In 2008 Obama was pro-Israel on the campaign trail, promising that their security was of utmost importance...... 'sacrosanct' he called it. After he was elected Obama has shown a systematic record of hatred toward this once great ally of ours. The Jedi-Mind tricks he pulled on the sheeple in 2008 have been exposed in this short 30 minute documentary. He will have a difficult time this upcoming week at the AIPAC conference and will bet his 2008 speech will be nothing like that of his 2012 speech........ if he in fact chooses to address the audience this year. Here's a good video just released exposing the Jekyll and Hyde attitude toward Israel found in this POTUS [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0wbH5KVPrPo"]Daylight: The Story of Obama and Israel - YouTube[/ame]
L Bo wrote: <<<Obama was pro-Israel on the campaign trail, promising that their security was of utmost importance>>>>> Is it possible that one day we will move on, based on knowing some facts beyond our beliefs and prejudices: eg, *The Prophet of Islam believed that the God Of Abraham (AKA 'Jehovah") was the One-True-God (AKA as Allah in Arabic). He even referred to *some* Jews and *some* Christians as being among the 'true believers', in the Koran. *The Old Testament is based on a bronze-age God given to promoting genocide on behalf of the survival of 'His chosen people'. (very self-serving, OTOH this was merely a reflection of bronze-age international relations). *Christ - a Jew - appeared some 300 years after the closure of the OT canon. (during which time Israel had been been subject to the successive Persian, Greek (Alexandrian), and then the Roman empire). Among Christ's contributions were 1. the Two Great Commandments (love God and love one-another, and 2. the Sermon on the Mount.(Note: History shows that these have been virtually totally ignored over the last 2 millenia). *An early Christian Church father, Marcion, noting the incompatibilty of Jesus' Father ("my kingdom is not of this world") with the OT God, worked to remove the OT from the scripture of the the new church, to be based solely on the New Testament. Marcion's position (despite the soundness of his proposition) eventually came to be regarded as heresy. My comment: Did The Prophet back the wrong God (a God of this world, and a God of war to boot)? *Fast forward: a formerly triumphant Islam was eventually overtaken by Christian (western) technology, a fact that is still not widely recognised/accepted or at least is strongly resented by the the Muslim world today (hence the Imam in Jerusalem refused any accomodation of Jewish interests in 1947). [*The Koran did not foresee the recreation of Israel by a now-triumphant Christian West (via the UN). {understandable, because Israel had ceased to be a sovereign entity in c.500 BC, ie, over a millenium before the Prophet's time}]. Imagine if the Iman in Jerusalem in 1947, recognising the Oneness of the the Jewish and Muslim Gods, had welcomed the Jews as brothers......but the reality of course is a very different - and human - story..... "Civilisation is a race between education and catastrophe" HG Wells.
The idea that the US has to support their occupation and ethnic cleansing of Palestine because of some sort of security concern is ridiculous. In fact, Israels acts are a refutation of fundamental US beliefs as well as foreign policy objectives throughout the region.
WillReadmore wrote: <<<The idea that the US has to support their occupation and ethnic cleansing of Palestine because of some sort of security concern is ridiculous.>>> ....and even though the Obama admin. blocked a recent (2011?) SC resolution condemning further illegal settlement activity, a resolution btw backed by the likes of Britain and France, Obama is still accused of being anti-Israel! Prejudice knows no bounds! "Civilisation is a race between education and catastrophe" H.G.Wells.
Absolutely. Obama has been a total toady to Israel. Even Bush43 was better, at least putting in place his "road map" that required Israel to remove settlements that even Netanyahu recognizes are illegal - not that Bush followed through in any way, sad to say. Obama has fully supported Netanyahu, and Netanyahu returned the favor by dumping on Obama - something Republicans have just sucked up like there was no tomorrow. I'd point out that AIPAC laughed in Trump's face. And, the American Jewish population is growing younger and is rejecting Zionism, ethnic cleansing, and apartheid as a direction.
Obama by no means "supported" Bibi, they have very diffrent views about many things, but that doesnt mean Obama was wrong. It a Palestinian trick to link Zionism with the military control in Judea and call it ethnic cleansing/apartheid, that's the main reason why we dont have peace because in your base you reject Israel by any borders - so what do we have to discuss about dwellings in Judea ? as long as you make it an ethnic war against Israel existance - that's exactly what you will get.
