UK will classify "Islamist extremism" as distinct ideology

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by Dutch, Dec 5, 2013.

  1. snakestretcher

    snakestretcher Banned

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    No, Sharia rulings are not legally binding under English Law. Read what it says under the heading "legality", in my link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_Arbitration_Tribunal#Legality
    "As such it operates within the framework of English law and does not constitute a seperate Islamic legal system".
     
  2. snakestretcher

    snakestretcher Banned

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    Congratulations on your excellent example of how bigotry informs your mindset. I too can cherry-pick all kinds of unpleasantness from all kinds of faiths. Unfortunately, as with your sterling effort, it would prove absolutely nothing. Oh, and I noted something about "second class" citizenry or whatever. Would you like me to quote what Jews suggest for the goyim? This is what one of your beloved Jewish religious leaders-a Chief Rabbi no less-said: http://www.jta.org/2010/10/18/news-...rdi-leader-yosef-non-jews-exist-to-serve-jews
     
  3. Gilos

    Gilos Well-Known Member

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    That's because you ppl (*)(*)(*)(*)ed up the definition of Zionism beyond recognition, the settelers ideolegy is not Zionism, they see it as fulfilling Zionism as any extremist sees his way the true way to worship God - in their case God's will, but you sin the same way others do toward Muslims, you take the minority and decide they reprisent the majority. the 40's and 50's are long gone, those militant leaders are gone, the enemy (as a famous Israeli song goes) in not scary any more only deserves pity, what you see since the 90's till now is mainly mistrust and hate.
     
  4. Gilos

    Gilos Well-Known Member

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    He said the same thing on us secular Jews, that's the reason seculars should be tolerated as sinners next to Orthodox according to him, he said alot of nonsense in his old age that fed satire shows for years. when he was younger and sharper he was a good religous leader, he was the one that took the Ethopean project to prove they are Israelites and brought them to Israel among other things.
     
  5. snakestretcher

    snakestretcher Banned

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    My point exactly; there are lunatics and extremists everywhere you look. It takes an honest person to look a little closer to home and admit to the existence of their own variety.
     
  6. Sab

    Sab Active Member

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    That's because the penalty is in the Hadiths. Nice try.
     
  7. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Even before the life of Prophet Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Him) in the 600s, Arab traders were in contact with India. Merchants would regularly sail to the west coast of India to trade goods such as spices, gold, and African goods. Naturally, when the Arabs began to convert to Islam, they carried their new religion to the shores of India.

    The first mosque of India, the Cheraman Juma Masjid, was built in 629 (during the life of Prophet Muhammad) in Kerala, by the first Muslim from India, Cheraman Perumal Bhaskara Ravi Varma. Through continued trade between Arab Muslims and Indians, Islam continued to spread in coastal Indian cities and towns, both through immigration and conversion.

    http://lostislamichistory.com/how-islam-spread-in-india/
     
  8. J0NAH

    J0NAH Banned

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    Dude, they are a plague, why do you think there has been a resurgence of Zombie movies? It represents the ppl, braindead most of em.
     
  9. Gilos

    Gilos Well-Known Member

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    Couldnt agree more...
     
  10. Goomba

    Goomba Well-Known Member

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    Death for homosexual sex, not for being homosexual.
     
  11. Face. Your

    Face. Your Banned

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    And read further that they are recognized as arbitration tribunals and thus are as legally binding as any private arbitration court!

    Do you even know what private arbitration is in the civil law? Their rulings are completely legally binding in civil matters.

    Read the entirety of section 1:

    The provisions of this Part are founded on the following principles, and shall be construed accordingly—

    (a)the object of arbitration is to obtain the fair resolution of disputes by an impartial tribunal without unnecessary delay or expense;

    (b)the parties should be free to agree how their disputes are resolved, subject only to such safeguards as are necessary in the public interest;

    (c)in matters governed by this Part the court should not intervene except as provided by this Part.


    http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1996/23/section/1
     
  12. Face. Your

    Face. Your Banned

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    He was ultra-orthodox, the ultra-orthodox form a minority within the Jewish community even in Israel.

    Can we continue reading what is in your article for a non-orthodox takes on this nutters comments:

    The American Jewish Committee condemned the rabbi’s remarks in a statement issued Monday.

    "Rabbi Yosef’s remarks — suggesting outrageously that Jewish scripture asserts non-Jews exist to serve Jews — are abhorrent and an offense to human dignity and human equality,” said AJC Executive Director David Harris. "Judaism first taught the world that all individuals are created in the divine image, which helped form the basis of our moral code. A rabbi should be the first, not the last, to reflect that bedrock teaching of our tradition."
     
