Why would a CIVILISED nation permit large scale animal abuse, suffering, and killing?

Now, not sure about you, but I sort of like living in 2012, an age in which mass animal sacrifice, for 'satan', would no longer be seen as the actions of a mentally stable person, moreover, what modern and ethical society could pertain to oppose animal cruelty on one hand, by way of the fact that people get prosecuted for it...yet permit the systematic and mass cruelty to animals...passed off as a 'religous rite'.

Well, excuse me, the religous practices of a minority group, should never take priority over the law of the land, nor should our culture, who do not believe that your 'sins' can be absolved...by projecting them onto a chicken...have to accept such things, among us. Best way to deal with sinful ways? Don't do and support evil, how about that?

People want to carry out animal sacrifice, and god knows what else may be considered another 'ancient ritual', fine, you trot away and do that in a nation that hasn't moved on, how about that?

Kapparot ritual


Note.....Rather than this cultish animal sacrifice, it is entirely within Jewish law to replace it with money, instead.

As a substitute. For, you know, being a cruel person.

Judging by the numbers cited here, it would seem that most in Brooklyn don't want to pay the money, and would sooner go on with this ANIMAL SACRIFICE, which involves the sort of mass cruelty that would not be accepted, if carried out, by others.

[video=youtube;PccGaPRJB5k]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PccGaPRJB5k[/video]

 

In the Shulchan Aruch, Rabbi Yosef Karo discouraged the practice.

Rabbi Moses Isserles disagreed and encouraged Kapparot.

In Ashkenazi communities especially, Isserles' position came to be widely accepted. The late 19th century work Kaf Hachaim approves of the custom for the Sefardic community as well.

Some Jews also oppose the use of chickens for Kapparot on the grounds of Tza'ar Ba'alei Chayim (the principle banning cruelty to animals.)

On 2005 Yom Kippur eve, a number of caged chickens were abandoned in rainy weather as part of a kapparot operation in Brooklyn, New York; some of these starving and dehydrated chickens were subsequently rescued by the American Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals.

Jacob Kalish, an Orthodox Jewish man from Williamsburg, was charged with animal cruelty for the drowning deaths of 35 of these kapparot chickens.

In response to such reports of the mistreatment of chickens, Jewish animal rights organizations have begun to picket public observances of kapparot, particularly in Israel.

the U.S. Supreme Court decision in the case of the Church of Lukumi Babalu Aye v. City of Hialeah in 1993 upheld the right of Santeria adherents to practice ritual animal sacrifice with Justice Anthony Kennedy stating in the decision, “religious beliefs need not be acceptable, logical, consistent or comprehensible.

*wiki*

 

The idea is that in order to have religious freedom, you have to tolerate things that are offensive, disgusting and possibly even very morally objectionable.

I think the whole animal sacrifice thing is evil and ridiculous, but I'm a Christian, and once upon a time being a Christian was seen as evil and ridiculous. Come to think of it, it still is, in some places. For me to be assured of my ability to continue being a Christian, I have to put up with other people doing sick and twisted things.

Of course, you can still protest. No rule saying you can't let the world know what's being done and how it's wrong and see if you can't peacefully convince these people to stop slaughtering animals. I'm not aware of a group specifically dedicated to saving animals that are being sacrificed for religious purposes, but wikipedia.org has a list of organizations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_animal_rights_groups

 

I only watched up to 50th second, holding chickens like that by the wings is TORTURE. Jews or not, these people shall be exterminated off the face off the earth, and I mean it from my heart, wish I could say it out loud. I have chickens as pets, and when I handle them, I handle them with respect, like any other animal, and if I kill them you kill an animal with as little pain as possible. these are savage parasites wearing Jewish caps.

 

The Supreme Court is so full of (*)(*)(*)(*). Their decisions aren't even consistant, it's all based on politics. Just 3 years earlier, the Supreme Court of the United States, in the case of Employment Division v. Smith, 494 U.S. 872 (1990), held that the First Amendment does not protect Indian practitioners who use peyote in Indian religious ceremonies, even though that practice is much more reasonable than torturing and murdering animals. http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/42/1996a

 

But....you could then argue that slavery, killing someone for working on a sunday, or whatever else, is then a 'religous freedom'.

Sorry, but I simply do not think you can reconcile a civilised society, in 2012, with a culture living within in...that still engage in freaking animal sacrifice.

Same when I was speaking (same city, Brooklyn NYC), of the appalling 'freedom', that SOME Jews engage in, which isn't even a medical circumcision, albeit that would be bad enough. It is done by a Mohel. Come on now, imagine being brought into the world by PAIN, SADISM, the loss of a crucial part of your penis, AND some Mohel literally sucking on the penis. Even when it has caused death, disease, brain damage, it is allowed to go on...in the US.

There are charters to protect children from this, and the US and Somalia are the only two countries that refused to sign it.

Any group of sadists could then, in theory, do any (*)(*)(*)(*) thing, and pass it off as 'an important ritual'.

Sorry.

They want to live that way, go live somewhere in which it is acceptable.

It isn't in a sane society, imo.

 

Would it be hateful to point out that if said people, who are, after all, true natives, were the one's engaging in animal sacrifice(for the love of god, the ONLY people that act that way are monsters here!!), and if the Jews were using the Peyote, that the animal torture would be stopped, and the Peyote allowed?

Just wondering...

 

(*)(*)(*)(*) that's horrible, have animal rights activists done anything about it in America yet, or are they leaving it alone because it involves religion?

