Why MLK was NOT Christian

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Warm Potato, Jul 26, 2020.

?

Do You Believe MLK was a Christian?

  1. YES

    15 vote(s)
    83.3%
  2. NO

    3 vote(s)
    16.7%
  1. Resistance101

    Resistance101 Active Member

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    Faith without works is dead.
     
  2. Resistance101

    Resistance101 Active Member

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    King was trained in communist training cells. NOTHING he did was Christian. Unifying people that are waging a 50 year old war to eradicate white people without an actual war has not been an accomplishment.
     
  3. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    King's best speech was the one about the Vietnam war.
     
  4. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Well, there are different definitions of faith being dead in this case.

    I think the question is whether one's faith has no vibrancy, no attraction, no real meaning or does it mean that faith without works means you are going to go to hell.

    Matthew 25:31 on seems to indicate that without walking the walk, the god of the bible will cast you out, regardless of your faith.
     
  5. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    OK, this is just plain ridiculous from top to bottom.

    War to eradicate white people? Sorry. MLK Jr was absolutely not opposed to white people. You're paranoid racism is showing.
     
  6. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Yes, that was impressive. But, the I have a dream speech still reigns supreme in terms of its leadership, aspiration, nonviolence, and unifying direction.

    America really lost a powerful leader. And, that leadership was moving to include all those poor and struggling.
     
  7. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    Hoover murdered him.
     
  8. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Also, I want to point out the problem with your comment on faith.

    In science, the answer is, "I don't know." Of coruse, that's not the end of it, as there has been significant work done. And, there are models coming from theoritecal physics and other branches where those studying these events show possibilities. But, when there isn't a full and supported answer, science has the humility to say, "I don't know." And, even when there is an answer from science, that answer may be changed by anyone who provides a superior answer based on evidence. After all, humans are not perfect.

    Quite to the contrary, religion ALWAYS claims to have the answer, no matter WHAT the question might be and no matter what the evidence might be.

    When there is zero evidence or even contrary evidence, religion has the supreme self pride to state that they have the answer, merely demanding that their answer be accepted on "faith". And, question that answer is deemed heresy and harshly rejected purely on the grounds of orthodoxy.

    Surely that self pride of religion is very closely related to man's original sin as described in Genesis in the story of Eden.
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2020
  9. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Are you saying Christ was a capitalist rather than a collectivist ?
     
  10. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

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    Why/Why not? That's the central point I'm asking, and for some reason, it still isn't a part of your answer.

    There is a difference between believing in the Christ and his position in the universe, and following his teachings. There are also many who consider trinitarianism to be necessary in Christianity (like the OP and many who want to reject Mormons). Similarly, there are many who believe different things about what Christ's teachings are (like Mormons or Christian Socialists). What if someone believed in a different Christ?

    I'm not so interested in which ones of those you believe are valid and which are not, but I am interested in what principle you think decides what is right, and why it should apply to anyone else.
     
  11. StillBlue

    StillBlue Well-Known Member

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    I said it earlier. For me to be christian, small c, you must adhere to his teachings. It does not matter if you are Buddhist, Muslim, Kimbangist or Pagan, if you adhere to the teachings of Jesus, even while being totally ignorant of his existence or even reject his existence, you are christian. If you are not christian then you can not be a Christian. Too many put faith in faith and not in deeds.
     
  12. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

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    I don't think that answers the question why. You say that to be a christian, you must adhere to his teachings, but you have given no indication why you have chosen that definition, rather than for instance a person who simply believes that the Christ exists (in the sense that the Bible mentions it) or some other definition.

    So, a Mormon might have a different understanding than you of what Christ's teachings are, would you say that they are right in saying that you are not a Christian, because you don't follow what they thing the teachings of Christ are?

    What is this about a small/big c christianity? I haven't reread the thread, but I would have thought this is all about big-C Christianity. What do you think that difference is, and why do you go for small-c christianity in response to posts where Christianity is consistently spelled with a big C?
     
  13. StillBlue

    StillBlue Well-Known Member

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    From a response to willreadmore

    Big C and little c is like Democrat, a member of a political party, and democrat, adherent to a political philosophy. A Christian claims a religious belief whereas a christian adheres to a lifestyle but not necessarily a religion.
     