Obama gave them Iron Dome and $40 billion dollars in additional aid .. He wanted to stop expansion in the occupied West Bank.. and failed. Like many, including the J Street Jews, he wants peace and reconciliation in Palestine. Netyanhu is a belligerent, abrasive man.. Perhaps he will get along better with Trump.
Obama has maintained and even increased the level of US support for Netanyahu and Israel, shunning efforts to cause a negotiated settlement, protecting Netanyahu in the UN, and providing a level of military equipment support never before seen. If you think there is something more that Obama could do for Israel and Netanyahu, please state it. Yes, Obama is not in favor of what Israel is doing. Even the head of Mossad has stated that Israel's approach to Palestine is a national security problem for America. Your second paragraph is obvious nonsense. Israel has borders that have long been established. Saying things like "Judea" is irrelevant, as we don't set borders based on ancient times. Let's remember that over 130 nations recognize Palestine as a state and have relations on that basis, and the UN also recognizes Palestine, though not giving it full membership - ONLY because of the USA veto. And, you are WAY off base in suggesting you know JACK about me other than what I've posted. So, are you lying or is it just that you can't read to save your life???
The aid money has nothing to do with supporting Bibi, it's about the F35 project, no Israeli PM can stop it, it was decided a long time ago, the aid also got nothing to do with the settelments, these heavy weapons are not directed at the Palestinians, Israel borders are not affected by any aid, they were'nt before the aid and not now either. you think the aid is Israel helm to direct it as the US sees fit but it's not, not where it really matters. What Obama could have done ? he could have smiled, visited, supported by words and actions, stop the routine criticism on the settlemnets, he could have NOT blame Israel; for failed negotiations with the Pal, NOT critic every 2nd word out of our Gov, or he could have just shut up and let Bibi say and do as he pleases, but he didnt. You confuse the alliance Israel has with the US with supporting Bibi and his Gov, not by chance. Ah, NOW you refer to Israel as a risk to America not Bibi, stay home and hide under your bed as long as US is allied with us. Judea is the name of the place and Israel borders have been established with Jordan, all we have with the Pal is Oslo. Neat, can you show me a map of the 130 nations recognized Palestine ? Not a word there that didnt refer to what you said, you link Zionism with apartheid - you reject Israel whole presence and so you support the ethnic war and should accept its outcome.
It's still support for Israel. And, Israeli security concerns extend beyond West Bank and Gaza. Seriously? You think the US should be MORE supportive of ethnic cleansing??? The US is not in favor of ethnic cleansing now and we never have been. We haven't been in favor of that under ANY US president. Why would you suggest that as an option now? Israel demanded the right to continue stealing and destroying more property of Palestinian citizens DURING NEGOTIATIONS!! What makes you think that Palestine should have tolerated that as an activity going on during border negotiations? I said that the head of Mossad said that Israeli policy was a national security risk for America. And, he was right. Our fundamentals of rule of law (vs. law of the jungle), humanitarianism, commitment to borders, the rights of citizens, peaceful intent, etc. become garbage in negotiations when those we talk to can simply point to our support of Israel and proclaim our hypocrisy. More directly, terrorist groups point to Palestine as a recruiting tool against us. You can't do a simple internet search??? https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ountries-that-recognize-palestine-as-a-state/ Like I said, you don't know Jack about me. So, you create BS and suggest that your BS represents my position!! There are words for those who do that.
MGB ROADSTER wrote (in #6) <<<The ONLY ones that act ethnic cleansing are Arabs to other Arabs !! And that's a fact>>> I'm not impressed by the implied claim to moral superiority in the above quote. Remember that bigot who murdered his own peace-seeking PM (Rabin), based on OT claims to terroritory? I have already explained the error in such bigotry in my post #2. In 2016, Jordan does not equal Palestine. That's to be determined by the UN who facilitated the recreation of Israel. (Hint: the acquisition of territory by force is impermissible in modern international law). Lucky for you there is a similar strain of bigotry in the US body politic. But please don't claim moral superiority. .
Make up your mind, you said Obama supported Bibi and then that he will never support what Bibi is doing. I think your conspirecy webs are breaking. I know Jack about you, I repeat what you say, you should set your points strait and then argue them.
Where's Palestine map ? where do the borders go ? how does Gaza link with WB/Judea part ? I saw 135 countries recognize it, I'm impressed today as I was last week but still, what are it's borders that 135 countries recognize ? it's a simple question for a recognized country.
