Raising the minimum wage is good for the economy.

You rant this ridiculous garbage about how raising the minimum wage is good for the economy and we are the stupid ones? Your raising the minimum wage just cost 2500 people their jobs and you think you're a genius. You are a fool but being a liberal kinda comes with the territory.

 

You said " the biggest users of government food supplement programs in this country are Wall-mart workers."

I asked if you are SURE of the accuracy in that statement. Are you claiming that there are more people on food stamps that work for Wal Mart than there are unemployed people on food stamps?

 

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/se...rkers-study-finds-2017-06-26?siteid=rss&rss=1

"After Seattle jacked up the minimum wage by a combined 37% over nine months, restaurants cut the average number of hours each employee worked by 9.4%. The loss in hours easily negated the benefits of higher wages, reducing the average low-wage restaurant worker’s paycheck by 6.6% a month. That works out to as much as $125 in lost income."

 

Good God do you think that you can't make the same amount of profit when your competing apples for apples with all your competitors, that are also paying the increased wage. You people are led around a by a ring in your nose. All this does is force the distribution of wealth to the top , Now I understand that's the only reason the Republicants exist for but It's stupid and not good for this country/ "In a new report, researchers from the University of Washington presented data that showed “little or no evidence” of price increases in most sectors. Before the minimum wage law took effect, most retailers said they would have to charge more–and most low-wage workers were worried that they would have to spend more for necessities. So far, that hasn’t happened." Sorry buddy you got checked on this one.

 

Thats stupid, of course i'm talking about corporations not unemployed, one has nothing to do with the other. Your mindless idea that jobs are lost when there is a across the board increase is ridiculous. Your competing against companies that also have to pay the increased minimum wage.

 

YOU are the one that said "the biggest users of government food supplement programs in this country are Wall-mart workers" , not ME. You are correct, that statement IS stupid, but the finger of blame is aimed directly at YOU.

I never said that "jobs are lost when there is an across the board increase". You are TRULY a hot mess. Since you brought up the subject however, it seems that the city of Seattle disagrees with you.

 

Not this again! I had to school Kode on this this weekend and now I have to do it for you also?

The first sentence in Chapter I of the Commuinst Manifesto says; "The history of all hitherto existing society(2) is the history of class struggles."

For those that can't read that describes CLASS WARFARE!

From Chapter II of the CM: "In this sense, the theory of the Communists may be summed up in the single sentence: Abolition of private property."

For those that can't read that describes REDISTRIBUTION OF WEALTH.

From Chapter II of the CM: "5. Centralisation of credit in the hands of the state, by means of a national bank with State capital and an exclusive monopoly. "

The entity that controls credit and capital also controls the economy. For those that can't read that describes CENTRAL PLANNING OF THE ECONOMY.

I don't need any encyclopedia. I have a copy of Marx's and Engels' Communist Manifesto. The working bible of Marxists.

Refute these if you can!

If you can't then just shut up. Stop hurling ad hominems at me as an attempt to discredit me.

 

You need to go look up what the term "demand elasticity" means.

If the price goes up for everyone because of wage controls that does *NOT* mean everyone will still get the same profit! When prices go up consumers buy LESS. Lower sales mean lower profits. Lower profits means workers suffer. Some get laid off. Some have their hours cut.

If you had ever run a small business you would know that business owners carefully study price versus demand relationships in order to maximize profits. When prices go up this *does* impact profits by impacting demand.

I'll say it again. You seem to have learned your economics from Donald Duck comic books featuring Scrooge McDuck. You would benefit from buying an Econ 101 textbook and studying it.

 

I did answer it. Some of us have a life and life intrudes. I'm not on here 24/7!

 

Seattle hasn't increased prices to compensate for the increased minimum wage, so your right it didn't heart Seattle to this point.

Tell me since I'm talking about government subsidies for corporation why should I consider the unemployed. Wall Mart workers are the biggest recipient of GOV support of all corporations in this country.

 

According to the study just commissioned by Seattle, it has UNQUESTIONABLY hurt the low wage workers in Seattle.
http://money.cnn.com/2017/06/26/news/seattle-minimum-wage-15/index.html

If you were referring to government subsidies for corporations, then saying "the biggest users of government food supplement programs in this country are Wall-mart workers", was a REALLY poor way of communicating that thought.

 

Now your talking,since it is the first thing on your list, Tell me where in the world there isn't class struggle. If you don't think so, tell us where in the world at any time in history where their wasn't class struggle. That's simply a throw away line. Your second thing on your list(Abolition of private property.") .Tell me how this country has taken over all property and tell me how all means of production is owned by the government. Tell me how this countries owns all businesses , then tell me how this country owns all the national resources. Tell me how all credit comes from the government in this country and not banks or investors. If your suggest some bullshit idea that the fact there is a central bank means the government controls who and what amount a person gets on credit, then we have a problem because every country in the world has a central bank. Tell me how our government sets wages and tell us how this country has the ability like communist countries have to tell the worker what his occupation will be. Tell me how our government tell corporation what they make. . The goofball right thinks that because this country has social programs that we are communist, all countries have social programs. Tell us why everyone in this country owns the means of production. Gee they missed me and all my neighbors. Probably just a oversight.
Try to explain your own definition and while your at it, answer the above questions . They are totally reasonable. considering the goof ball right call democrats, me , my president, my party communist or socialist or Marxist. You don;t have a clue what your talking about and that is clear to anyone who reads your crap. This proves it.

 

Non stop bullshit. That and lies is what drives the ding bat right.

