keep the booze flowing. Cigarettes, even a little Mary Jane? No problem! Because so much of their life is subsidized through welfare, food stamps, etc, they have the disposable income for these vices.

2. Abuse of credit Credit cards, payday advance loans, rent to own, these are all hallmarks of the spending habits of many "poor" people who just...had to have that flat screen TV. And cable. And cell phones. And a fancy car stereo.

3. Improper Priorities Every parent claims to love their children, but how many actually give up smoking and put that money into a college savings account? How many struggle to stay in a less than perfect marriage so as to provide an intact family for their child?

Take a $25k/yr salary and give it to irresponsible people and they will squander it away on drugs, booze, and cigarettes and live in squalor while shaking their fists at the "rich" who are clearly responsible for their lifestyle.

Take that same $25k/yr salary and give it to responsible parents and they will live frugally. Their home will be furnished modestly, their kids will always have clothes in good repair, they will have food, they tithe to their church and they will even have savings put away. If they qualify for food stamps, they will realize that the extra $400 can be put toward a college fund, or help pay off their mortgage faster.

Two families, same income, vastly different lifestyles. I am also a poor person who makes do with a small amount of income. Though my income is only $40k, I support my family well, I put away savings, I use credit responsibly, and I have no vices that cut into my family's prosperity. We are poor but we are not in poverty. My 8 year old even gets the latest XBox games for Christmas....paid for in cash. I ask nobody for a handout, I stay off of public assistance of any kind, I work hard and make do.

If I can do that, why can't others? Why are we subsidizing irresponsibility?

 

Of course, poverty is self-inflicted. The high-ons in high school were the losers of the future. No one made them underachieve in high school. The illegitimacy rates in the ghettos are not from rapes. Hungry kids with parents who are still smoking and drinking could have used the beer money for food. And, on it goes.

 

And that's the thing that angers me the most, when children suffer because of their parents fcked up priorities.

 

Dude, you are aware that it's not that simple? A lot of what you're saying is simple sterotypes. A lot of problems, don't deal with anything you said.

 

Great! Then I have a proposal. Let's taylor our public assistance program to eliminate eligibility for those who exhibit these traits. Anyone taking out payday loans and credit card applications, denied. Anyone arrested for drug or alcohol related offenses, denied. Smokers? Denied. When children have badly worn shoes and clothing...denied. Though I doubt the Left will go for any of these proposals. Despite the outcry to the contrary, you all really do love funding irresponsibility.

 

Of course it's irresponsible, it's sterotyping the poor. These things, are highlighted, and don't represent the whole.

 

But I'm not talking about stereotypes. I'm talking about targeting specific behaviors so that welfare money doesn't fund irresponsibility. Disqualification wouldn't be triggered until they actually did one of these things, so there's no stereotype involved. But as I said, I don't expect you to go for it because you have no problem forcing some people to pay for the irresponsible habits of others. You're a statist, and that's how you people roll.

 

Because you cannot force people to be responsible?

Not that I don't think we shouldn't try, just that it may or may not work out very well.

 

And those poor that don't abuse drugs, alcohol (other substances and include gambling), have any form of credit etc. What pigeon hole do you put these into?

 

Yes you are. Almost all of your proposals, were sterotypes. To say that we need to make these reforms, is to insult the people on welfare.

Is this going to turn into one of your typical arguments, where instead of making an argument, you just insult people? If so, please say so, because I have no intention of wasting time talking to someone who can only insult.

 

Soon to be rich or well off.

 

Without opportunites and education?

 

Who is being denied opportunities and education? Anyone who gets good grades in school can qualify for a scholarship. What, do you want them to have the good life without having to work their ass off for it?

 

Believe it or not, having that good teacher who knows what they're talking about can make all the difference in the world.

 

That's true. And with 6 different teachers per day in each grade from 6th to 12th one of them is bound to be a wonder. I've found a few who took more than a passing interest in my success. One of them I'm still friends with today, a lesbian if you can believe that!

 

Yeah, most teachers in those poor areas aren't the best, nor have that good grasp that is needed to get the material.

 

Pretty simplistic I've always been poor sometimes better off over others and I don't do illegal drugs, drink, live on cash in a budget, worked hard in school but since I'm disabled with cerebral palsy, it caused some mental issues (I cannot handle multitasking or "think on my feet") and hit working age after High School right when the ADA hit - I never got a break. I never took government help but do count on family support, always had to work for myself (always cash earning work) for me that was generally Busking (street performing), crafting jewelry (folk sorts of things) and tarot card reading I never did earn a lot of money. My best income was usually at the poverty line usually lower.

But I never gave up and usually worked as much as I could, what frills I enjoy I save for and most of my money goes to things I need. But since I'm on paper unemployed for decades, have no credit rating at all (cash not credit lifestyle remember) and am disabled I don't have many options anymore but to do what I can do. I refuse to apply for SSI or other benefits as long as I have family support and a means to make money even if not living well being single the way I live what I can earn is enough to get by.

 

How about we help people fix the above problems, instead of just leaving them to rot because they may not be as smart as us?

 

Good idea, statist. Let's start by disincentivizing those behaviors.

 

Poverty is often somewhat self-inflicted, but if you really want to reduce the proportion of society that falls into the underclass, you have to observe family situations case-by-case.

One of the more common causes of poverty that is less self-inflicted is bad health. You can lead a healthy lifestyle and still get cancer, for example.

Bankruptcy from medical expenses is a pretty common thing in America, primarily because we pay so much more for care than most of our peers.

 

And incentivizing the opposite.

For the first one, i stead of destroying their lives by throwing them in jail, sentence them to mandatory rehab.

 

Isn't building up a credit score part of "the way"? How are they ever supposed to buy a house? I guess throwing money away on rent forever is the way to succeed.

Hmm, doctors say alcoholism is a disease. But I guess you know better, or think people with diseases should suffer, and their kids, too.

How you gonna prove that? Pay someone to spy on them everytime they go to the store?

Now we get right down to it. Poor? Can't afford clothes? Denied.

 

Right. All you are doing is proving my point that the Leftists excuse and accomodate irresponsibility. It's never their fault, is it? They're just a victim. I say bull(*)(*)(*)(*).

 

When your argument is based upon sterotypes, and you just say screw you to your opponents argument, perhaps it's not their argument that's the problem. Perhaps you should look at yours. Ignoring the poor, saying it's all their fault, is not the repsonsible way to get something done. Most people who are poor, have jobs. It's the fact that they need childcare during the day, or they need a higher paying job that's the problem. Lack of education, is another.

 

Not sure you want to go as far as fifthofnovember. He wasn't talking about stereotypes, he was talking about when the actual behavior occurs and then excusing that behavior. I think you're trying to use the word stereotype to shield yourself against the reality that the factors I listed are the highest contributors to the perpetuation of poverty in America. Those things really are what poor people do, with only a few exceptions. The only one ignoring the problem is you. Yes, you. And until we stop paying for irresponsible behavior, it will continue as a prevailing trend.