  13. Face. Your

    Face. Your Banned

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    And don't forget through conquest and genocide!

    - - - Updated - - -

    So if a homosexual does what makes him a homosexual he should be put to death according to Islamic jurisprudence, precisely! :roll:
     
  14. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Oh piffle.. The Arabs were trading with the Indus Valley and East Africa long before Islam and long before Genesis.
     
  15. Face. Your

    Face. Your Banned

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    National Socialism was not a Christian sect and in fact sought to displace Christianity in Europe, they were very involved in the new age and occult and sought a return to Nordic Pagan religion.
     
  16. snakestretcher

    snakestretcher Banned

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    And you will note that it is English Law which delivered the ruling, and not Sharia law. Sharia law is always subject to final arbitration under English law. If there is any dispute between litigants they are under no obligation to be bound by the ruling of the tribunal, and may seek justice under English law.
    Yes, Sharia tribunals are recognised under English law; that isn't in dispute. What I am pointing out is simply that their rulings have a very limited legal scope-divorce, for example, cannot be ruled on. Only English law can rule on matters such as that.
     
  17. Face. Your

    Face. Your Banned

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    Good for that, it has nothing to do with the fact that the Muslims instigated genocide on the Indian subcontinent and Islam spread there through the sword at the cost of millions upon millions of dead Hindus and Buddhists (80 million by some accounts):

    In 712 following the capture of the port of Debal, the Islamic conquerors slaughtered the inhabitants for three days straight. From the letter of Hajjaj to his nephew Kassim upon the capture of Debal:

    “… The great god says in the Koran [47:7]: “O True believers, when you encounter the unbelievers, strike off their heads.” The above command of the Great God is a great command and must be respected…. Henceforth, grant pardon to no one of the enemy and spare none of them..”



    During Islamic rule of the Indian sub-continent

    The Muslim conquest of the Indian subcontinent led to widespread carnage because Muslims regarded the Hindus as infidels and therefore slaughtered and converted millions of Hindus. Will Durant argued in his 1935 book "The Story of Civilization: Our Oriental Heritage" (page 459):

    “ The Mohammedan conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. The Islamic historians and scholars have recorded with great glee and pride the slaughters of Hindus, forced conversions, abduction of Hindu women and children to slave markets and the destruction of temples carried out by the warriors of Islam during 800 AD to 1700 AD. Millions of Hindus were converted to Islam by sword during this period. ”​

    There is no official estimate of the total death toll of Hindus at the hands of Muslims.

    As Braudel put it: "The levies it had to pay were so crushing that one catastrophic harvest was enough to unleash famines and epidemics capable of killing a million people at a time. Appalling poverty was the constant counterpart of the conquerors' opulence."

    The backward castes of Hinduism suffered worst. Monarchs (belonging to backward castes) such as Khusrau Bhangi Khan, Hemchandra and Garha-Katanga were knocked off their throne and executed. Backward caste saints like Namadeva[1] were arrested, while women like Kanhopatra were forced to commit suicide. Ghisadis have an “Urdu” title.[2]

    Prof. K.S. Lal, suggests a calculation in his book Growth of Muslim Population in Medieval India which estimates that between the years 1000 AD and 1500 AD the population of Hindus decreased by 80 million. Even those Hindus who converted to Islam were not immune from persecution, which was illustrated by the Muslim Caste System in India as established by Ziauddin al-Barani in the Fatawa-i Jahandari.[3] where they were regarded as "Ajlaf" caste and subjected to severe discrimination by the "Ashraf" castes.[4]

    By Arabs

    Muslim conquest of the Indian subcontinent began during the early 8th century, when the Umayyad governor of Damascus, Hajjaj responded to a casus belli provided by the kidnapping of Muslim women and treasures by pirates off the coast of Debal,[5] by mobilizing an expedition of 6,000 cavalry under Muhammad bin-Qasim in 712 CE. Records from the campaign recorded in the Chach Nama record temple demolitions, and mass executions of resisting Sindhi forces and the enslavement of their dependents. This action was particularly extensive in Debal, of which Qasim is reported to have been under orders to make an example of while freeing both the captured women and the prisoners of a previous failed expedition. Bin Qasim then enlisted the support of the local Jat, Meds and Bhutto tribes and began the process of subduing and conquering the countryside. The capture of towns was also usually accomplished by means of a treaty with a party from among his "enemy", who were then extended special privileges and material rewards.[6] However, his superior Hajjaj reportedly objected to his method by saying that it would make him look weak and advocated a more hardline military strategy:[7]


