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Thread: Mitt Romney: ‘I’m not concerned about the very poor’

  1. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluesguy View Post
    The history clearly shows rates are the primary factor.
    oddly enough, I disagree with your interpretation of history.

    go figure.

  2. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by expatriate View Post
    oddly enough, I disagree with your interpretation of history.

    go figure.
    Then prove history wrong.
    ""What kind of society isn't structured on greed? The problem of social organization is how to set up an arrangement under which greed will do the least harm; capitalism is that kind of a system"
    Milton Friedman
    ."

  3. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluesguy View Post
    Then prove history wrong.
    I just need to point out the inadequate nature of your analysis. Attempting to suggest that a complex variable like federal tax receipts is the result of only one other variable is, on its face, ridiculous. There. That's all the proof I need.

  4. Default

    This one has wandered off into the ditch.
    ObamaTax Delendum Est

  5. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by expatriate View Post
    I just need to point out the inadequate nature of your analysis.
    I just need to point out your lack of any analysis or data to refute the empirical data posted which clearly shows during times of lower rates revenues soared.

    Lower Rate, Higher Revenue

    Capital gains tax revenues have increased in the three years since President Bush cut the capital gains tax rate, proving free-market economists right, and bureaucrats wrong. As Nobel laureate Milton Friedman often says, when you tax something you get less of it, and when you tax something less you get more of it. The "it" in this case is capital gains, which are the amount of money you make when you sell something for more than you paid for it.

    Capital gains have jumped because the rate reduction boosted the after-tax return on capital, reviving the stock market as well as unlocking longer-term gains that can now be realized with a smaller tax bite.

    The numbers tell an impressive story: In 2003, prior to the capital gains cut, the Congressional Budget Office was projecting capital gains tax revenues of $51 billion, $56 billion, and $62 billion respectively for the years 2003-2005, on capital gains realizations of $294 billion, $322 billion, and $350 billion. After the rate cut, the CBO predicted that realizations would be basically unaffected, and that therefore revenues would decline because of the lower rate.

    The actual numbers for those years were re leased by the CBO last week, and the opposite happened - revenues were significantly higher than predicted before the capital gains tax rate cut - in other words, it more than paid for itself. In 2003, the year the rate was cut, realizations jumped from a projected $294 billion to an actual $323 billion. In 2004 and 2005, realizations skyrocketed to $479 billion and $539 billion, versus pre-rate cut projections of only $322 billion and $350 billion.

    The dramatic rise in capital gains realizations fueled a corresponding increase in capital gains tax revenues - confounding the CBO model predictions. Cap gains revenues totaled $50 billion, $60 billion, and $75 billion in 2003, 2004, and 2005. Over those three years, revenues totaled $185 billion, $16 billion more than the CBO projected before the tax cuts even passed and a whopping $47 billion more than the CBO projected after the rate cut.
    http://www.nysun.com/opinion/lower-r...revenue/26951/
    ""What kind of society isn't structured on greed? The problem of social organization is how to set up an arrangement under which greed will do the least harm; capitalism is that kind of a system"
    Milton Friedman
    ."

  6. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluesguy View Post
    I just need to point out your lack of any analysis or data to refute the empirical data posted which clearly shows during times of lower rates revenues soared.
    logical fallacy:

    cum hoc ergo propter hoc

  7. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by expatriate View Post
    logical fallacy:

    cum hoc ergo propter hoc
    Prove it.


    Why 70% Tax Rates Won't Work

    Memo to Robert Reich: The income tax brought in less revenue when the highest rate was 70% to 91% than it did when the highest rate was 28%.

    "In short, reductions in top tax rates under Presidents Kennedy and Reagan, and reductions in capital gains tax rates under Presidents Clinton and George W. Bush, not only "paid for themselves" but also provided enough extra revenue to finance negative income taxes for the bottom 40% and record-low income taxes at middle incomes."

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...025762400.html

    And then tell do you support Obama's call for higher tax rates and why?
    Last edited by Bluesguy; Mar 04 2012 at 01:20 PM.
    ""What kind of society isn't structured on greed? The problem of social organization is how to set up an arrangement under which greed will do the least harm; capitalism is that kind of a system"
    Milton Friedman
    ."

  8. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by expatriate View Post
    oddly enough, I disagree with your interpretation of history.

    go figure.
    And where do you specifically disagree, what happened when rates were lowered and what happened when rates were raise. And was it repetitive?
    ""What kind of society isn't structured on greed? The problem of social organization is how to set up an arrangement under which greed will do the least harm; capitalism is that kind of a system"
    Milton Friedman
    ."

  9. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluesguy View Post
    And where do you specifically disagree, what happened when rates were lowered and what happened when rates were raise. And was it repetitive?

    who cares? correlation does not equal causation. capiche?

  10. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by expatriate View Post
    who cares? correlation does not equal causation. capiche?
    It does when they are directly related and repeatable.

    If I work longer hours and get paid more is just correlation or causation?

    Prove otherwise.

    http://www.heritage.org/research/rep...ower-tax-rates

    The Historical Lessons of Lower Tax Rates


    "There is a distinct pattern throughout American history: When tax rates are reduced, the economy's growth rate improves and living standards increase. Good tax policy has a number of interesting side effects. For instance, history tells us that tax revenues grow and "rich" taxpayers pay more tax when marginal tax rates are slashed. This means lower income citizens bear a lower share of the tax burden - a consequence that should lead class-warfare politicians to support lower tax rates.

    Conversely, periods of higher tax rates are associated with sub par economic performance and stagnant tax revenues. In other words, when politicians attempt to "soak the rich," the rest of us take a bath. Examining the three major United States episodes of tax rate reductions can prove useful lessons."
    ""What kind of society isn't structured on greed? The problem of social organization is how to set up an arrangement under which greed will do the least harm; capitalism is that kind of a system"
    Milton Friedman
    ."

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