So God... wrote a book?

I am surprised to still see people arguing Pascal's wager.

There are so many solid refutations to it, varying from the question if we can make ourselves believe what we don't, to the fact that its a false dichotomy and there are millions of possible Gods, and the Bible and many other holy texts condemn worship of false Gods far more than belief in no Gods. Its also completely amoral.

 

You also have the free agency to seek God out and ask him yourself what he expects from you. That is if you really want to know. Granted that would require a measure of faith or an action to humble yourself to the possibility that God exists. Is your personal constitution flexible enough to accommodate such a thing. If not, then wouldn't a holy decree from on high shatter it in pieces? Would God be so careless.

 

Why are you moving the goalposts .. changing the topic ? but to answer your question - YHWH condemns homosexuality .. and Paul is a rabid homophobe .. but hates women at the same time .. and sex .. Simple - Plain - English

The topic however is things that are not so plain - and you need ask yourself - why are you running from my question ? I can answer if you like .. obviously .. but hoped you might be wanting to at least support your "defacto" claim .." that there is nothing to argue - everything in the Bible is stated plainly."

What is the Path to Heaven given in the Bible - in simple plain english ?

NO .. you are the one claiming that "The Path to Heaven" is in simple plain English... this is getting moronic .. already projecting your claim onto me.. and then trying to make me defend that claim..

So to the Question - Path to Salvation - that you seem desperate to run away from -- "not think" about. .. perhaps a little thought stopping - due to fundamentalist training

A) Faith B) Works C) a mixture of the two.

Note that your argument is lost already --as regardless of what the Bible says -- this is a hotely debated topic within the Church . .. has been since inception - Marty throwing in a new dogmatic twist -- using Pauline scripture .... and in particular the stuff not written by Paul .. but that is another matter.

I care not for Marty -- nor Paul for that matter .. you can choose who you like .. it matters not a wit to me.. I prefer to use the words of Jesus.. and on this topic ..its "Works - Works.. and more Works" - no mention of Faith as a requirement .. not a wit.

"Blessed are the poor in Spirit - For theirs is the Kingdom of Heaven" So it is written - So it Shall be done !

 

Well, since your reply is nothing but emotional and you haven’t bothered to read what I write. This discussion is at an end.

 

Faith and works. But even after all that you do, it is by Gods grace and will that one is saved. If you fight your way thru the enemy to the fort and bang on the door. It must be opened from within for you to be saved.

 

Before I adress your comment - regardless of what the path through the gates actually is - the claim by the other poster is that "There is nothing to debate - everything is in plan simple language"

Do you agree or disagre with this claim.

now on to your comment - "Faith and Works" the idea here is to give some biblical support. I am not so convinced that Faith is a requirement - at least not the "Sola Fide" kind.

First we have to define "Faith" .. Faith in what ? To the "Faith Alone" crowd - this means Faith in the Sacrifice - belief that our sins are wiped clean by the sacrifice. Others might be Faith in the Resurrection or belief that Jesus is the son of God .. to some that Jesus "IS" God

another is the belief that if one gives ones life to Jesus (what ever that means - kind of a mixture of baptism and works although protestants will deny the works portion) one is saved.

I find some support from the words of Jesus in Matt/Mark - belief that Jesus says who he says he is kind of "Faith" - the woman who believed on him and was healed .. other miracles. This however does not necessarily mean that this is the only way.

There is a huge amount of support for works as a requirement in Matt/Mark. Many examples in the Sermon on the Mount Matt-5-7 Matt 25 - sheep and goats parable. Don't find any support for the Faith in the Sacrifice claim.

 

You are projecting your failure onto others. It is you who failed to address the question put forth w/r to your claim that everything in the Bible is in plain simple terms - and not debated.

What was it that I did not address ? Running from the playground pouting and spewing false accusations - to stick head deep in the sanbox of denial - is not an argument for much.

 

To answer your question, some scriptures are plain and simple, others are just out of reach but attainable with great effort, while others are utterly undiscernible to me, especially where there appear to be contradictions. That's my pov of course.
As for faith and works, it seems like a no brainer to me. They go hand in hand. You can't have one without the other. Faith begets works. Faith without works is dead. And without faith there can be no works. But in the end it is our Heavenly Father who performs the ultimate act of our salvation.

 

Saved?

Why does anyone or everyone get condemned?

Why are we all created defective, according to the imaginary god creator?

Regards
DL

 

A lot of lies.

Regards
DL

 

Why does anyone or everyone get condemned?

Why are we all created defective, according to the imaginary god creator?

Regards
DL

 

When did god start putting sex above love?

Why do you do it?

Regards
DL

 

For your files.

WHEN SAME-SEX MARRIAGE WAS A CHRISTIAN RITE1 (christianity-revealed.com)

Regards
DL

 

God as described as the best rules and laws to live by, sure.

Not the god described as the genocidal prick you and Christians adore.

St. Hitler is in your camp though.

Regards
DL

 

If your god-thing isn't even going to answer the questions of the supposedly holy people who write bibles, why would he answer to an ordinary person?

According to the Poops, god told them to murder 8+ Million women for being "witches" and then murder another 1+ Billion people just because.

People were murdered for saying things like the Sun is the center of our Solar System and the Earth revolves around the Sun, which we know to be true, yet people who were supposedly communicating with your god-thing couldn't figure it out.