    “ It appears from your letter that all the rules made by you for the comfort and convenience of your men are strictly in accordance with religious law. But the way of granting pardon prescribed by the law is different from the one adopted by you, for you go on giving pardon to everybody, high or low, without any discretion between a friend and a foe. The great God says in the Koran [47.4]: "0 True believers, when you encounter the unbelievers, strike off their heads." The above command of the Great God is a great command and must be respected and followed. You should not be so fond of showing mercy, as to nullify the virtue of the act. Henceforth grant pardon to no one of the enemy and spare none of them, or else all will consider you a weak-minded man. ”​

    In a subsequent communication, Hajjaj reiterated that all able-bodied men were to be killed, and that their underage sons and daughters were to be imprisoned and retained as hostages. Qasim obeyed, and on his arrival at the town of Brahminabad massacred between 6,000 and 16,000 of the defending forces.[8] The historian, Upendra Thakur records the persecution of Hindus and Buddhists:


    “ When Muhammad Kasim invaded Sind in 711 AD, Buddhism had no resistance to offer to their fire and steel. The rosary could not be a match for the sword and the terms Love and Peace had no meaning to them. They carried fire and sword wherever they went and obliterated all that came their way. Muhammad triumphantly marched into the country, conquering Debal, Sehwan, Nerun, Brahmanadabad, Alor and Multan one after the other in quick succession, and in less than a year and a half, the far-flung Hindu kingdom was crushed, the great civilization fell back and Sind entered the darkest period of its history. There was a fearful outbreak of religious bigotry in several places and temples were wantonly desecrated. At Debal, the Nairun and Aror temples were demolished and converted into mosques.[Resistors] were put to death and women made captives. The Jizya was exacted with special care.[Hindus] were required to feed Muslim travellers for three days and three nights.[9] ​
    ”

    Timur himself recorded the invasions in his memoirs, collectively known as Tuzk-i-Timuri.[21] In them, he vividly described the massacre at Delhi:

    In a short space of time all the people in the [Delhi] fort were put to the sword, and in the course of one hour the heads of 10,000 infidels were cut off. The sword of Islam was washed in the blood of the infidels, and all the goods and effects, the treasure and the grain which for many a long year had been stored in the fort became the spoil of my soldiers. They set fire to the houses and reduced them to ashes, and they razed the buildings and the fort to the ground....All these infidel Hindus were slain, their women and children, and their property and goods became the spoil of the victors. I proclaimed throughout the camp that every man who had infidel prisoners should put them to death, and whoever neglected to do so should himself be executed and his property given to the informer. When this order became known to the ghazis of Islam, they drew their swords and put their prisoners to death.

    One hundred thousand infidels, impious idolators, were on that day slain. Maulana Nasiruddin Umar, a counselor and man of learning, who, in all his life, had never killed a sparrow, now, in execution of my order, slew with his sword fifteen idolatrous Hindus, who were his captives....on the great day of battle these 100,000 prisoners could not be left with the baggage, and that it would be entirely opposed to the rules of war to set these idolaters and enemies of Islam at liberty...no other course remained but that of making them all food for the sword.[22]​

    According to Malfuzat-i-Timuri,[23] Timur targeted Hindus. In his own words, "Excepting the quarter of the saiyids, the 'ulama and the other Musalmans [sic], the whole city was sacked". In his descriptions of the Loni massacre he wrote, "..Next day I gave orders that the Musalman prisoners should be separated and saved."


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Hindus
     
  18. snakestretcher

    snakestretcher Banned

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    Good, then I'm sure you'll agree that lunatics form a minority within any society-including Muslim nations which you single-out for particular vilification.
     
  19. mutmekep

    mutmekep New Member

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    LOLWUT

    [​IMG]

    [/img]http://alamoministries.com/content/english/Antichrist/nazigallery/2freidrichcoch.jpg[/img]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  20. Face. Your

    Face. Your Banned

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    Provide your source which states that litigants are not bound by the rulings of private arbitration tribunals. The Act Clearly states that in matters governed in section 1 the courts shall not interfere except as governed in section 1.
     
