Study Pershing, Trump Said. But the Story Doesn’t Add Up

Yes, you Trumpsters rationalize everything.

If you read this thread, you'd know that Trump has used this lie before, and been called out on it.

It was not a "misquote". This is what he does.

You fall for it every time, and when called out, you try and make excuses.

 

In 1860 seceding from the Union was legal. Even Lincoln said so during his Mexican-American War speech in front of Congress.

When the Southern states seceded from the Union the first thing the Southern state militias did was to seize U.S. federal property.

President Buchanan ordered federal troops to retrieve federal property.

When Lincoln took the oath of office he continued the same policy.

But soon Lincoln's Secretary of the Treasury informed Lincoln that without the tax revenues that came from the South that kept the federal tax coffers full, the federal government couldn't pay its bills.

Note:
(By then the Confederate States of America was formed, it had a Congress and a constitution and met the definition under the "Law of Nations" as being a sovereign state.)

The mission changed, to bring the Southern states back into the Union. It was all about taxes, tax revenues that the Union needed or the USA would become just another third world country without the South.

Lincoln responded by ordering a naval blockade of the South and invaded the South.

One big problem that Lincoln didn't see coming with his naval blockade. Eangland, Frace and most Euroepean maritime nations were neutrals but the Yankee Navy was boarding neutral ships at sea and preventing neutral Europe from conducting trade with the CSA.

England and France accused Lincoln being a war criminal and a pirate.

If it was a civil war as Lincoln first said it was then Lincoln's naval blockade was a international crime.

Also if the war was a civil war both sides had to observe the international laws of war. Like the handling of POW's.

If it was a rebellion than neither the soldiers on both side fall under the protections of the laws of war. But if it was a rebellion all of the soldiers, sailors and the civilians in the South fall under the full protections of the Constitution. Also if it were a rebellion, Lincoln's naval blockade was legal.

So Lincoln turned to Vattel's "Law of Nations" and he even went all the way to the Supreme Court.

Was it a rebellion or a civil war ?

I know the answer, do you PARTIZAN1 ?

The answer can be found here -> http://ir.lawnet.fordham.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1252&context=faculty_scholarship

Slavery didn't become an issue until most in the North got tired of the war so Lincoln came up with a new military strategy that completely failed. The "Emancipation Proclamation."

If the CSA were have accepted the Emancipation Proclamation and stopped fighting and rejoined the Union, things in the South would have returned as they were before the war including slavery.

The South rejected the offer and kept on fighting. Johnny Reb didn't give a **** about slavery, 90% of the Confederate soldiers never owned slaves and slavery in the South depressed the wages in the South.

excerpts:

 

They aren't on the internet and many are still classified.

If you ever got to read one while in the Nam the first thing you noticed that was stamped on each page was SECRET

 

I do not give two craps if the south had a congress and a Constitution they were Traitors to their nation. You can play a word game with rebellion, civil war, revolution there is little distinction. Classically a revolution is when rebels seize power of the government from the prior power keepers. Civil war can be an element of a rebellion. Usually when rebels will theirvrebellion they can it a revolution. The issue of civil war vs rebellion is mucked up in opinion since the definitions are not clear.
I am not falling into a semantically argument.

TheUnion set out to restore the control of the entire country back to the federal government and rest control away from the traitors who called themselves Confederates.

You are correct that the average jonnie reb did own schist but he died trying to help the plantation owners keep slavery which did him no good. Bottom line jhinnuecreb was a fool and or an idiot. But a brave idiot.

 

What lie did he use this time that this thread is in Current Events, again? Please quote his lie.

 

During the Civil War and and during the Reconstruction era (military occupation) of the South the only people who used the word "traitors" were radicals. They were known as "radical Republicans" today they are known as radical leftist.

President Lincoln never called anyone in the South traitors and called those who called Southerners traitors as radicals.


Did the CSA try to overthrow the federal government in Washington DC ? No.

Did the CSA Attack and invaded the North ? No they did not.

But after the Battle of Bull Run the Confederate army could have easily marched upon Washington DC and occupied DC but did not.

Remember, before 1861, seceding from the Union was legal.

BTW:
Did you find the answer ? Was it a war or a rebellion ?
A pretty interesting article I linked too wasn't it ?

 

You forget that Lee almost won in Pennsylvania at Gettysburg and it was a hope by God South to take D.C.

 

I replied to your post. There he no clear answer since rebellions, civil war, and revolutions share elements in common. I would lean towards civil war since the realistic goal was to separate the South from the home country. Still an act of treason. You will not convince me otherwise.

It was a pretty link.

BTW I was part of a tour in the summer of 1964 between my junior and senior years in HS we went to civil war sites led by my history teacher and open only to AP level history students and only Academic track history students who had at least an A in history. I had an A+ in history so I went and had fun debating the obnoxious AP students who thought that they were the only ones who knew anything. Pompous asses most of them.
It was the 100 year anniversary of the civil war. The civil war sites were just being restored.