There are large numbers of disputed borders between nations. Here's a list of territorial disputes, most of which involve borders in some way. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_territorial_disputes Disputed borders is not preventative of statehood. Remember that the UNSC analyzed Palestine and rated it as qualifying as a state, and that without the US veto, Palestine would be a full member state of the UN, as the majority of the UNSC were in favor.
Yes - Israel has had our full support for many presidential terms. Don't confuse that with accepting as legitimate Israels stealing the possessions and land of Palestinians - or other aspects of the military occupation of West Bank or the last 8 years of continuous war on Gaza.
No because other than disputed borders you also have issues with civil law, economy and sovereignty between rival forces Hamas and PLO, these things must be solved if they want a country, so, with all due respect, screaming that they deserve a country does not mean they own one now and does not all depend on an Israeli retreat.
We dont have "your" full support obviously, Israel has the US support - exactly, and Obama detests Bibi and vise versa, see ? the world has many colors not just black and white. What you think about the Isr-Pal fued is irrelevant, you simply said something dumb out of anger. Palestine as a state - a real state not just a football team in the UN, must have Israel support and cooperation, economicly (I think its the most important aspect) the Palestinians were never better off as they were for a short period of time between 1968 - 1987, Jordan and Egypt can't help them , it must be throu Israel. do you have a faint clue now to why this peace idea doesnt work as long as you treat our existance as a crime against humanity ?
Early this year we saw the unified government formed by Abbas and joined by Gaza. It was predicated on non-violent means to statehood, the permanence of Israel, etc. It promised zero seats to current leaders in Gaza. Netanyahu worked hard to make that government fail. Now, you say it is important??? Also, Netanyahu has blocked the ability of Abbas to work in Gaza, a gigantic mistake if it is really of interest to reduce the Hamas there. By allowing Abbas to control border crossings, etc., Hamas can be marginalized. Instead, Netanyahu has worked to marginalize the leadership of Abbas in the issues related to Gaza. I really do not know of any action that Netanyahu has taken that isn't exactly what would be taken if he wanted to perpetuate the war. In fact, the present condition has him literally demanding that the war be continued with NO opportunity to even discuss the issue,. Living within borders, eliminating illegal settlements, recognizing rights of personal property, allowing a people to govern themselves - these are not issues of retreat. These are issues of recognizing globally recognized rights and identifying and ending crime up to and including ethnic cleansing.
Israel has my full support concerning existence and its rights as a nation. That does NOT mean I can tolerate any crime carried out by Israel. And, what Israel does DOES affect America - right down to me. If it didn't, then what would be the value of any security accord we have, or could have? I agree that the Israeli assault on Palestine's economy has been devastating. Withholding taxes, bulldozing businesses, refusing to allow exports, etc. - these have demolished the economy just as ethnic cleansing is stripping citizens of their possessions. It is Israel's behavior that is a crime against humanity - not its mere existence. Everybody, even Arafat, has agreed that Israel is permanent. But, yes, ethnic cleansing IS a crime. And, the economic assault is a crime as well. And, no, your economic assault on Palestine is NOT a justification for denying them statehood. In fact, it is a justification for demanding that Israel start recognizing Palestine - and ending its crime.
From what I know Hamas was suppoes to join PLO as another party not to merge into it, by keeping the same agenda I dont know where you got the "non-violent means to statehood", its not really a unification. If it's important or not you tell me, can you create a state with two heads ? How Bibi blocked that ability ? I know Abbas presence in the border crossings was one of the agreements after the last Gaza OP- a demand from Israel side, How did Netanyahu worked to marginalize the leadership of Abbas in the issues related to Gaza ?
Nice reply, the problem was and stil is that you speak "Westerner" and the real ppl we are dealing with speak Arabic, what you say is not what they think.
