What the logic behind not allowing military personal to be armed?

Can someone tell me why its a good idea to not allow our own military to be armed on base? I mean, if anyone is trustworthy with a gun its our boys in the armed services.

 

It is a catch 22, first, they say only the Police & Military should be Armed, however, the Military is not Armed except during War time in occupied combat zones, and Civilians are subject to regulations and restrictions on being Armed,
As such the Criminals never obey anyway.

 

Even at HQ ISAF (Afghanistan) while within the walls I had to pull the mags out of my weapons. Definitely no round chambered within the walls unless attacked. Yes it was stupid. At least I had my weapons and ammo with me, just not ready to go.

In CONUS, technically I was supposed to keep my weapons at the armory. That's kind of a gray area because my home was on base, so I kept my weapons at home. I think most people did that, even the commander. If you didn't have a house but were in the barracks you didn't have much choice other than to keep your personal weapons in the armory...which is where your duty weapons were stored anyway. Had a concealed carry permit for the state, no way could I conceal carry on base (federal jurisdiction vs. state).

These are just examples of how gun laws fundamentally work. The good guys are restricted, the bad guys do whatever they want. Believe it or not, there are plenty of liberals in the military who are fine with you dying per their orders, but don't you dare take the initiative to defend yourself and others. In fact, you can't even be immediately prepared to defend yourself and others.

 

Too true, sadly enough.

 

So there are no takers to defend the position that military personnel shouldn't be allowed to carry?

 

A bunch of officers get together and decide to overthrow the government. It kinda is hard to do that if they don't have weapons. It helps to ensure that civilians don't have to worry about immediate military interference in civilian govt.

 

How do you over throw a government while standing on a military base?

 

How do a bunch of officers do anything?

Individuals aren't allowed to carry on post but the officers can issue orders to open the armory and issue weapons and live ammo, so I don't think your answer is right.

 

They're not going to stay on the base, they would leave it by force. Get a bunch of people who know how to use weapons together and then use said military weapons to take civilian infrastructures.

 

Right, that's the situation now. But if that situation was different which is what I think the OP is getting at, and say that personnel on military bases were armed.

As for the officers, I don't see the officers doing this (unless they're weirdly power hungry), more likely it would be the NCOs and lower who say enough is enough and try to mutiny.

If that answer doesn't satisfy you, then making sure that weapons are tightly regulated helps prevent a black market from forming and having soldiers end up committing crimes using said weapons.

 

Lets suppose such a thing would happen. What's to stop them from going to the nearest gun store and do the same thing? I'm not saying military personnel should carry M16s with M203s attached to them. I'm saying that they should be able to carry a personal weapon.

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I'm talking about CCW on base, not carrying M249s.

 

Tell that to the nation of Mexico, whose military weapons are rightly regulated, but were still stolen my soldiers who deserted and joined forces with the various drug cartels.

 

I first came into the army in 1966 and then anyone could have their personal firearm with them if they lived on base in housing. Living in a barracks, one had to keep their firearm in the arms room. When I retired from active duty in 1986, that was still the case. So it was sometime after 1986 that the ban on carrying personal firearms was implemented.

I remember that sometime in the 1990's Ft. McPherson where I worked as a DA civilian then implemented the no personal firearms on base policy.

 

You do know the topic is military not being able to carry on base, don't you? Read the OP.

They are allowed to own firearms off base.

 

To the OP, because it is a pain in the neck. I was a 19K (armor crewman) in the army and any time weapons were drawn from the arms room it is a big routine. You have some sort of agenda every day. You might be practicing first aid and you have to babysit your weapon, you might be in an artillery simulator, might be pulling maintenance in the motor pool, when I was in, weapons were not allowed in the mess hall. Then you need to check your weapon into the arms room at the end of the day. Your typical day in garrison is used for training and dealing with your weapon in a classroom setting is a distraction and will burn some of the duty day babysitting it.

 

Weapons are under unit control. A company could issue arms pretty easily. Ammo is another thing. The only folks who have ammo on a military installation are the MPs.

 

It is more like why were the officers disarmed. The enlisted have pretty much always been restricted.

 

Yeah a bunch of officers are gonna take over the government with a couple .45's. lol.

What happens when the officers in charge of the armories where all the service weapons AND personal weapons are kept decide to get froggy?

 

I take it you've never been around the military or on a military base?