  21. Face. Your

    Face. Your Banned

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    LOL you don't have a (*)(*)(*)(*)ing clue what you're talking about LOL

    During the war Alfred Rosenberg formulated a thirty-point program for the National Reich Church, which included:

    The National Reich Church claims exclusive right and control over all Churches.
    The National Church is determined to exterminate foreign Christian faiths imported into Germany in the ill-omened year 800.
    The National Church demands immediate cessation of the publishing and dissemination of the Bible.
    The National Church will clear away from its altars all Crucifixes, Bibles and pictures of Saints.
    On the altars there must be nothing but Mein Kampf and to the left of the altar a sword.[32]

    William Shirer wrote that "under the leadership of Rosenberg, Bormann and Himmler, who were backed by Hitler, the Nazi regime intended to destroy Christianity in Germany, if it could, and substitute the old paganism of the early tribal Germanic gods and the new paganism of the Nazi extremists."[49]


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religi...onal_Socialist_attitudes_towards_Christianity

    First (spring to fall 1933):

    Hitler makes efforts to assimilate the churches into the culture of National Socialism.
    Hitler moves to eliminate Political Catholicism: dissolution of Catholic aligned political parties and signing of Reichskonkordat with Vatican. Sporadic persecution of Catholics.
    Preparation to create unified single Reichskirche from the 28 regional Protestant churches: Hitler installs pro-Nazi chaplain Ludwig Müller as Reich Bishop; splitting German Protestants.

    Second (fall 1933 – fall 1934)

    Regime attempts to bring churches under control of the Nazi state (Gleichschaltung).
    Nazi breaches of Concordat commence immediately after signing: sterilization law promulgated, Catholic Youth Leagues dissolved; clergy, nuns and lay leaders harassed.[30]
    Heretical views of Reich Bishop and German Christians, leads Martin Neimoller to found Pastors' Emergency League which grows into Confessing Church, which reasserts authority of Bible and from which some clergymen oppose regime.[31]

    Third (fall 1934 – February 1937)

    Regime tries to bring the Protestant churches under its control by taking charge of church finances and governance structures.
    Failure of Müller to unite Protestants in Nazified Church sees Hitler appoint Hans Kerrl as Minister for Church Affairs.
    1936, Nazis remove crucifixes in schools. Catholic Bishop of Munster August von Galen protests and public demonstrations follow.[32]
    1936 - Confessing Church protest to Hitler against antisemitism, "anti-Christian" tendencies of regime, and interference in church affairs.[33] Hundreds of pastors arrested, funds of the church confiscated, collections forbidden.[33]

    Martin Niemoller was sent to the Concentration camps in 1937. He founded the Confessing Church after the Nazis attempted to subjugate Protestants in a Reich Church.

    Fourth (February 1937 – 1939)

    More open conflict based on "Nazism itself and its anti-Christian worldviews". Regime increases imprisonment of resistant clergy.
    March 1937: Pope Pius XI issues Mit brennender Sorge encyclical, denouncing aspects of Nazi ideology, protesting regime's violations of Concordat and treatment of Catholics, and abuse of human rights.[34]
    Regime responds with intensification of Church Struggle.[20] Trumped up "immorality trials" against clergy and anti-Church propaganda campaign.[20] Christmas 1937 address, Pope tells cardinals "rarely has there been a persecution so grave"[35]
    1 July 1937, Confessing Church banned. Martin Niemöller arrested.[36] Theological universities closed, pastors and theologians arrested.[37]

    Fifth stage (1939–1945)

    More clergy were imprisoned - Clergy Barracks established at Dachau.
    July-Aug 1941 - Bishop von Galen's sermons denounce lawlessness of Gestapo, confiscations of church properties and Nazi euthanasia. Govt takes program underground.[38]
    Clergy were drafted into the military
    Church publications were censored or banned
    Services and functions restricted or banned
    22 March 1942, the German Catholic Bishops issued a pastoral letter on "The Struggle against Christianity and the Church":[39]
    Nazi assault on churches and "Christian conscience" motivates many of the July Plot participants in failed 1944 coup against Hitler.[40] Leading clerical resistors Dietrich Bonhoeffer and Alfred Delp are implicated. Both executed in 1945.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirchenkampf#Five_stages_of_Kirchenkampf
     
  22. mutmekep

    mutmekep New Member

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  23. Face. Your

    Face. Your Banned

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    Photos do not reflect the policy of Nazi Germany towards Christianity which was one of animosity and the plan to eradicate Christianity from Europe and replace it with old Nordic Paganism:

    The Reichskonkordat (Reich Concordat) was a treaty between the Holy See and the German Reich, during its transition into Nazi Germany. It was signed on 20 July 1933 by Secretary of State Eugenio Pacelli (who later became Pope Pius XII) and Vice Chancellor Franz von Papen on behalf of Pope Pius XI and President Paul von Hindenburg respectively. The treaty guaranteed the rights of the Roman Catholic Church in Germany, but Nazi breaches of the agreement began almost as soon as it had been signed, leading to protest from the Church, including in the 1937 Mit brennender Sorge encyclical of Pope Pius XI.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichskonkordat



    During the war Alfred Rosenberg formulated a thirty-point program for the National Reich Church, which included:

