What Happens When We Stop Believing in God

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Kris P. Bacon, Jul 29, 2022.

  1. Kris P. Bacon

    Kris P. Bacon Newly Registered

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    There’s no point trying to prove whether God exists or not as it’s a belief. You can’t disprove a belief with facts and you can’t disprove a fact with beliefs. They’re two different things.

    What you can do is look at societies that banned religion and see what happened and there are no shortages of those in the 20th century. Russia, China, Cambodia, Vietnam … When the terror and mass graves ended all reverted back to religion.

    It’s not a coincidence that the atheists of yesterday are the same people that staffed the old Gulags and concentration camps, or that the organizations of FEMEN and secular humanists today are atheists.

    Even atheism is a belief and if we discard religion we’ll find something else to worship. From the sun to a pile of rocks that are said to have magical powers (Stonehenge UK) and onto current day materialism and psychopathic politicians that promise a paradise on earth, we will believe in something. Enter another politician promising to feed the world, or change the earth’s climate.

    This is not Sunday school or a religion, it is the hallmark of all wannabe and totalitarian societies. This is largely where the indoctrination you see around you today in the US stems from after eight years of Obamaism.


    It’s not a coincidence that the first target in all totalitarian societies is religion. The belief that gives hope and stops us from viewing politicians as Gods. It’s the foundation behind our culture, laws and morals. Every generation tries to change the world, but no generation has ever tried so hard to destroy their's than this one.
     
  2. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    I grew far, far, exponentially less authoritarian/totalitarian after I stopped believing in God. And my grasp of morality improved.
     
  3. Kris P. Bacon

    Kris P. Bacon Newly Registered

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    Christianity was never about authoritarianism/totalitarianism, it’s a choice. I’m glad to hear you’re enjoying your humanitarian utopia and its associated morals. It’s just that near everybody else is complaining about it.
     
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  4. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    The Bible's morality was ALWAYS about authoritarianism and totalitarianism. It didn't take a "utopia" to realize that slavery was wrong, executing children for the crimes of their ancestors is wrong, executing people for exercising their freedom of religion is wrong, executing people for exercising their freedom of speech is wrong. All of these sins are attributed to God in the Bible. My morals are based on logos and agape. I have yet to find any theistic religion that actually holds those values, except the Quakers. The Bible certainly does not.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2022
  5. bobobrazil

    bobobrazil Well-Known Member

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    25 yrs ago when i quit drinking i was introduced to spirituality, which is essentially recognizing we all have "god" within us, between self-less introspection (personal inventory) i believe i have gotten closer to the original christian concept than thru any organized church...
    i believe the christian church was corrupted away from its origins as early as 300 AD when the roman empire interjected its male dominated culture upon Christianity..and need i remind you that while religion was officially banned in soviet union, it still survives there PS i had a uncle who was a priest who got into church trouble constantly as a union supporter during the 1930s
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2022
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  6. Kris P. Bacon

    Kris P. Bacon Newly Registered

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    The Bible and religion is a choice. You believe and subscribe to its teachings or you don’t. It’s just that in societies that don’t bad things happen. If you believe you are God as is currently fashionable, or you morality is superior to the Ten Commandments that have lasted for two thousand years, then so be it.
     
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  7. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    So you are okay with murdering people for blaspheming your God? Yeah, my morality is superior to that terrorist garbage. So is the morality of your average kindergartner.
     
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  8. bobobrazil

    bobobrazil Well-Known Member

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    of course you are referring to organized religion as in a church, i believe martin luther had something to say about having to be "officially" led in the instruction of gods word 500 years ago you are confusing the church with god
     
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  9. bobobrazil

    bobobrazil Well-Known Member

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    there is truth in the innocence of a child and a quick google search will show you extreme christian church shouting and name calling from the pulpit, i believe THOSE churchs are the work of the devil for lack of a better term
     
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  10. Kris P. Bacon

    Kris P. Bacon Newly Registered

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    Religion is not about extremism and shouting from a pulpit, or selling the prosperity gospel. That's a man-made corruption.

    I’ve been to and lived in countries where religion was banned. They’re not nice places, any of them. The secularism we’re trying to create in the west is a copy of what those who went through the end result hope never returns. We’ve yet to learn that lesson.
     