 

Nope, but I was at a civil war reenactment camp once.

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Not the officers, the NCOs and lower. Those are the ones this regulation is supposed to target.

What does froggy mean in this case?

 

Yeah, I know.

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Do you have an address in mind when I tell Mexico that because I'm going to send a letter. Also I don't have any stamps can I borrow one of yours and pay you back for it later?

 

So let's think about this happening one of two ways. The first is a massive wave from everyone all at once. The second one is one that is caused by a dedicated group. Not having weapons on person is supposed to protect against the first, not the second. The second one requires investigation by MPs. If everyone doesn't have a weapon on them, that gives the government time to organize a counter to the uprising. It's more of a first step maneuver.

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As was I. Don't discount the mere threat of violence, that's what is going to happen first before violence takes off.

 

Let's just say that military bases are big. Like really really big in some cases. Big enough to play with artillery, tanks, and bombs.

On Camp Pendleton it could take you an hour to get from one area to another in a car, from the front gate to say 64 Area.

You're not going to have a bunch of US soldiers try and take over a military base with some sidearms. Besides, why would they? You have to realize that people in the military aren't robots. They have spouses, kids, and friends....many of whom are civilians. With the penalties for such an insurrection, things would have to be truly dire and overwhelmingly in support of some kind of coup for it to EVER happen.

Even if they did attempt it, a few guys with handguns isn't going to do anything against the military on it's own turf.

Froggy means "jump", or in this case act on some kind of insurrection.

 

Back when I served during the Vietnam War era every Marines was issued a rifle and NCO's a .45 pistol. They weren't kept locked up in an armory but every Marine had access to his weapon 24/7. Usually the weapons were in a rifle rack that was sitting in the squad bay where they lived and slept.

Now access to ammunition was a different story. But I and most NCO's I served with went into Oceanside and bought a 50 round box of .45 ACP ammunition and a couple of 20 round boxes of .308's for our M-14's that we kept in our lockers just in case something you saw in the movie "From Here to Eternity" doesn't happen when a guard refuses to open up the ammunition magazine because there's no officer around while the Japs are bombing Schofield Barracks.

After my Nam tour of duty I was a Sergeant (E-5) and assigned to the 5th MAB at Camp Pendleton. It was in the summer of 1970. President Nixon's private residence (Summer White House) was in San Clemente and was butted up right next to the N/W fence for Camp Pendleton. Nixon always walked along the beaches of Pendelton, leaving the Trestles for the surfers and preferring White Beach that was about six miles further down the coast.

I was conducting a class on the radar becon that is used during a naval gunfire support mission so the navy ships could get their bearings. Maybe a dozen Marines, one Staff Sergeant, a few Sergeants all under arms carrying .45's and all the other Marines mostly Cpl's and L/Cpl's carrying M-14's. A few hundred yards up the beach there was a rifle platoon all under arms.

What do we see coming down the beach ? The CnC wearing a white dress shirt open at the collar wearing tan khaki bermuda shorts and black socks and black wingtip shoes with two Secret Service agents 50 feet behind Nixon.

Holly crap ! Do we come to attention and salute the CnC ? From what distance ? Should we be in formation or not ? The SNCO said it was my class, my call.

When Nixon got with in 150 feet we fell into formation. When Nixon was in 50 feet I ordered "hand salute" Nixon looked at us and nodded his head and continued down the beach.

Not once did the Secret Service asked the rifle platoon up the beach or our squad of Marines if our weapons were loaded or not. That's the way it was back then. The CnC trusted and respected those who served under his command and by showing us that respect we respected Nixon as CnC.

You don't see that today with the current CnC do you ?

But back then there was no such thing as a gun free zone especially on a military base. Gun free zones ona military base ? Back then you didn't have federal civilian police on military bases, the military has an excellent track record policing themselves.

As for personally owned firearms, if I remember correctly if you lived in military housing on base you kept your personal firearms in your home. If you were like over the 90% who lived in barracks back then you were suppose to keep your personal firearm at the company armory but those few who did have personal weapons and had a car kept them in the trunks of their cars.

 

1. Who says they're taking over the base?
2. Who says they have to take over the whole base?
3. There are plenty of examples of soldiers committing mutiny even though they have families. Just because a soldier has a family doesn't mean they can't try to overthrow the government.
4. Let's assume then its not about insurgents. How about controlling the local black market?