  14. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

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    I don't think that answers the question why. You say that to be a christian, you must adhere to his teachings, but you have given no indication why you have chosen that definition, rather than for instance a person who simply believes that the Christ exists (in the sense that the Bible mentions it) or some other definition.

    So, a Mormon might have a different understanding than you of what Christ's teachings are, would you say that they are right in saying that you are not a Christian, because you don't follow what they thing the teachings of Christ are?

    I haven't reread the thread, but I would have thought this is all about big-C Christianity. Why do you go for small-c christianity in response to posts where Christianity is consistently spelled with a big C?
     
  15. Paul7

    Paul7 Well-Known Member

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    Unlike today's Antifa thugs and terrorists.
     
  16. Paul7

    Paul7 Well-Known Member

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    Yet science will not allow for the possibility of Divine involvement in our origins, despite the fact they don't know. That isn't science, it is dogma. There are plenty of things regarding religion that I am agnostic on, such as exactly how miracles were accomplished, and I don't particularly care.

    Is. 55:8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts,
    neither are your ways my ways, declares the Lord.
    9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
    so are my ways higher than your ways
    and my thoughts than your thoughts.

    Although Christians are agnostic about some things, yes, when God has clearly spoken on an issue and it is questioned that is heresy.

    Nonsense, see my above quote on what really happened in Eden. Satan used the same lie he uses today, "Did God really say.......?" We shouldn't put a question mark where God has put a period.
     
  17. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Of course Science allows for the possibility of divine involvement in our origins. Vat u know bout Science ?
     
  18. Paul7

    Paul7 Well-Known Member

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    LOL, just try and bring up Intelligent Design to a scientist. They'll bring up the chances of ID coming from another civilization in the universe, but not from God.
     
  19. Resistance101

    Resistance101 Active Member

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    Your ignorance is duly noted.
     
  20. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I am a Scientist - "Alien Intervention" is one possibility - there are others - some involving Godly intervention.

    Which would you like to discuss ? - I am presuming you want to argue for the possibility that "God did it"

    The floor is yours - unless you wan't me to go first ... I have a number of "God did it arguments" - not just one as there are many.

    First thing we need to do in such a debate however - is define God - or at least what would represent "God Like" powers.

    If some force is doing something - that led to our being here - and some entity is controlling this process and/or - had an input into the process - that led to our existence... to what degree did this thing exercise power - and what do we consider a "Godly Power" ?

    I will suggest this defn. - The ability to control matter / energy - through force of will - external to itself - its body - should it have one.

    For example - a human has the ability - through force of will - to manifest thought into physical reality - Proof - Look at your pinky finger - now wiggle it .. congrats - you have manifested a thought into physical reality.

    You only have the ability to manifest this thought throughout your body though - you can't make a chair move - unless of course you are Merlin.

    BUT - if you could make the chair move - through force of will - that to me would be getting into the "God-like Power" realm.

    That's my definition - feel free to come up with something different or alteration - once we decide on the definition - we can put forth some possibilities for God inspired intelligent design.
     
  21. Resistance101

    Resistance101 Active Member

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    Therefore, faith without works is dead. Takes both.
     
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  22. Resistance101

    Resistance101 Active Member

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  23. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  24. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    That's not dogma. Dogma is where a group has an answer. The answer from science is "I don't know" when the answer isn't known.
    ?
    There are Christian theologians who do not interpret the Bible as you do.

    You may see them as heretics. That's up to you, obviously.

    But, I'm not so sure that's justification for stating that they are all not Christians.
     
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  25. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    The reason that ID is rejected from science is that there is no evidence for it and no way of testing it. Science isn't designed to be capable of accepting solutions for which there is no evidence or testing capability.

    That limit is NOT just applied to religion. Science (experimental science, scientific method) also rejects string theory, multiverse theory and other ideas from theoretical physics for which there is an inability to test.

    And, no, science does NOT accept your panspermia ideas for the same reasons. Individuals may be more strident in rejecting religious solutions simply because religion is inheriently untestable (as the Bible states) while one could at least imagine developing evidence related to aliens.
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2020

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