    The National Reich Church claims exclusive right and control over all Churches.
    The National Church is determined to exterminate foreign Christian faiths imported into Germany in the ill-omened year 800.
    The National Church demands immediate cessation of the publishing and dissemination of the Bible.
    The National Church will clear away from its altars all Crucifixes, Bibles and pictures of Saints.
    On the altars there must be nothing but Mein Kampf and to the left of the altar a sword.[32]

    William Shirer wrote that "under the leadership of Rosenberg, Bormann and Himmler, who were backed by Hitler, the Nazi regime intended to destroy Christianity in Germany, if it could, and substitute the old paganism of the early tribal Germanic gods and the new paganism of the Nazi extremists."[49]


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religi...onal_Socialist_attitudes_towards_Christianity

    First (spring to fall 1933):

    Hitler makes efforts to assimilate the churches into the culture of National Socialism.
    Hitler moves to eliminate Political Catholicism: dissolution of Catholic aligned political parties and signing of Reichskonkordat with Vatican. Sporadic persecution of Catholics.
    Preparation to create unified single Reichskirche from the 28 regional Protestant churches: Hitler installs pro-Nazi chaplain Ludwig Müller as Reich Bishop; splitting German Protestants.

    Second (fall 1933 – fall 1934)

    Regime attempts to bring churches under control of the Nazi state (Gleichschaltung).
    Nazi breaches of Concordat commence immediately after signing: sterilization law promulgated, Catholic Youth Leagues dissolved; clergy, nuns and lay leaders harassed.[30]
    Heretical views of Reich Bishop and German Christians, leads Martin Neimoller to found Pastors' Emergency League which grows into Confessing Church, which reasserts authority of Bible and from which some clergymen oppose regime.[31]

    Third (fall 1934 – February 1937)

    Regime tries to bring the Protestant churches under its control by taking charge of church finances and governance structures.
    Failure of Müller to unite Protestants in Nazified Church sees Hitler appoint Hans Kerrl as Minister for Church Affairs.
    1936, Nazis remove crucifixes in schools. Catholic Bishop of Munster August von Galen protests and public demonstrations follow.[32]
    1936 - Confessing Church protest to Hitler against antisemitism, "anti-Christian" tendencies of regime, and interference in church affairs.[33] Hundreds of pastors arrested, funds of the church confiscated, collections forbidden.[33]

    Martin Niemoller was sent to the Concentration camps in 1937. He founded the Confessing Church after the Nazis attempted to subjugate Protestants in a Reich Church.

    Fourth (February 1937 – 1939)

    More open conflict based on "Nazism itself and its anti-Christian worldviews". Regime increases imprisonment of resistant clergy.
    March 1937: Pope Pius XI issues Mit brennender Sorge encyclical, denouncing aspects of Nazi ideology, protesting regime's violations of Concordat and treatment of Catholics, and abuse of human rights.[34]
    Regime responds with intensification of Church Struggle.[20] Trumped up "immorality trials" against clergy and anti-Church propaganda campaign.[20] Christmas 1937 address, Pope tells cardinals "rarely has there been a persecution so grave"[35]
    1 July 1937, Confessing Church banned. Martin Niemöller arrested.[36] Theological universities closed, pastors and theologians arrested.[37]

    Fifth stage (1939–1945)

    More clergy were imprisoned - Clergy Barracks established at Dachau.
    July-Aug 1941 - Bishop von Galen's sermons denounce lawlessness of Gestapo, confiscations of church properties and Nazi euthanasia. Govt takes program underground.[38]
    Clergy were drafted into the military
    Church publications were censored or banned
    Services and functions restricted or banned
    22 March 1942, the German Catholic Bishops issued a pastoral letter on "The Struggle against Christianity and the Church":[39]
    Nazi assault on churches and "Christian conscience" motivates many of the July Plot participants in failed 1944 coup against Hitler.[40] Leading clerical resistors Dietrich Bonhoeffer and Alfred Delp are implicated. Both executed in 1945.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirchenkampf#Five_stages_of_Kirchenkampf
     
  24. Goomba

    Goomba Well-Known Member

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    Just because a person is a pedophile does not mean he should act on his desires. Just because a person has hatred for Muslims does not mean he should start blasting- right, Face? ;)
     
  25. Face. Your

    Face. Your Banned

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    Provide the Sharia based state in which homosexuality, sex outside of marriage, and leaving Islam are not criminal offenses and which promotes gender and religious equality.

    - - - Updated - - -

    You mean like Mohammad? Are you seriously comparing homosexual relationships between two consenting adults to pedophilia? I really wouldn't have expected any different from a Muslim.
     

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