 

Exactly right. Increased labor costs have only two effects on business, it will cause them to reduce the number of hours paid, and/or it will cause them to increase the price of products sold. This study suggests that it did indeed cause a reduction in hours paid. It would be interesting to know what effect, if any, the minimum wage increase had on consumer prices.

 

I've listed these tenets several times on just this thread. It's not my fault if you refuse to read them and understand them!

I didn't say there is someplace without class struggle. But it is usually *NOT* the basic mainstay of a political movement. Our War of Independence was not over a class struggle. Many of the Founding Fathers were quite rich. It was a political struggle for independence. That was the case in America till Woodrow Wilson was President. He first started the Marxism Democrats down the path of Marxism.

I didn't say the government had taken over all wealth. Your implication that I did is an argumentative fallacy known as the Strawman. That doesn't mean that it isn't a goal of the Marxist Democrats. Your money *is* your private property. Government TAKES, by threat of force, over 40% of many people's private property to do with as it pleases. Since about 50% of all households in America are receiving some form of government assistance, that means the government is redistributing a lot of private property! That doesn't even begin to address regulations like the EPA one that takes ownership of any mudhole on your property and restricts you from doing with it as *you* please instead of the far off government.

The first phase of Marxism is Fascism, the *economic* part of what is typically known as Fascism -- government control of business and capital. The government has taken control of the health insurance sector telling insurance companies how much they can earn and what their policies have to cover, the government has taken over the health care sector dictating what doctors will get paid, the government has taken over the energy sector determining what companies will succeed and which ones won't, and the government attempted to take over the internet sector with Net Neutrality until Trump stopped it!

All this control eases the transition into the next phase, government *ownership* of business and capital, i.e. Socialism.

I didn't say the government owns all national resources. Stop putting words in my mouth.
I didn't say *all* credit comes from the federal government. Stop putting words in my mouth.

The central bank *does* have a major impact on credit. It sets interest rates which significantly impacts the ability to access credit. The central bank is the entity that creates new money supply which, again, significantly impacts the ability to access credit.

I don't know what you consider a federal minimum wage to be other than the government dictating wages.

I didn't say the government tells you what job you have. Stop putting words in my mouth.

BTW, not even the Soviet Union required you to work in a certain job. I have no idea where you got that idea! It's not in any writings of Marx or Engels that I can find anywhere.

What do you think Obamacare did with the insurance companies as far as profit? When you tell a company the government is going to put them out of business what is that but government control of what the company makes in profit?

You apparently can't even tell the difference between what Marxism is and what Communism is. Communism is just one phase of Marxism. You can be a Marxist and still not be living in a communist state. Marx and Engels, while advocating Marxism, didn't even live in a communist state.

It is not me that has no idea what Marxism is. You don't know the tenets of Marxism. You don't know the phases of Marxism. It's apparent you have never even read the Communist Manifesto let alone any of the other writings of Marx and Engels.

It's quite apparent that you are frothing at the mouth about not being a Marxist because you don't know what Marxism is and you consider it to be a perjorative. Being told you are a Marxist merely means you are advocating the same tenets and policies as Marx. That doesn't make you bad, it just makes you WRONG!

 

For those business operating with low profit margins, who typically have a big demographic of minimum wage workers, it is difficult to raise prices. Prices in the market sectors containing these businesses significantly controls sales. Raise prices and sales go down, presumably because many customers won't buy at the higher price. Add that on top of mandated wage increases and you can easily kill a business.

I don't remember what the study said about prices but based on the impact on worker hours my guess is that price increases probably did *not* happen.

 

Most people can sustain themselves on $7.50 an hour if they spend smartly. There are a few places that are simply too expensive to live in that would need higher wages though.

 

I agree. That's a good thing, because it has limited the damage to the relatively low number of MW workers who had their hours cut, and spared the unemployed and fixed-income population the cost of living increase. When you make $0/hr, a 2% increase in your food costs really hurts.

 

I hadn't considered these impacts but you are correct. But it is hardly "no harm, no foul" as many of the liberals want to push.

 

I showed earlier in this thread that there are 95 million people who are not in the workforce. Retired, unemployed, those who have given up looking for work, those who cannot work, etc. They, in large, are the people we refer to when we use the phrase "the poor". They are the people hurt most by any inflation, no matter how small, caused by minimum wage increases and other government meddling in the marketplace.

 

That is why a national minimum wage is so idiotic. Far better to do it locally to match conditions.

However, no matter *where* you do it there will be a negative impact.

Single individuals can sustain themselves on $7.50 but it is difficult if you have children. This is where the federal government needs to do more. Much like the Public Service Announcements the government has put out on smoking and drinking and drugs in the past they need to do a PSA on how much bad choices can impact you and any children you have. "DON'T GET PREGGERS IF YOU CAN'T AFFORD IT!"

The social safety net is *not* just the responsibility of the rich. It is also, and maybe even more, the responsibility of those in the social safety net because of life choices.

 

You can't legislate away bad decision making, nor can you subsidize it away.

 

But you can refuse to reward it.

 

This is objectively wrong as a high minimum wage puts the poorest and least advantaged of society in permanent unemployment and welfare-addiction. If the minimum-wage continues to rise, it means taxes will have to rise too in order to finance the unemployed and when taxes go up, people work less. As a whole, a high minimum wage means a less productive society which is bad for the economy.

It is very simple, really. Even I who can barely remember where I put my wallet have the basic economic understanding to see this.

 

Evidently, the state of Oregon, and the municipalities of Portland and Seattle seem to now know that artificially raising the minimum wage was NOT a good idea.....