I too support Israel's right to exist however, I dont think that there has ever been a time when an Israeli government has been content to simply exist & live lawfully & within its legal boundaries. For example: "Our strategy was always to provoke the Arabs and get an appropriate response so we could attack and smash them". [Israeli General Moshe Dayan; diaries] “The State of Israel must must invent dangers and to do this, it must adopt methods of provocation and revenge.......and, above all, let us hope for a new war with the Arab countries so that we may finally get rid of our troubles and acquire more space.” “Moshe Sharett; Diaries” Contrary to our Zionist dominated Major Media Israel Started ALL its expansionist wars: “Begin’s Admission in 1982 That Israel Started Three of Its Wars” 
http://www.wrmea.com/backissues/0794/9407073.htm EXCERPT "“It was 12 years ago when Prime Minister Menachem Begin admitted in public that Israel had fought three wars in which it had a "choice," meaning Israel started the wars. Begin's admission came in a speech delivered on Aug. 8, 1982, before the Israeli National Defense College. His purpose was to defuse mounting criticism of Israel's invasion of Lebanon, which had begun two months earlier on June 5 and was clearly one of Israel's wars of "choice." The others were in 1956 and 1967.” CONTINUED And Sharon was complicit in a Kissinger negotiated "Arab Attack" in 1973 to grab MORE Arab Land: “Israel Busted Again” 
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2012/02/27/wikileaks-and-stratfor-israel-busted-again/ EXCERPT 
“The jist of it is that Kissinger had them pretend to go to war so that they could all secretly plot against Syria, whose army was destroyed.”CONTINUED The Israel/Palestine tragedy is quite simple: Foreign, Zionist Terrorist gangs invaded distant Palestine from Russia, Brooklyn England, Poland etc & with the near omnipotent clout of Zionist Lobbies in England & the U.S. forced their Colony on Native Residents & awarded 56 percent of Palestine to its 650,000 Jewish inhabitants, and 44 percent to its 1,300,000 Muslim and Christian Arab inhabitants. The U.N. was just a Colonial entity doing the will of the Zionist dominated, Colonial Governments. The book "Against Our Better Judgement: The Hidden History of How the U.S. Was Used to Create Israel” outlines in greater detail how America's powerful Zionist lobbies compelled US Politicians to ignore the voices of Regional Diplomatic & Military experts: “Against Our Better Judgment: The Hidden History of How the U.S. Was Used to Create Israel” https://www.amazon.com/Against-Our-Better-Judgment-History/dp/149591092X REVIEW EXCERPT "Prodigiously documented... Alison Weir must be highly commended for throwing such a brilliantly hard light on the relationship between the United States and Israel. I hope this marvelous book gets all the attention it deserves." - Ambassador Andrew Killgore, Publisher, Washington Report on Middle East Affairs. (*)Soon after WWII, US statesman Dean Acheson warned that creating Israel on land already inhabited by Palestinians would "imperil" both American and all Western interests in the region. Despite warnings such as this one, President Truman supported establishing a Jewish state on land primarily inhabited by Muslims and Christians. Few Americans today are aware that US support enabled the creation of modern Israel. Even fewer know that US politicians pushed this policy over the forceful objections of top diplomatic and military experts. As this work demonstrates, these politicians were bombarded by a massive pro-Israel lobbying effort that ranged from well-funded and very public Zionist organizations to an "elitist secret society" whose members included Supreme Court Justice Louis Brandeis. AGAINST OUR BETTER JUDGMENT brings together meticulously sourced evidence to illuminate a reality that differs starkly from the prevailing narrative. It provides a clear view of the history that is key to understanding one of the most critically important political issues of our day." CONTINUED The US & British Zionist lobbies were as influential in the early 1900s as they are now. The unfortunate Arabs who lived up to their agreement with the British government were simply betrayed due to the machinations of the British Zionist Lobby & have been cheated, slaughtered & robbed ever since. The Arabs had no reason to cede their land & authority to the U.N. just as they are within their rights to resist the oldest & most ruthless, genocidal, foreign funded Occupation in modern history. It's that simple but members of the Israeli Hasbara network need to obfuscate the simple truth by blaming the Arabs for not meekly submitting to blatant Zionist Genocide, Land Theft & relentless persecution. I think that Obama had the intention of creating a more balanced Mid East Policy but was effectively stonewalled by the same craven "Israel First" Politicians & their AIPAC Masters that confronted the top diplomatic and military experts who recognized both the inequity & strategic pitfalls of imposing a terror based Zionist State on land primarily inhabited by Muslims and Christians. The One-Sided & parasitic nature of this unholy US - Israeli alliance can best be summed up by the 2 following quotes: “Our American friends offer us money, arms, and advice. We take the money, we take the arms, and we decline the advice.” Moshe Dayan http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/m/moshe_dayan.html "Once we squeeze all we can out of the United States, it can dry up and blow away." Binyamin Netanyahu. http://web.archive.org/web/20060512...pecial_Reports/092105Madsen/092105madsen.html