 

Gettyburgh, Pa.

Robert E. Lee wasn't a happy camper when President Jefferson Davis ordered the Army of Northern Virginia to cross the border into the United States. In fact Gen. Lee protested pointing out that by entering Pennsylvania would be looked upon the Europeans who were siding with the South as an act of aggression by the South.

But Robert E. Lee was a military general not a low life politician. He followed orders.

 

Unless a Clinton does it.

 

I'm sure you didn't read the entire article because it's 93 pages long.

The Supreme Court told lincoln that it was his call of if it was a rebellion or a war.

The answer was both, it was a civil war so the rules of war would cover both sides and it was a rebellion so the U.S. Navy's blockade would be legal under international law.

If you ever look at newspapers publish in the North from 1961 to 1865 it was always referred to as a rebellion or the "Great Rebellion." In the South the newspapers always used "civil war."

But the winners of wars always get to write the final chapters on the wars that were fought.

The problem I and many have is when cultural-marxist rewrite history (revisionist history) to further a radical leftist political agenda.

And that's what the radical left is doing with these attacks upon Confederate war memorials and statues, they have adopted the tactics of the Taliban.

 

Most say classified at the top, not secret, and they're all over the internet unclassified.

>>
Execution:
B Company 2-8, conduct move from Landing Zone PATT, to FIRE SUPPORT BASE
BOBBIE. Escort Arty 3-6 with two platoons. Secure Arty 5-16 at FIRE
SUPPORT BASE PATT with two platoons. Short Range Patrol West and
Southwest of FIRE SUPPORT BASE PATT, along DAK BLA River. Conduct
reconnaissance in force, short range patrols, LANDING ZONE BOBBIE.
Conduct MEDCAP.

Task Organization:
HHC, A, B, C, D Companies 2-8 Infantry; A & B Companies 1-8 Infantry
and 3-6 Arty. 1-69 Armor and 2-1 Cavalry. Infantry, 1-35. Engineer
support, 4th Engineer Battalion and the 299th Engineer Battalion.
Artillery, 5-6, 4-42. Transportation, 1-8 Transportation, 2-8
Transportation. Aviation, 4th Aviation. Special, PLEI MRONG Civilian
Strike Force element.

Call Signs:
ATLAS, PAPPA, ATLAS XRAY, YANKEE FIVE ZERO, X EIGHT, NIPPER, BUGLE,
SKILL, WHISKEY ZERO SIX, ZERO SIX ALPHA, ZERO SIX BRAVO, BLACKJACK FOUR
HUNDRED, XRAY EIGHT, HEADHUNTER THREE SEVEN, WILDER, GAMBLER, COMMON
BASE, BIKINI SIX NINE, SIDER FORWARD AIR CONTROL, HORNET FOUR FOUR,
GLADIATOR ONE ZERO ZERO,

2-8 Infantry Commanders and Principle Staff:
Battalion CO LTC William S deCamp
Battalion XO MAJ Robert N Bloomstrand
Battalion S1 1LT Jordan B Gaudry
Battalion S2 CPT Edward W Strabol, MSG Earl K Andrews, CPT James F
Schwartz
Battalion S3 MAJ Stanley W Russell
Battalion S4 CPT Robert L Schmitt
Battalion S5 1LT Allen J Spillum
HHC 1LT Rodney D Miller, CPT James E Bilderbeck
A Co CPT Donald Gonneville, CPT Edward W Strabel
B Co CPT Angelo A Severino
C Co CPT Elwoood R Tauscher
D Co CPT James F Schwartz

Weather:
Early morning fog burning off 8:30 - 9:30 am (08:30 to 09:30 hours).
Transition from dry season to monsoon with light rain showers, variable
winds to 10 knots, thunderstorms, and cloudiness during mid to late
afternoon hours. Temperatures ranged from 98 degrees to 64 degrees.

Terrain:
Mountainous to open plains.

Logistics:
Hot A rations averaged two meals a day. Wood construction materials
in critical supply. The following small arms rounds were expended:
301,220 5.56mm 663,000 7.62mm 215,000 .50 caliber

Monday, 17 March.

7:45 am. 0745 hours.
ZA059976, 1-69 in contact, 2 Armored Personnel Carriers hit by B-40
rockets - 5 wounded in action and 1 Armored Personnel Carrier destroyed.
Artillery and gunships supported contact. In support of the contact,
additional 2 Armored Personnel Carriers 7-17 Cavalry and 2/8 hit mines,
6 WOUNDED IN ACTION and 1 ARMORED PERSONNEL CARRIER destroyed.

9:17 am. 0917 hours.
ZA069923, 2 tanks from 1-69 hit mines (believed command detonated) while
escorting convoy to LANDING ZONE Bass.

Tuesday, 18 March.

8:40 am. 0840 hours.
>From FIRE SUPPORT BASE PATT, start 2-8 MEDCAP.