 

yep, amazing isn't it, we either support religious freedom or we don't

not to mention the fact that only Indian's can practice this religion, talk about trying to stop a religion from sharing with others, that is unconstitutional in and of itself

.

 

Hello PVM, hope this find you well.

I had never even heard of this utterly sick stuff before, when someone mentioned it to me, and that it was rife in NYC (250,000 chickens, yeah, they must have a lot of SIN to pass on, I suppose), I really thought they were having me on.

I am in Northern Europe, I am going to have to see if there is anything like this where I am, I am not aware of it, and I would really doubt it.

It is made all the MORE MACABRE by the fact that the person can simply pay a financial donation instread, but no no, you can see yourself, they ignore that out ball, and descended like freaking pirahannah. At least the fish would eat to survive. This is simply systematic torture, under the guise of a 'culture', and should be no more socially acceptable, then their monster Mohels, and the sheer sadism they inflict...on children.

And what does NYC do when several kids get Hepatitis, die, and get brain damage, from the procedure? Do they ban it? Do Christians and humanists rise up and say 'NO - THAT IS EVIL'?

No.

They remain silent.

And silence IS the very foundations for evil to remain alive. And prosper.

Again, rather than a non medical Mohel, often infested with disease, tearing and sucking the foreskin of babies that are, when you think of it AMERICANS(HELLO??? CHILD ABUSE???), there are alternatives. Yes there are. These Jews do not have to choose that way at all.

There are even reformist Jews that no longer circumcise AT ALL, and good for them, you see, animal sacrifice, sucking babies penises, all of those things, they do not belong in the today, the belong in the ancient past, before people evolved and grew.

I am sicking of people that fawn and make excuses for it.

Jack

 

But slavery and killing someone would violate the rights of another human being. Animal sacrifice only violates the rights of an animal.

Hmmm. The more I think about this, the more I find myself going over to the other side. Should animal rights trump religious freedom? Maaaaaaaaaaaaybe ...?

 

How many native Indians are US politicians?

How many have been part of the Senate or Congress?

How many Indian Corporations are there, donating billions of dollars, to buy both parties?

How many Indian major media corps are there?

What % of the US are est to be Native American Indian?

There are 1.7% Jews.

No.

No Jewish control, no continual exceptions made for Jews, right enough

Now.

Where did I put that tin foil hat, that someone is sure to post a pic of soon..

 

If you torured and killed 250,000 animals, despite being American, you would go to prison.

Special laws are protecting their sadism, esp when they can choose a money donation instead. If not special laws, then certainly, the FF wouild not have legislated for this VILE SATANIC PRACTICE, most likely.

However, let's stick with what you said there....

[video=youtube;3UFmF9Nm44M]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=3UFmF9Nm44M[/video]

 

Freedom to do what though?

Cause suffering and pain?

Engage in torture?

Be a sadistic and sick golum?

That, my friend, is not a 'freedom' one defends.

It is an evil that you pour scorn and contempt on.

 

Well, PETA are evidently trying, but expect them to be smeared, and you just know who is going to attack them most, yes?

Not Native Americans and their peyote.

PETA will, if they have not been already, portayed as 'like Nazi's'.

For hating torture of defenceless animals.

 

Maimonides: The Exceptional Mind (200
By Israel Drazin


Many Jews currently practice the kapparot ceremony on the eve of Yom Kippur. A fowl is waved counterclockwise around the head of a man or woman and words are recited requesting that the person's sins be transferred to the fowl. "This is my exchange, my substitute, my atonement. This rooster shall go to its death, but I shall go to good, long life and peace." The rite concludes with the slaughtering of the fowl."


"Originally, the ceremony was seen as a bribe that was offered to Satan, similar to the Azzazel bribe described in Leviticus 16. A rooster was chosen because (1) it was an animal that was not allowed to be sacrificed to God, and therefore an appropriate sacrifice for a devil and (2) the masses thought that this bird resembled Satan: it had horns like Satan and its feet resemble the demon's feet. The rooster was slaughtered with the sacrificial formality of laying of hands so that it would be accepted as a suitable sacrifice/bribe by Satan."


Page 197: http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=uUAsW…

 

Sure, it's a freedom you scorn ... but is it one you allow?

I gotta hand it to you. I'm starting to agree with you. But ... still uncertain.

 

I don't think that's actually true.

 

I am starting a religion that involves the murder of a blonde virgin every tuesday since it is a religion I will be fine to do whatever i want to.
FREEDOM.

 

There are creepy people living among us, what can I say...

 

Well, as far as I can establish, it's not permitted here in Europe.

Nor is that barbaric and often life damaging method of genital mutilation, by the Mohels.

Yet there are Jews in Europe. They seem to get by. The fact that they cannot torture animals, and let unqualified old men abuse their kids, doesn't really seem to harm them.

Don't forget, these Brooklyn Jews cannot hide behind the religous BS. Jewish law permits a money donation INSTEAD. Perfectly fair to do that. Instead of being a sadistic freak.

What is your most fav animal?

Think about you and your friends, walking down the street, and you see some people swinging it around their head, before brutalising it.

What do you THINK you should do?

What does your heart and mind tell YOU?

Jack

 

There is just no way a community that engage in routine child sex cover up's and mutilation would be ALLOWED here.

These things literally reek of some satanic type rituals.

 

Why is it not true?

 

I think the video you showed was taken in New York? which country do you live in?

 

I am British.

If we had a community that were engaging in animal sacrifice, like a bunch of freaks and satanists, the people would not turn a blind eye.

I know I wouldn't.

No WAY would I accept that stuff, if was born in NYC, and was not part of that sickness.