Your god-thing ignores the prayers of amputees.

Is your god-thing so weak he cannot heal an amputee?

 

That is the default - and rather simplistic answer - which sounds good on the surface .. but ontological issues underneath. Of course you can have one without the other .. and 2) you havn't even defined what "Faith" you are referring to .. "Faith in What" ... so there is no way to ascertain what you are saying. ... or relate any of it to scripture.

I will try to clarify what you are trying to say for you .. James 2 relates Faith and Works .. but, he does not really comment on the path to heaven part .. other than to deny that "Faith Alone" will save a person. .. he does not state "What Will" save a person - we can only say that acccording to James .. Brother of Jesus - Faith alone doesn't cut it. .. hence why Martin wanted the book stricken from Canon.

Prior in the Chapter .. James however does intimate what saves a person.

2 points "The Royal Law" - Do unto Others Matt 7:12 aka The Golden Rule. Paul also mentiones this "Royal Law" BTW - in a rare but important union.

and second Mercy Triumphs over Judgement.

To get through the pearly gates you have to go through Judgement mate .. No free pass .. have as much Faith as you like ..Still have to go through judgement.

James - "Follow the Royal Law and you are doing right
Jesus - The Royal Law "Sums up the Law and the Prophets" - do unto others - Golden Rull .. of which he gives numerous examples in his sermon explaining how one gets through the pearly gates .. how one is put right with God.

Ain't nothing about Grace .. Sorry .. Nothing about "Faith" sans faith in the Logos = Faith in "The WORD" The Way - The Truth -The Light.. .. not the actual personage .. as "The WORD" "IS" the actual personage.

The mission of Jesus was to bring you "The Word" - and that Word .. is "The Golden Rule" .. follow it and be put right with the Father.

 

On the one hand the adversary misrepresents God by doing evil in his name. Then on the other he condemns God by having misrepresented him. It is the source of the straw man argument. As for amputees, your impatience is not Gods challenge.

 

If Yahweh is your god, when has his genocides come from the adversary?

You might have noted that it is the religious who do evil in your vile god's name.

Regards
DL

 

Then by your own admission, one can never know who was actually called by your god-thing, in which case there's absolutely no point or benefit to organized religion.

Your god-thing put those who do evil, like Hitler, in power.

Your god says so here...

Romans 13:1(a) Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established.

...and again here...

Romans 13:1(b) The authorities that exist have been established by God.

You cannot deny your god-thing put the Poop-dee-doos in power and let them go on 1,337 year Reign of Terror murdering more than 1 Billion people, unless you admit your god is fallible or that Jesus lied.

More to the point, your god put all the murdering despots in power knowing in advance what they would do. If you reject that, then you have admitted your god is not omniscient, which means none of the prophecies are worth the paper they're written upon.

Romans 13:2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves.

Even if your god is not omniscient, your god should have been sufficiently intelligent enough to have foreseen the consequences of appointing despots and that other States would rebel and attempt to remove your god's hand-picked despots from from power, resulting in massive loss of life, destruction and despair.

Your god could have removed any of those depots from power at any time prior to the events resulting in massive death, but your god willingly chose not to do so, which makes your god all the more heinous and evil.

Your god's actions (or lack of) are indefensible and only a person with no moral compass would attempt to defend your god.

Wrong. A Straw Man is a logical fallacy because it is the intentional misrepresentation of another's argument.

Your god made no argument because he is too weak to debate me.

Your god has allegedly healed the deaf and blind and even allegedly raised the dead, but never in human history has your god healed an amputee.

Again, your god is too weak to be able to do that.

 

Blaming God for Satan's doings? You understand so little.. Satan means the adversary.. and he has rights.. it ain't 'Nam, there are rules, God made them when he gave us twits "free will" and He has to follow them or look like a hypocrite..

really pains me to read the ignorant post here.. but maybe some of what myself and my Brothers and Sister say might soak in to someone here perhaps just a lurker.. but some one.. BTW my Brothers and Sisters could show up on my doorstep and I would feed and house them in an emergency.. for one thing there is a certain level of behavior I could expect from them

 

Pauls epistle is to the members of the faith regarding the presiding authority therein. It is not about secular law. So I think you maybe misunderstand that epistle.

Regarding straw man: call it that, false flag, frame job or whatever you like. It is deceit on either hand.

As for restoring a missing limb I have no knowledge of such. I don't doubt it's beyond his scope seeing that he created everything. But I'd think that raising the dead covers it by virtue of restoring an entire body to life. He also restores hope, love, and faith along with our spiritual sight and hearing.

 

Um, no, he is specifically addressing submission to civil authority, ie secular law.

There is nothing deceptive about it and since I made no misrepresentation of your lame god-thing's position, it cannot, by definition, be a Straw Man. Your lack of winning is disturbing.

Your god-thing won't even reveal his true name. Can't get any more deceptive than that.

Sadly, you don't don't even understand that you are Gog. Enjoy your fiery death at the hands of the Divine Pyromaniac and Divine Pyromaniac Junior.

Apparently, your god-thing has Alzheimer's because he can't remember if his only begotten son was crucified on a Thursday or a Friday.

 

There are thousands of gods you can believe in. Why are you stuck on the Jewish one? Get another one.

 

The vast majority of people don't have clue as to what the real Ten Commandments are. Thats because they get their religion from silly Hollywood movies.