8:50 am. 0850 hours.
Start 2-8 resupply convoy from FIRE SUPPORT BASE PATT to LANDING ZONE
MARYLOU.

10:00 am. 1000 hours.
2-8 go to PLEI MRONG give security to ARTY downed gun along road.

10:05 am. 1005 hours.
Resupply 2-8 convoy arrives LANDING ZONE MARYLOU.

4:20 pm. 1620 hours.
Resupply 2-8 convoy returns to FIRE SUPPORT BASE PATT.

7:18 pm. 1918 hours.
>From S3; erect standoff fences, dig in and put up concertina before
sleep.

11:10 pm. 2310 hours.
2-8 receives a frag., some sort of explosion. One wounded needs DUSTOFF
(medical evacuation).

11:30 pm. 2330 hours.
WARNING ORDER for 2-8. At 0700 on 19 March, relocate to LANDING ZONE
BOBBIE (ZA06173, move by way of villages toward Plei Mrong. Take as
much wire and sandbags as you can carry and time permits. Move with
Headquarters and one Line Platoon. Leave Weapons Platoon to ash and
trash LANDING ZONE PATT. Scout Platoon have two Armored Personnel
Carriers report to LANDING ZONE MARYLOU to pick up trucks.

Wednesday, 19 March.

6:55 am. 0655 hours.
Short Range Patrol from 2-8 arrives LANDING ZONE PATT.

8:15 am. 0815 hours.
2-8 HQ, Line Platoon and D Battery 5-16 Artillery leave for LANDING ZONE
BOBBY.

8:20 am. 0820 hours.
Scouts of 2-8 leave for LANDING ZONE MARYLOU.

8:45 am. 0845 hours.
Scouts to stop at PLEI MRONG turnoff for REDLEG (Artillery) trucks.

9:45 am. 0945 hours.
A REDLEG (Artillery) 548 is down and 2-8 is towing it.

10:30 am. 1030 hours.
>From S3, the LITTLE PEOPLE are operating in area, 2-8 has no radio
contact with them.

12:40 pm. 1240 hours.
2-8 having trouble crossing at ZA099766.

2:20 pm. 1420 hours.
Atry (Artillery) observer in LOH bird receives ground fire at ZA089690.

3:10 pm. 1510 hours.
2-8 crosses at ZA099766.

4:12 pm. 1612 hours.
2-8 takes B-40 rocket from 500 meters off Highway 14 at ZA198727. One
wounded.

4:25 pm. 1625 hours.
DUSTOFF (medical evacuation) called for two wounded.

4:34 pm. 1634 hours.
2-8 1000 meters south of LANDING ZONE BOBBIE (in wrong FIRE SUPPORT
BASE).

5:25 pm. 1725 hours.
2-8 arrives correct location at LANDING ZONE BOBBIE.

5:55 pm. 1755 hours.
2-8 leaves to fix crossing at ZA099766.

Thursday, 20 march.

8:15 am. 0815 hours. At ZA176737, ARMORED PERSONNEL CARRIER from 2-8
received 1 B-40 round; 1 WOUNDED IN ACTION and slight damage to ARMORED
PERSONNEL CARRIER. Provide escort morning convoy from LANDING ZONE
MARYLOU to Polie Krong daily. MAXIMUM RESUPPLY ACTIVITIES TO BEGIN 21
MARCH FROM POLIE KLING.

8:20 am. 0820 hours.
2-8 track (Armored Personnel Carrier) hit with B-40/one wounded, called
for DUSTOFF (medical evacuation)/at ZA176737/enemy fled to South. 2-8
reacting.<<

 

It really doesn't matter what "Johnny Reb" thought - he didn't sign the documents seceding from the union and ordering military action.

In his "cornorstone speech", the VP of the new confederacy Alexander Stephens declared that the "cornerstone" of the new government "rest[ed] upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery – subordination to the superior race – is his natural and normal condition. This, our new government, is the first, in the history of the world, based upon this great physical, philosophical, and moral truth"

You can also find the documents of cessation of various of the states wherein they point at slavery as the primary reason for secession.

So, no, you are not even close.

 

Pretty lousy after action report.

How many KIA, WIA.

How many enemy weapons were captured, how many rounds of ammunition ? Where were the AK-47's manufactured ? How many tons of rice were captured ? How many land mines were capture and where were they manufactured ? Were any bear traps encountered ? Enemy grenades, were they Soviet Block or Chi-Com ?

How many heat casualties ? Weather conditions, temp, humidity, wind direction, wind speed throughout the day. Full Comanche moon or no moon at night ? How many rounds were expended from every weapon. How many fire support missions were conducted ? How were the American troops brought into the theatre of operations and how did they leave ? what complaints were their from the troops ?

A Marine Corps after action report were very long and thick.

From corporals fire team leaders, squad leaders, platoon and company commanders would all be debriefed that would contribute to the after action reports.

From the after action reports the "lessons learned" would be wrote and distributed back down the chain of command that were hundreds of pages long.