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  11. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    You appealed to the 10 Commandments. The 10 Commandments say that blasphemy should be illegal (and also celebrates punishing people for the actions of their ancestors). Biblical law goes further and provides a legal punishment for violating said commandment: death. You can either believe the Bible or condemn extremism, but you can't do both. The Bible ADVOCATES extremism. No one here has advocated banning religion, so that's just intellectually lazy and dishonest. And, no, secularism isn't the same thing as banning religion. That's even MORE intellectually lazy and dishonest. You know what civilizations did ban freedom of thought? The ones you praise in your Bible.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2022
  12. (original)late

    (original)late Banned

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    We have separation of Church and State, or at least we used to.

    It's an integral part of our philosophy of governance. Which means we are nothing like the countries you mentioned.

    You see, totalitarian regimes have nothing to do with ideology, that's window dressing. They are all about power. If you want to see people like that here, look at Trump and his Death Cult.

    Atheists here, by and large, just want to be left alone, you see there is a lot of prejudice against people that can think. If violence comes you know where it's coming from, and who will be on the receiving end. Fascists are predictable.



    "They are in a position analogous to that of secularists who urge that research concerning the Nature, or the Will, of God does not get us anywhere. Such secularists are not saying that God does not exist, exactly; they feel unclear about what it would mean to affirm His existence, and thus about the point of denying it. Nor do they have some special, funny, heretical view about God. They just doubt that the vocabulary of theology is one we ought to be using." Richard Rorty
    https://www.marxists.org/reference/subject/philosophy/works/us/rorty.htm
     
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  13. bobobrazil

    bobobrazil Well-Known Member

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    i think the right over reacts as in their "war on Christians" i am a "spiritual" person but i cant deny i was raised catholic and that does have a residual affect i am sure, for that reason many people take children to church's, as somebody has to explain morality and such...i believe the "spirituality" comes later as we age and wish a more personal relationship with god
     
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  14. bobobrazil

    bobobrazil Well-Known Member

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    for myself, i had to realize that the old testament is the violent revengeful god, and the new is love, to put it simply
     
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  15. Kris P. Bacon

    Kris P. Bacon Newly Registered

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    Behind power is always an ideology. It’s what enables power to be achieved. Trump has a death cult? Not that I’m a great fan of his, but a death cult? Atheists do not want to be left alone, they’re the ones responsible for the mass graves that litter Europe.
     
  16. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    And I can see some nobility there, and I have few problems with Quakers, gnostics, charismatics, and others who base their religion more on personal experience than on textual extremism.
     
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  17. bobobrazil

    bobobrazil Well-Known Member

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    Stalin and Hitler were psychopathic individuals, i am not sure religion has much do do with them
     
  18. Kris P. Bacon

    Kris P. Bacon Newly Registered

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    Both athiests is the hint.
     
  19. Chrizton

    Chrizton Well-Known Member

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    It is just a matter of your doctrine I guess. I was raised in the Arminianist tradition that it is very possible for people to fall from grace i.e. forfeit their salvation and salvation is never assured. Others, particularly Calvinists, tend to believe that once you are saved you are saved for good. I have had Baptist in particular act like just because you got dunked in the water by a preacher, you got your first-class seat to heaven no matter what happens afterwards.

    Anyway, to each their own. I tend to me. Others can do and believe as they like.
     
  20. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    There is no evidence that Hitler was an atheist . . . and the Nazi party itself openly embraced theism and criticized atheism.
     
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  21. bobobrazil

    bobobrazil Well-Known Member

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    my religion is to treat others as i wish to be treated, and to do the next correct thing...that's my personal "bible" its not a big bible lol
     
  22. Kris P. Bacon

    Kris P. Bacon Newly Registered

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    Eventually, politicians will tell you what your beliefs will be.
     
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  23. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    And that's something I can get behind. It doesn't even require theism or atheism . . . just empathy and reason.
     
  24. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    As opposed to scriptures that have advocated slavery and murderous authoritarianism? It's telling that you can't imagine any means of thinking that doesn't involve authoritarian orders.
     
  25. bobobrazil

    bobobrazil Well-Known Member

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    religion has survived the USSR i dont believe people will march in lockstep to the idea of no god honestly most german ww2 soldiers were luthern the real nazis were a minority
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2022

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